Is a soft hairline possible yet?

[BobbyZ36]

Hi everyone. I had a transplant over 5 years ago just to my hairline and everything looks good... density, direction of hair, hairline pattern...EXCEPT for the "hardness" of the hairline.

 

By hardness I mean that the hair is just not fine enough to look natural. I remember posts years ago (when I used to frequent the boards)that doctors were experimenting with neck and/or body hair for the hairline as this hair was finer. Has this become common practice? If so, which docs have perfected this? I noticed Ron Shapiro's hairlines looked very good, so I assume he's doing something with finer hairs. Anyone?

[Janna]

Hi BobbyZ36,

 

Dr. Ron Shapiro has been creating natural hairlines for many, many years and he's given countless lectures and surgery demonstrations for as long as I've worked for him.

 

In a given harvested strip, there are certain number of fine, avg, and strong strands of hairs. We pick out the fine hairs to be planted in the very front in the correct angle and direction to get the results we do. We are very careful with the hairline and rightly so since it's the first things you see when you look at someone's head of hair.

[BobbyZ36]

I appreciate the responses but neither of you answered my question. Do any doctors use neck or body hairs for hairlines?

 

I understand hair characteristics play an important role. My hair is very thick in the donor area and yes my surgeon did try to use my finer hairs for the hairline. The problems is, my thinnest hairs still do not look natural at the hairline.

 

So..do any docs use finer hair not from the donor area? And if the answer is no can you Jana or Spex give me your respective doctors reason as to why? Appreciate the help.

[Leeson]

Dr. Umar uses nape(neck) and leg hairs(patient sofarsogood on hairlosshelp) on the hairline, your choice.

[Janna]

As far as I know, I don't know who's using body or neck hairs for the hairline. Body hairs don't have the same growth cycle as the hairs on the head. One of the reasons why body hair transplant is risky and you see lower growth from them. By neck hairs I'm assuming you mean just above your nape in the back of your head - those hairs maybe finer but they are not in the safe zone and they may fall out.

[TheEmperor]

Originally posted by BobbyZ36:

I appreciate the responses but neither of you answered my question. Do any doctors use neck or body hairs for hairlines?

 

I understand hair characteristics play an important role. My hair is very thick in the donor area and yes my surgeon did try to use my finer hairs for the hairline. The problems is, my thinnest hairs still do not look natural at the hairline.

 

So..do any docs use finer hair not from the donor area? And if the answer is no can you Jana or Spex give me your respective doctors reason as to why? Appreciate the help.

 

I have seen patients with thick donor hair that have the problem you describe. I think that both Dr. Umar and Dr. Cole incorporate finer nape and body hair into their FUE procedures.

[Leeson]

Dr. Cole incorporate finer nape and body hair into their FUE procedures.

 

Emperor,

do you not like Bobbyz36?

[CuriousJungleGeorge]

I imagine using body-hair for the hairline would be bad because of its own length and texture. As for neck-nape??“hair, I believe it's in a region not immune to balding.

[BobbyZ36]

I can't believe this issue doesn't get more attention. In my opinion it's the single biggest problem with transplants today.

 

I would think nape of neck hair is the solution for most. Yes I understand it's been said that this hair is not totally immune to DHT and may fall out later, but I've yet to see concrete proof of this. I've never seen a study about this subject... and I also have made a point to look at the neck of balding men over the past few months and I've yet to see one who has lost this neck hair.

 

Are there other threads discussing this subject? I did a search but couldn't find anything. Thank you.

 

* I apologize..I just saw the reply stating Dr.Umar and Dr.Cole use neck hair. Now my question is..if they do..why doesn't Shapiro or H&W? Are they just behind the curve?

[Sonia]

I agree that this is THE problem with people with thicker hair. Especially in those that will end up losing their nape hair anyhow. Transplanted hairlines usually look better when you have finer hair, especially when you are a woman. Hopefully when they start cloning hairs they will be able to make fine hairs.

[TheEmperor]

Originally posted by BobbyZ36:

I can't believe this issue doesn't get more attention. In my opinion it's the single biggest problem with transplants today.

 

 

I'm on the other side of the fence. I have fine hair, although even though my density is not great, I'm thankful that the transplanted hair looks natural in hairline.

 

Talk to the best doctors about your options. I think there is more to it than just using the finest hairs. Umar might be the ticket for you. He will transplant just about anything.

[Cam Simmons MD ABHRS]

Originally posted by BobbyZ36:

... I would think nape of neck hair is the solution for most. Yes I understand it's been said that this hair is not totally immune to DHT and may fall out later, but I've yet to see concrete proof of this. I've never seen a study about this subject... and I also have made a point to look at the neck of balding men over the past few months and I've yet to see one who has lost this neck hair...

/QUOTE]

 

Hi BobbyZ36

 

I think it is fair to say that most men don't lose a lot of hair from the nape of their neck but some do. Especially for young men, it is hard to predict who will keep their neck hair and who will lose it.

 

This is a photo of a man in his 50s with a Norwood 7 pattern of hair loss. He has had Retrograde Alopecia, which is fairly common for men with a Norwood 7 pattern. Retrograde Alopecia is recession of the hair from the neck up. It is easy to see that if he had had nape hair transplanted into his hairline 10 or 20 years ago, there wouldn't be much left now.

 

It is also interesting to note how low his hairline has receded in his crown. I have seen photos in this forum of patients, who seem to be in their 20s or 30s, who have had FUE grafts or even strips taken from higher than this.

 

The safe zone is well-described in our medical literature but it is probably easiest to describe as the fringe of hair you would be left with if you developed a Norwood 7 pattern of hair loss, like this man. If you take grafts from above or below the safe zone, the hair in those grafts could disappear later and scars could become visible (whether produced by strip removal or FUE.)

 

As the hairline is critical, most doctors want to create a natural-looking hairline that will last by using scalp hairs from the safe zone.

 

I hope this helps.

[BobbyZ36]

Ok...so the question is... Are docs just not using nape hair because there is a risk it will fall out or do they think it won't look better at the hairline?

 

If it is shown to look better at the hairline, and the particular doctor thinks there is no chance of his/her patient progressing, lets say, past a NW4..shouldn't docs defintely be giving patients this option?

 

I'm a NW2-3, 40 years old, with extremely slow hairloss and a family history of noone more than a NW3. In my opinion, the chance of me losing my nape hair is minimal to none and a risk I'm willing to take.

 

Here's another way to look at it. If Shapiro/H&W/others can create very good hairlines now..what would be wrong with one of these doccs creating one of their good hairlines..but then go a step further and make it awesome by adding nape hair? What's the risk? That the nape hair will fall out eventually and just leave their original good hairline. Seems like a no brainer to get the finer nape hair too. I'd love to hear from Janna as to why Dr. Shapiro wouldn't be open to trying this. Or..from any doc on the board willing to chime in. thank you.

[TheEmperor]

Originally posted by BobbyZ36:

Ok...so the question is... Are docs just not using nape hair because there is a risk it will fall out or do they think it won't look better at the hairline?

 

If it is shown to look better at the hairline, and the particular doctor thinks there is no chance of his/her patient progressing, lets say, past a NW4..shouldn't docs defintely be giving patients this option?

 

I'm a NW2-3, 40 years old, with extremely slow hairloss and a family history of noone more than a NW3. In my opinion, the chance of me losing my nape hair is minimal to none and a risk I'm willing to take.

 

Here's another way to look at it. If Shapiro/H&W/others can create very good hairlines now..what would be wrong with one of these doccs creating one of their good hairlines..but then go a step further and make it awesome by adding nape hair? What's the risk? That the nape hair will fall out eventually and just leave their original good hairline. Seems like a no brainer to get the finer nape hair too. I'd love to hear from Janna as to why Dr. Shapiro wouldn't be open to trying this. Or..from any doc on the board willing to chime in. thank you.

 

I would pursue this privately with chosen doc. If a doctor suggested that you take a calculated risk, he would come under all manner of fire in the forums, when it actually may be the best option for you.

 

My feeling is that if you already have a "good" hairline, that using nape hair is not all that risky with FUE. If it falls out 20 years from now, what have you lost? You certainly dont want to take a strip from that region.