THE TRUTH

Yeah man don't bother with Linkov...

I know he used to work under Epsein but never seen much from him. 

Dude spends a lot more time on youtube than in the operative room 😂 

And make sure you get on oral medication asap !

Finasteride/Dutasteride are your best bets. You don' want to continue losing more hair and your crown dropping into Norwood 6-7...

Good luck

Classic hairmill bro. Do not risk it. 

As a general rule of thumb, any clinic whose name begins by Este is a hairmill.

Estepera, Estenove, Esteworld etc....all hairmills. 

You are playing russian roulette ! Huge gamble ! Be careful. I will be honest Your hairloss is very advanced and you cannot make a mistake at this stage.

I know sometimes some people are lucky and get good results from Cinik, Serkan, Vera etc... but this is relatively rare and given your current hairloss I don't think it's worth the risk.... 

Only clinic I recommend to people in Turkey is Dr. Bicer. She is not elite but she does solid work for a fair price and has one of the best post op care in the industry.

Some other decent budget  options are Demirsoy, Gur, Turan even though probably a bit overhyped recently on this forum. 

You have advanced hairloss already. What is your ultimate goal ? 

If your goal is to just get some baseline coverage and a decent hairline for a fair price then I think Bicer is the way to go. 

She might not be the best but she does deliver and at least she won't botch you. That's for sure.  

Otherwise if you're looking to get as close as possible to the illusion of full head of hair then YOU HAVE TO TRY TO GET IT RIGHT FROM THE FIRST TIME. As much as possible...

The TRUTH is no surgery is guaranteed and even the best docs have crap results. 

But if your goal is to get as close as possible to the illusion of full head of hair then 

I would look into Tsvetalin Zarev, Pitella, Hattingen Hair, Pradeep Sethi, Dr. Wong, Dr. Konior or a 3-step strategy with Pinto, Couto, Bisanga, Feriduni, Ferreira, Ximena, Heinecke. 

Check out MorePlatesMoreDates and Haircafé. 

Hi there, 

The crown is generally refered to as being "the black hole" for grafts because it always looks seethrough (the hairs do not overlap each other on the crown as they do on the midscalp and hairline so you lose the benefit from the layering effect). The head is a sphere on the crown area and also hairs change direction of growth....

That's why it always require 2 times more grafts for the same surface than the mid or the hairline. 

VERY FEW surgeons in the world have the required skillset for working on crowns. Forget about Turkey...

If you want to get Redemption from the BALD SPOT curse than I would look into Konior, Zarev, Sever Muresanu, Pradeep Sethi, Felipe Pitella, Wong and Bruno Pinto. These guys arr expensive but they know who how to create the illusion of density on the crown. 

And remember you will probably require at least 2 if not 3 passes on the crown. The crown is hardly ever a one and done thing... 

Now as other members told you, most doctors prefer to focus on the front instead of trying to fill in the black hole at the back because it consumes a lot of grafts. 

It's trade-off.

You'd either have to accept a slightly receded front and go all in for the crown OR accept a better-looking (but still thin crown) and focus more on the front.

You front isn't that bad to be honest. I think you do need some work on forelock and maybe lower the hairline 1cm.

On your picture, it is unclear how far your crown drops at the back ?...

But judging by these pictures, you need  4000 grafts perfectly placed with +90% survival rare  to make it look FULL.

But before rushing into surgery, I think you should get on a strong pharmaceutical stack. I can see that your crown is not slick bald so there are still miniaturized hairs that can be boosted by medication. 

Try some oral Dura + oral minox + topical AA + microneedling. Give it 6-8 months. 

The truth is for most people medication doesn't do crap. However there are some good responders and 100% worth giving a try. It may reduce the number of grafts required. 

All the best

Yes it will unfortunately....Very much. Even with a razor. 

Transplants are crap if we want to have a short homogenous buzzcut. 

If you cut your hair short after failed FUE transplant then you'll have 3 problems

1. Your balding pattern will still be noticeable. Even with you go with Omnishaver, Gilette 5, Wilkinson or whatever...

2. The difference of density will be noticeable too and thus stand out to the human eye. Remember transplants are only 50% of original hair density. If you wanna look like let's say Khabib, Randy Orton, Sean Strickland, Chimaev then this would require 60-80 follicular units per cm2 throughout the whole scalp. This is just mathemically impossible. 

3. The back of your head will look really weird because you'll have  thousands of little white dot scars showing you had FUE. 

I suggest you rather look into SMP. But be careful and do your homework. There are good SMP clinics and there are bad ones too...

22 minutes ago, michael hofmann said:

I don!t have any pictures from them. I am now planning to ask them to send me the pictures that they took. I only have one picture frot the Doctor at the end of the operation where it shows his face and the number of the grafts that they have taken. It shows my name too, this is why i haven"t posted it. I have spoken to Andreas Krämer about 3 Months after my Operation, he is a hair-consultant in Schwitherland and Germany and the founder of hairforlife. He promotes this clinic. He has spoken with the Director of the clinic and they gave him the same answer, that i should wait. I have now tried to speak to the Doctor Ozgur who did the consultin but they do not respond. I have spoken to Krämer and asked him to talk to these guys again. I really want to know how easy was to do something like this to somebody. I mean they have disfiguren my face. I will try to post more pictures. I have talked per Whattsup with the Koordinator from this clinic, the Dogan, and the guy spoke to me like i was the problem. 

I know Kramer....

Yeah he is the german version of Spencer Stevenson aka Spex...

Just a salesman who is promoting clinics he's been working with... 

Allright thanks.  Looking forward to see additionnal pics. 

Man I feel bad for you...😢

Like I said, consult with an excellent and very experienced lawyer and see what your options are from a legal standpoint. 

If they are ethical (which I highly doubt considering how they played you like a fool  but I hope I'm wrong...) they should give double the price of a full refund for this poor result, head disfigurement and wasted resources....

Here are your options. 

1) Get SMP and shave your head. That will conceal both your balding pattern on top and your damaged donor.

Be careful though. The SMP industry is a minefield just like the hair transplant industry. The last thing you want is a botched SMP because it's really hard to remove. Do your research carefully. Also SMP often fade away quicker than what they promise you so beware you'll need touch-ups. SMP has advantages and disadvantages. 

2) Go to an worldclass repair doctor. I have no idea how much resources you have left in the scalp, beard and body hairs so I don't even know if it's possible at this stage. But still worth consulting. 

Dr. Umar from Los Angeles used to be the best for body hair repairs.  Dr. Konior is arguably the best surgeon in the world. But his prices are astronomical. 

Dr. Bisanga and Dr. Pinto are also good repair docs in Europe. Only downside with Bisanga is that he sometimes turns you off when the donor supply is not there anymore whereas Pinto is fully booked at the moment. 

As far as more affordable options

Ferreira and Ximena are also good options to consider. They have Lorenzo's skills but without his  hairmill aspect...Ximena has done some amazing repairs on Mesiasss4, a spanish youtuber who was also in a similar situation like you. 

HDC Cyprus has sucessfully repaired Doron Harati and Marcos Ximenez Lopez...

Dr. Cooley in the US is also a good repair doc. 

Sethi is also excellent for repairs jut recently there was a pretty "weird" result (TrackRat) 

Oh my dear lord !.....

That is really bad overharvesting ! 😡

Do you have the pictures from the clinic ? Just to prove that were at this clinic in order to keep it fair. Thanks...

I am well aware of some of their mediocre results but so far this is the first hairmill type of botch that I see from them....

Really sorry for you bro...

First of all, you should honestly consult a very good lawyer before doing anything. 

And see what legal actions can be undertaken. 

Not only do you deserve a full refund but also a compensation for permanent donor area damage, disfigurement and wasting of your limited grafts...

This is not just a poor result man. This is some serious stuff. 

Can't believe I myself used to believe they are one of the top clinics in Turkey...🤦‍♀️

Damn ! That really sounds like a horror story. Sorry for your bad experience...

Could you please post some pictures of your current situation as well as some before and after pictures so we get a better idea ? Tnx

Did you go to Dr. Maurice Collins at Hair Restoration Blackrock for your first 4 failed FUTs ? 

These are total snake oils bro.

Do not waste your time, money and energy on these scams. They have absolutely no impact on the progression of Androgenic Alopecia whichi is a genetic and hormonal condition. 

Consider getting oral on Finasteride/Dutasteride. 

If you want good information about treatments that actually work for stoppinh hairloss then I suggest you check the following channels

Hairloss Show 

MorePlatesMoreDates 

Haircafé 

Dr. Oscar Muñoz 

I would stay until the scabs fall out (if you can afford). 

Hair transplant is a huge deal and a huge investment. You better protect as much as possible if you can. 

I'd stay until day 10-15 and ask the doctor or the most experienced nurse to perform the scab removal step. 

That way, you won't be panicking over potentially losing grafts or the whole "graft or scab" thing that happens post op etc...

37 minutes ago, LookMaxx said:

You really think so? I managed to find old pics which I took before starting Laser light therapy to track differences and I was wrong, I don’t think I have regrowth or lost anything. 
 

See this August 2020 ( before LLLT )

 

I used LLLT for 5 months and saw no positive growth. Honestly, it appeared boring and I felt like an idiot running a laser comb over my head expecting hairs to grow, 5 months of doing this and nothing changed, felt like a waste of money.

See these photos taken in October 2020, 3 months later after using LLLT

 

 

 

My hairloss went pretty aggressive, up until September 2018 I had a diffuse full head of hair NW0? ( I had high hairline since teens) with good density then in just one year by January 2020 I became like this with no change at all afterwards
 

I started finasteride in December 2020 or January 2021 to not become shiny bald NW7 but it seems I was wrong. I don’t have any regrowth or loss, the only change appears to be thickening of the hairs. wow, this makes me disheartened, I felt like I was regrowing hairs but 2 years later and it feels like nothing has changed. 

Well that's the main issue with Finasteride....

Finasteride/Dutasteride are great for stopping or at least signiticantly slowing down the progression of Androgenic Alopecia and SOMETIMES in some rare cases regrowing existing miniaturized hairs but sadly they are total crap when it comes to regenerating follicles on bald scalp. That's why you have to start as soon as possible....

I think you should at least give oral Duta + oral minox combo a try. 

There was recently a patient of Dr. Mwamba who had similar degree of hairloss like you and he got pretty good results from the use of these 2 drugs. Not even close to " full regrowth " but big change compared to baseline. 

There are even stronger pharmaceuticals. Some transgender guys on Transtimelines are able to  sucessfully regrow hair using estrogen and spironolactone/bicalutamide/cyproterone but I just cannot recommend these drugs since they would totally mess your endrocrine system....Especially cyproterone which is pretty bad and linked to brain tumor. Not worth it. 

Like I said, Duta & oral minox for 6 months. You could throw in some topical AA and microneedling too. 

And then from there 

A. Get a decent hairline and baseline coverage with a decent budget doctor like Bicer, BHR Malaga, HDC Cyprus, Demirsoy, Fuecapilar. 

B. Go for a big hairloss "redemption"  with a top doctor specialized in high Norwoods   But that will cost you tens of thousands of dollars and take several years. So you really really gotta be ready mentally.... Your donor quality seems good and I think it's feasable but like Melviño said, it is not guaranteed that you will be able to achieve the same degree coverage as you showed on the picture with Hair Fibers so....

Good luck !

17 hours ago, ciaus said:

Yea body hair has the reverse relationship with dht, but I haven't noticed any thinning in all the years I've been on finasteride. 

 

 

 The GOAT is in da house 

23 minutes ago, Melvin- Moderator said:

Technicians perform extractions at SEVERAL clinics, that in itself is NOT a problem. Dr. Hasson will put up his technicians vs. any top doc in the world.  Dr. Feriduni one of the best uses technicians as well. Dr. De Freitas has technicians assist in extractions as well. The use of technicians isn’t a red flag. 

The problem is when UNTRAINED and inexperienced technicians perform extractions. You are NOT speaking facts, you are speaking sensationalist speculation. Also, there is no most important step, as every step is important. But if I had to weigh what is the most crucial, it is the incisions. You can get excellent growth, but if the angles are off and the density is bad, it will look terrible. 

Op, I don’t say this to convince you one way or another. I shared my concerns over Dr. Yaman, which are valid. But it is up to you to research him. Don’t listen to me, or to anyone. Research this yourself, it’s very easy to do here. Advanced search page will pull up every Yaman review for the past 15 years. After you’ve researched carefully, you’ll be in a position to make an informed decision whether it’s to avoid him or choose him.
Good luck 

First of all, let me start be saying I very much disagree with you on several points here. 

Every step is important obviously but the most important step of the procedure are the extractions otherwise what is even the point of getting a hair transplant if your LIMITED grafts are going to be transected and hence die ?....

Sure incisions are very important too for correct angles and overall naturalness but extractations are the foundation. 

You could have excellent incisons and perfect angles while having a destroyed donor supply at the back if some crappy techs overharvest you for your 1st surgery..... Think about it. What you gonna do if you run of of donor supply very quickly ? Hairloss is a progressive condition that's why long term donor management is KEY. 

Botched temples or hairlines can be fixed even though it's a pain in the butt and very expensive...

Destroyed follicles in the donor area CANNOT be regenerated. Understand ? 

Secondly you either misread or making wrong assumptions. I never said the use of techs was bad. The problem is HOW TRAINED  AND HOW EXPERIENCED  ARE THOSE TECHS  ?  This is precisely and exactly the issue I see with Yaman. 

Hasson and Wong have highly skilled and experienced techs. Couto too has Esteban who's been working with him ever since.We all know that. 

Why are you even bringing this up ? This is not the point of the discussion. H & W's techs hardly ever destroy donor and stuff like that. 

With Yaman such things have happened in the past therefore the level of training/experience/skillset of his techs is highly questionable. 

In addition to that, I cannot imagine how a doctor could keep control over 3-4 surgeries when such techs are operating simultaneously....

Ultimately, the only thing I agree with you is that everyone should his OWN due diligence and research. 👍

H

4 hours ago, StillAlive said:

Is that a hint of bias I'm detecting?

I see many great results from the doctor. If things were as bleak as you describe, he would not have established the reputation that he does have. I keep going through the forum threads by his patients and what I see, encourages me. If you have handy threads detailing those 'disasters' that you write of (not the three that I mentioned in my previous post) please do share for the benefit of all forum members. 

I don't think he's established any "reputation" so to speak. 

He's a nice dude. I watched one of his interviews with BOLA the moderator and notorious cherry-picker of the italian hairloss forum whom he has an affiliation with. 

Yaman is a cool guy but for me going to him is like the risks outweighs the potential benefits. 

If you save up a bit more you could go to Bicer who in my opinion isn't perfect but much safer. 

Ultimately, you're free to go wherever you want bro 👍

As long as you feel comfortable, you've done your homework and are aware of the risk/consequences. 

I was just sharing my thoughts and insight 

Good luck !

1 hour ago, Melvin- Moderator said:

I believe he’s overall good. Though, I would not get temple points done with him. His hairlines are good. Of course, you can’t compare him at the elite Coalition level like Bisanga, but he’s a good alternative to the mills, as is Dr. Turan. 

Also, who said young girls do all the extractions? Stop with the sensationalism @HAIRLOSS IS MY LIFE every post is like you’re speaking facts when it’s sensationalism. Yaman has a lead tech do all extractions. It was Ufuk, but has now changed to another tech. Its not a revolving door of female techs, as you state. 

LMFAO 

Male or female, it doesn't matter. 

The point is some techs are doing the extractions which is the most important step of the procedure. 

How trained they are and how much control does the doc have over the procedure in such circumstances is highly questionable. 

1 hour ago, StillAlive said:

@Mynamejermaine I will be booking with Yaman in a couple of months and I've done a fair bit of homework. I believe that he is the best option available for those of us looking for quality on a budget and willing to accept a minimum of risk. Keep in mind that his price (3250$) equals about 6 monthly salaries in Turkey, so by local standards, he is quite an expensive surgeon. He also operates on a lot of locals -going by his Instagram posts- which is an encouraging sign. Some of the top rated Spanish or Portuguese surgeons also charge the rough equivalent of 6 X central European salaries. It's really important to put a doctor's pricing into perspective when it comes to their location and economy. 

 He also appears to be quite ethical in that he both offers a follow-up procedure for free (https://www.resulyaman.com/guaranty-at-hair-transplantation/ bottom of the page) and there are cases in the forum were unsatisfied patients received full refunds. 

The incisions part IS the most important part of the operation as it will effectively dictate the placement, angling and direction of your grafts. I have seen really good results from him in similar cases to mine and I also like the fact that he is young and working to establish his clinic and reputation. He gives me the impression that he has the good kind of 'hunger' when it comes to making a name for himself. 

Remember, ALL hair transplants have a risk factor associated with them. Paying a top surgeon does not automatically guarantee a great result, but rather, buys you more peace of mind. That being said and given the fact that this is a super competitive niche market, I feel confident in my choice. If you dig through all the Yaman threads in the forum, you will find only two negative experiences and the presentations of those are rather questionable. I refrain from commenting on Digi23's post as I believe that his concern is a niche perfectionist case that should have gone directly to a 'Hollywood' surgeon in order to achieve the desired result. Us regular baldies will be super happy to have a frame for our faces again, never mind the whole 'But those three hairs curl THAT way' sob story

@ITA Where do you get the 'microscopes are not used in his clinic' bit? The doctor and the techs all seem to be wearing magnifiers on their headbands in their Instagram posts. Unless it's some fancy cosplay, I'd urge you to reconsider.

Couple things I would like to adress here. 

First of all, I totally agree with your statement that choosing a top expensive surgeon is by no means a guarantee of good results. This is something I always emphasize. Every transplant is potential risk and gamble. And I myself believe that there is a reasonnable limited amount of money that one should be willing to spend on a hair transplant. 

For example look at what Ziering did to Lebron. Completely crap result. Dude charges 30k $ per surgery and gives crap results. 

So a surgeon being expensive doesn't mean he's good. 

There's been some crappy results from Diep too. 

We all know that even  guys like Hasson & Wong, Couto etc....have had their subpar results. So absolutely  any transplant is a gamble. 

So there is a point of diminishing return when it comes to the price/quality ratio. At some point the curve starts flattening or even goes down. 

What you should be looking for in this industry is CONSISTENCY of producing quality results and more specifically price relative to achievkng consistency. 

How many bad results do Freitas, Pinto, Bisanga have ? Very few. 

How many destroyed donors do they have ? Very few. 

How many good results from independant reviews  do they have ? Many. 

Now anwer the same questions with Yaman instead. 

The thing to understand with doctors like Yaman is  that even if he gives you a "full refund",  it doesn't mean your situation will be solved and trust me a repair is not an easy fix at all. 

I have seen some really bad and botch results from Yaman...We are not just talking about subpar growth, poor survival etc...We are talking about serious stuff here such as permanent donor overharvesting which reduces your limited lifetime graft supply as well as botches that require very expensive repair surgeries etc...

Getting overharvested is by far the worst thing that can happen to a balding man especially if the degree of baldness is already advanced. It means you will NEVER be able to achieve the illusion of full head of hair again. 

Without even mentionning repair surgeries that are extremely expensive. Imagine betting botched and overharvested and then having to pay 2 or 3 × 10 000$ for a repair and STILL looking thin on top while being permanently moth-eaten at the back...

Yaman loores patients by saying "I'll give a full refund". 

But here is what you should be asking yourself

-What am I gonna do if I get botched ? 

-Will Yaman's  3000 bucks refund be sufficient to get a repair somewhere else at a better place ?...

-Will this refund regenerate my wasted grafts ?....

-Will I have enough donor supply at all for repairs  that looks decent ? 

-If I get destroyed, will be able to accept dealing with SMP for the rest of my life ? 

If you can't answer these questions then my advice is don't go with him.

If you can and really want to gamble it then go ahead but beware there is no coming back and you NEVER get a proper 2nd chance at these things. 

Last but definitely not least: incisions are NOT the most important step of the procedure. 

Extractions are. 

While incisions are certainly important, extractions will play the most crucial role  for graft survival and hence yield (you have to be very skilled to avoid transection ) and extractions will be key for your long term hairloss  "gameplan". 

As far as I know, Yaman like 99% of turkish doctor outsources the extractions to young girls....

1 hour ago, Mynamejermaine said:

Thanks for the reply. Who would you recommend in turkey?. I’ve looked into HLC, Pekiner, Bicer and Keser but they’re all double the price of Yaman. They are unfortunately out of budget. Are there better affordable options than Yaman?

Yeah stay away from him. 

Bicer is the best affordable option. She's not elite but she does good work for a fair price. 

Turan, Demirsoy, Gur are decent too. A bit overhyped by the forum but definitely a decent option if you are on a budget. You won't find better quality at that price. 

Pekiner and Keser are good for the most part. But they are notorious for cherry picking patients. I believe you could find better quality in Spain/Belgium/Portugal

I suggest a do a bit more research. 

I've seen several damaged donor areas from this clinic as well as a couple botch jobs...

Yaman is not the worst in Turkey but there are much better options.

49 minutes ago, Danzig323 said:

I'm sorry, but I really think you should seek the help of a psychiatrist, it's no shame, and I'm going too because I know I'm sick and not just balding. There are hundreds of millions of bald people in the world, I think a lot of them live happy and healthy lives. I am not against HT, medications, SMP but a person should take it consciously and with a cool head, or they will probably regret It and bury yourself even deeper. I am just hoping you are not a TROLL.

 

What is your agenda here ? 

Dude you have a full head of hair basically.  

I think you should just stay on medication and do nothing else. That's it. Just move on with life and you'll be perfectly fine. 👍

Don't bother with transplants and other stupid stuff. Save your hard-earned money for more important things in life. 

All the best. 

50 minutes ago, Jay00 said:

Yeah Dr Zeiring. They gave me full refund though

Aw man...I'm sorry...

Ziering is such a crappy surgeon...

Look at what he did to Lebron....

But at least he gave you a full refund so that shows he is ethical. 

Bro who botched you for your 1st surgery ? 

16 hours ago, FUT4000 said:

ok so like what 98% of the hair transplant docs are now "red flag" because they use techs to place the hair follicles? I understand you're saying its your opinion, but honestly it's pretty ridiculous man. Are you saying you don't go to a dentist that uses assistants to help with any part of the procedure, and especially if the dentist walks out the room? If staff are properly trained then it is not only fine but legal. 

Sorry bro but your argument does not make any sense. 

It's not just about "having techs doing the implantation". There's a lot more to it. 

First of all, you are comparing apples with oranges with your dentist comparison... I totally second what Stephcurry said. 

Secondly let me ask you which clinics have the highest percentage of crap results and botched jobs ?

The answer is turkish hairmills followed by "reputable" western surgeons  who outsource the MAJORITY of the work to young technicians with questionable training or nurses just because all they want is PROFIT....

Which clinics have the highest percentage of good results ? Doctors like Konior, Pinto, Couto, Bisanga etc....Some of them not using techs at all and other utilizing them them for SOME steps of the procedure to a reasonnable degree. Bisanga uses techs only for implantation and they have at least 10 years experience and he does 1 patient per day (maximum 2 if easy case) which allows him to have as much control as possible over the procedure. 

From there you can draw a conclusion. 

Now,  I am not against the use of technicians in the hair transplant industry as long as they are properly trained and as long as they have sufficient experience. 

Technically speaking, it is impossible for a doctor to do everything on his own. We all know that of course. 

Nonetheless, a doctor (no matter how good he is) CANNOT have control over multiple surgeries and simply cannot supervise 4 or more different teams of technicians throughout the day. There will inevitably be mistakes due lack of training/experience, fatigue or just lack of care...

It's a matter of ethical choice. You are either 100% dedicated and commited and care about your patients or you are a mill. 

Quality or quantity. 

Do you think it's ethical for a doctor to charge 20 000$ for one procedure, have young party girls do most of the work and leave the patient  with poor results ?... 

For me, this just shows that profit is the only goal. 

And yes such doctors should be huge red flag just like turkish hairmills.