Jase Norwood, New and seeking some help

[jase_norwood]

Hi Everyone...

 

I've been reading a lot in these forums and have finally decided to upload a few pics to get some suggestions. I am 23, and have been thining gradually for a few years, although it seems to have plateaued, hopefully not just for a while!! I've been on propecia since January and hoping this will help what I've got left to grow back thicker on the next cycle (?)

 

I am greatly considering returning to Dr. Wong for a second consult, now that it's a couple years later and I'm on the Finast. Also seriously considering making the trek to Dr. Shapiro in Minneapolis, his clinic's results seem excellent, or Cooley in Carolina.

 

So here's some pictures. Lemme know what you think as to what is required if this is truly where it will start from...

 

 

 

[jase_norwood]

Hi Everyone...

 

I've been reading a lot in these forums and have finally decided to upload a few pics to get some suggestions. I am 23, and have been thining gradually for a few years, although it seems to have plateaued, hopefully not just for a while!! I've been on propecia since January and hoping this will help what I've got left to grow back thicker on the next cycle (?)

 

I am greatly considering returning to Dr. Wong for a second consult, now that it's a couple years later and I'm on the Finast. Also seriously considering making the trek to Dr. Shapiro in Minneapolis, his clinic's results seem excellent, or Cooley in Carolina.

 

So here's some pictures. Lemme know what you think as to what is required if this is truly where it will start from...

 

 

 

[Bill - Seemiller]

Hi Jase and welcome to the forums.

 

From the looks lf it, you still have a good amount of hair left, but the majority of those are thinning and on their way out. You could very well end up a NW6.

 

Being that you've only just started Finasteride in January, I'd give it another 6 months minimum before taking the plunge into surgery. Then IMO, you should go for the largest megasession possible. If you can get 5000+ grafts, I'd personally opt for coverage of the entire balding area, however if you get less than that, you may want to consider hitting the front half of your scalp and later going back to do the back half. Most like you will end up needing 6000-7000 grafts to help you achieve a relatively full look.

 

I realize you are younger and typically I don't recommend such radical surgery for a young person....BUT...this is one of those situations, that because your hairloss pattern is already pretty well established, I don't see any harm in moving forward if you plan correctly. Typically the major precaution for younger people who want to get surgery is "hairloss is unpredictable" you MIGHT lose more. In your case, if you go for coverage and get a large megasession, even if you do lose more, ultimately you will still have more hair than you do now and end up with a net gain that is much more cosmetically pleasing.

 

I hope this helps.

 

Bill

[Guest youngguy24]

Jase,

 

Hey I'm on the same boat as you. I'm 25 and have diffuse thinning in the areas of a Norwood 5. Lucky for you Propecia can work great for young men like us. You also live in Vancouver so you are close to the H&W clinic which has two of the best HT surgeons the world can offer, imo.

 

Bill,

 

Do you think Jase hair loss pattern is well established at age 23? I would think that he would loss a quite a bit more hair as he ages. Are diffuse thinners patterns established earlier than those who lose in the crown and have receiding hairlines? If his gentics would cause him to become a norwood 7 do you think Propecia could prevent this?

[Bill - Seemiller]

youngguy,

 

Good question. I do believe his hairloss pattern is established, but that doesn't mean he won't lose more hair. Without medication, I believe he will lose almost all of the hair on top of his head leaving him a NW6. So even if he proceeded now with surgery and went for a megasession of coverage over the large area...even if he loses more hair, he will still end up with more hair than he has now and be more cosmetically pleasing.

 

I don't want to give the impression that I can predict whether or not he won't become a NW7...especially since I haven't seen him in person. Hairloss, after all, is unpredictable. I should definitely add that seeing a doctor for a consultation is DEFINITELY the best thing to do to determine the course of action.

 

But generally speaking, diffuse thinners hairloss pattern is easier to predict because the hair all over the top of the head in the hairloss area will show scalp. Notice how his sides are still high and thick in appearance. In the back, you can see a slight dip down of thinner hair just as NW6s have (like myself).

 

I hope this helps clarify.

 

Bill

[Bill_the_bald]

Bill,

 

Do you think Jase hair loss pattern is well established at age 23? I would think that he would loss a quite a bit more hair as he ages. Are diffuse thinners patterns established earlier than those who lose in the crown and have receiding hairlines? If his gentics would cause him to become a norwood 7 do you think Propecia could prevent this?

 

 

Yeah, I was wondering about the same thing too the moment I saw the age "23". I would think by the time Jase reaches 33, all the hair on his frontal 1/3 and midscalp would be gone! Of course, by then Hair Multiplication will probably become a reality so he can get back his original mop of hair, provided he has a big enough checkbook.

[MrJobi]

I agree with Bill

 

Based on the significant hairloss at only 23, he will most likely go to a NW7 or so although nobody can be sure.. The propecia will be a key tool for him ..

[hairbank]

Hi jase-

 

Thanks for posting particulars.........make's it so much easier to help you. Sorry to hear of your predicament at such a young age. Your loss looks like mine two years ago before any HT's but it took me much longer to get there (I was 38).

 

Bill has a good point. I wouldn't worry about native hair if I were you as you can clearly see it's mostly all on the way out. If I were in your shoes, I'd consult with all the Docs you mentioned to see what they recommend, but, as long as you have sufficient donor hair, I'd get as many as I could at one time...............at the same time realizing that you could hit NW 6 or 7 and to plan conservatively on placement.

 

Best of luck..

[jase_norwood]

Thanks to everyone for the feedback.

 

Is it really probable that the native hairs "on their way out" will still go in spite of the Finasteride? I'm also considering adding minoxodil to my regimen, is that wise in my case?

Bill, I see you're reccommeding a megasession, is that because your HT with Dr. Hasson was what you'd consider the most successful so far?

 

I know patience will be important, and I'm not planning to rush this big decision.

In regards to the devolpment of hair cloning Bill, I don't think I have a lifetime to wait

[hairbank]

Jase-

 

No crystal ball predicting if Fin or Minox will help you keep the native hair. I'd plan your HT like it will be gone. If you go to a quality Doc where transsection concern isn't an issue, they can hang around as long as possible!

 

I won't put words in Master Bill's mouth about megasessions but will advise you from my own experience. Given the right scenario, a mega session can:

 

<UL TYPE=SQUARE><LI>Save you money - Usually, there pricing discount from around $4.50 per graft to $2.50 per graft for anything above 2000 grafts at most clinics<LI>Healing/growth time - versus getting 3 or 4 sessions of 1000-1500 grafts, you could receive as many as 3000-5000 (or more) grafts in one session. You could accomplish in 1 year (surgery and growth) what might have taken you 3-4 years

 

 

Of course this assumes you have the donor hair available which can be determined by your surgeon or consultant. I consider my mega session with Dr. Wong "most successful" because the quality of work was great and I received 3x the number of grafts as my first HT. Better than going back in the chair 3 more times for the same results.

[Bill - Seemiller]

Jase,

 

My reason for recommending a megasession for you is based on your individual case, not my own experience. There are times where megasessions are warranted and there are times they are not. Typically, the more hairloss one has, the more reason a megasession will be warranted. Given the level of hairloss that you have, you will need approximately 5000 grafts or so to give you a relatively full appearance. That's assuming that you don't lose more hair. But planning for the worst...you most likely will...so when all is said and done, you probably need at least 7000 grafts over the course of your lifetime to give you a full look. There really is no other way for a diffuse thinner, especially at your stage of loss IMO. You could get a 2000 graft session to dense up the front 1/3 or your scalp...but then the back 2/3 of your scalp will be close to bare.

 

Your other alternative, if you don't want to do a megasession is to get several surgeries of smaller sessions over the years. This is a fine option too...but as hairbank said, you'll end up spending more money and the time it takes to accomplish this will be longer.

 

I hope this helps clarify.

 

Bill

[nobuzz4me]

Jase,

 

Can you expand on your first consult with Dr.Wong. I am assuming he turned you away because you were either too young or not a good candidate for HT.

 

Your hairloss and thinning is very advanced at such an early age. You may end up NW6 at minimum and very possibly a NW7. If that happens and your donor area is not dense, you would not be a good candidate for HT.

 

Wait another year or two to see if the finasteride helps. Do not jump into the chair yet, do some searches on doctors websites showing NW7 patient photos. You will not find many since they are not good showcase patients and a many doctors will turn away NW7's.

 

I do hope for your sake you only go NW6. Since it cannot be predicted I would not chance it, you will spend a lot of money and time, have donor scars and may still end up not satisfied.

 

The good thing you have going for you is that you are young. When better treatmant options come in the future, you will be young enough to take advantage of it!

 

 

Good luck,

[JW]

Jase:

 

I haven't posted in a while but let me throw in my two cents. Two and a half years ago, I was a Norwood 5/6. I was referred to as "bald" by people. I had a large baldspot in my crown and essentially no hair in front. I began taking Propecia in January 2005. By September 2006, I grew back the hair in my crown. It is not thick teenager hair, but it is cosmetically significant hair. I got a transplant of 2800 grafts placed in the frontal third of my scalp from Dr. Cooley in September. I am about 7 months post-op and I am ecstatic. By using Propecia and getting the transplant for the front, I now have hair all over my head. Just this week I had a chance meeting with a woman that I hadn't seen in over 20 years. See complimented me on how good I looked. She made a comment about me still having all of my hair. I almost choked. If she had seen me 2 years ago she would have been looking at a bald man. My advice is stick with the Propecia for another year and see how much hair you get back with Propecia. Then get a transplant with Dr. Cooley, Hassoon and Wong, Shapiro or another Coalition surgeon. Propecia and a HT with the right doc will change your life. It has changed mine.

 

I will post an update with some photos soon.

[MrJobi]

Hi

 

I will add to the great feedback the others have provided.. regarding your hairloss and graft number I estimate you will need more than 5000 fo rthis reason .. Bill had similar loss to you, but yours is a bit more extensive.. Judging by your current state ( no Propecia ) I'd say you'd need about 6500 -7000 for full coverage..

 

that's my opinion

[Bill - Seemiller]

Bill had similar loss to you, but yours is a bit more extensive

 

Actually...I had more loss than that...I just started getting surgeries before it got that bad. All my native hair (with the exception of a few tufts or strands in the middle of my scalp) is gone in a full NW6...with the exception of the area below the crown that is thin but hanging on thanks to Finasteride.

 

That being said...he obviously started losing hair younger than me (which I understand why everyone is concerned that he may end up a NW7). As I've stated in other postings, the earlier you start losing hair, the greater the risk that you will lose a greater amount of hair. According to the pictures, the current pattern does seem to be pointing to a NW6 with no indication of a NW7...however, everyone is right....he is still young, so we simply don't know. Best to get evaluated by a doc to see what he/she has to say...not that they too could predict hairloss...but at least might be able to give a better idea.

 

Bill

[nobuzz4me]

Bill,

 

Hard to tell from the photos but I suspect your donor is/was more dense than his, donor supply is something we cannot predict online, guys are throwing out graft numbers which may or may not be accurate or attainable. Donor areas thin some with age too, I know mine did. He needs to go see the doc in person. I would like to know what Dr. Wong had to say in his first consult.

[Bill - Seemiller]

Nobuzz,

 

You are 100% correct. You cannot tell from pictures exactly how thick a donor area is, but it does appear maybe a little less dense than mine.

 

The numbers I have thrown out are numbers I believe he would need to achieve good coverage and density...however, I'm glad you brought up the pont of possibility. He may simply not be able to achieve those numbers...it's up to the doctor to determine that. Thanks for bringing that up.

 

Bill

[nobuzz4me]

Thanks Bill,

 

I think we vets have an obligation to let those seeking advice, especially at a young age, that they may not be good candidates.

 

Giving graft estimations are of course helpful in letting them know what they may expect in terms of cost and planning for. As you know, the donor is so key to proceeding with HT.

 

My guess here is Dr. Wong felt that either age or thin donor with advanced loss were factors for them not proceeding. Best hope is Fin maybe?

[Bill - Seemiller]

nobuzz,

 

I agree wholeheartedly. Not sure why Dr. Wong turned him away...my best guess is age at the time. He is still young, but if he has been on fin for a year, I'd be curious to see what Dr. Wong tells him now.

 

Bill

[hairbank]

Originally posted by JW:

Jase:

 

I haven't posted in a while but let me throw in my two cents. Two and a half years ago, I was a Norwood 5/6. I was referred to as "bald" by people. I had a large baldspot in my crown and essentially no hair in front. I began taking Propecia in January 2005. By September 2006, I grew back the hair in my crown. It is not thick teenager hair, but it is cosmetically significant hair. I got a transplant of 2800 grafts placed in the frontal third of my scalp from Dr. Cooley in September. I am about 7 months post-op and I am ecstatic. By using Propecia and getting the transplant for the front, I now have hair all over my head. Just this week I had a chance meeting with a woman that I hadn't seen in over 20 years. See complimented me on how good I looked. She made a comment about me still having all of my hair. I almost choked. If she had seen me 2 years ago she would have been looking at a bald man. My advice is stick with the Propecia for another year and see how much hair you get back with Propecia. Then get a transplant with Dr. Cooley, Hassoon and Wong, Shapiro or another Coalition surgeon. Propecia and a HT with the right doc will change your life. It has changed mine.

 

I will post an update with some photos soon.

 

That's a great post, JW-

 

You never know how someone is going to respond to Fin but in this case, you save yourself needlessly transplanting grafts in the crown which tends to swallow them up anyway. Thanks for posting this because many pre-HT types need to hear it. If I had it to do over again, I likely would have started Fin at least 1 year before any HT's to see what success I might have had.

 

Jase- this makes a good argument for you to try Fin for awhile to see how you respond.