"Appearance of density"

[Bob C]

I hope I've posted in the appropriate forum. Here goes:

 

Most informed HT shoppers realize that:

 

1 You can never gain back a "full head of hair"

2 Hair loss is progressive

3 A good haircut, skilled styling and concealers can add to a dense look.

 

The idea (some might say "mantra") is that properly placed grafts by a top doctor can give the "appearance of density".

 

Nothing new, right? I'd like to know how many HT veterans feel they've met that goal? Everyone says "some hair is better than none". But do you REALLY feel that way? Furthermore, do today's huge megasessions and dense packing getting you any closer to the appearance of a "full head of hair"? Closer than in the old days, I mean - when the max was about 1000 grafts a session.

 

Although I've not yet had a transplant, I'm no newbie here. I've been reading and posting on the HT Network since Pat had the old website. And I had my first consultation 6 or 8 years ago.

 

At least 5 years ago, I ordered (and watched) some sales videos from hair clinics (NHI, Bosley, MHR, Elliot-True and Shapiro/Sir Winston). Yesterday I reviewed them to see whether their surgical and promotional techniques had changed over the years, as well as to see whether my perception of the HT industry had changed since I've done further research and experienced further hair loss.

 

In some cases, the doctor combed through the patient's new hair to show the undetectable transplants and scar. But it also allowed us to see how thin the new hair still was - natural looking, but thin. Granted,these were smaller sessions, and in some cases the hair had not all grown in yet. Now this is fine, but it blows the notion that a transplant is "wash and go" carefree. I think you're still primping to get the best look out of a limited hair supply. Right or wrong?

 

I would love to see follow-ups of some of these patients today, 4 to 8 years later. I'm so glad I waited, as I still have ample hair and perhaps technology is ready for me. I just want to be convinced that I will have a sastisfactory "net gain" when the time comes to go under the knife.

 

If there is a question in my post, it is not "Did you get butchered?" or "Do you like your new hair?" It's more like "Are you glad you waited, did you have to return for another session sooner than you'd expected, or is your transplant as thick as you'd like?"

[Bob C]

I hope I've posted in the appropriate forum. Here goes:

 

Most informed HT shoppers realize that:

 

1 You can never gain back a "full head of hair"

2 Hair loss is progressive

3 A good haircut, skilled styling and concealers can add to a dense look.

 

The idea (some might say "mantra") is that properly placed grafts by a top doctor can give the "appearance of density".

 

Nothing new, right? I'd like to know how many HT veterans feel they've met that goal? Everyone says "some hair is better than none". But do you REALLY feel that way? Furthermore, do today's huge megasessions and dense packing getting you any closer to the appearance of a "full head of hair"? Closer than in the old days, I mean - when the max was about 1000 grafts a session.

 

Although I've not yet had a transplant, I'm no newbie here. I've been reading and posting on the HT Network since Pat had the old website. And I had my first consultation 6 or 8 years ago.

 

At least 5 years ago, I ordered (and watched) some sales videos from hair clinics (NHI, Bosley, MHR, Elliot-True and Shapiro/Sir Winston). Yesterday I reviewed them to see whether their surgical and promotional techniques had changed over the years, as well as to see whether my perception of the HT industry had changed since I've done further research and experienced further hair loss.

 

In some cases, the doctor combed through the patient's new hair to show the undetectable transplants and scar. But it also allowed us to see how thin the new hair still was - natural looking, but thin. Granted,these were smaller sessions, and in some cases the hair had not all grown in yet. Now this is fine, but it blows the notion that a transplant is "wash and go" carefree. I think you're still primping to get the best look out of a limited hair supply. Right or wrong?

 

I would love to see follow-ups of some of these patients today, 4 to 8 years later. I'm so glad I waited, as I still have ample hair and perhaps technology is ready for me. I just want to be convinced that I will have a sastisfactory "net gain" when the time comes to go under the knife.

 

If there is a question in my post, it is not "Did you get butchered?" or "Do you like your new hair?" It's more like "Are you glad you waited, did you have to return for another session sooner than you'd expected, or is your transplant as thick as you'd like?"

[kg007]

Bob C -

 

Great topic! I have been thinking about the same thing for past few months. I have seen pictures of patients with 4000-6000 grafts, and yes they do look great, but I am not sure if it really looks that great from closer.

 

I had a HT to cover my crown with 1500 grafts, now my doc used lots of 3s & 4s to give me the maximum density. I am 7 months post op, and I am not too happy with the results (maybe it's still too early to tell). I guess my expectations were too high. Now this is not anything against my doc, she's a great doc. It's just that what you see in pictures on doctors' website does not necessarily mean you're going to get the same results. Obviously doctors are going put the best pictures they got, They're not going to post pictures of patients who did not get great results, and believe it or not lot of patients did not receive 'great' results compare to the ones who had great results.

 

I agree with you, it's not 'wash and go'. I still spend some time in front of mirror trying to look my best. It's just an illusion that you can get up in the morning and leave the house without worrying about your hair. To be honest with you, my hair doesn't look that great when I get out of the bed in the morning. I have to take shower and fix my hair before leaving.

Yes, I am happy with my HT. It has given me lot more confidence than 3 months ago, but it's not as great as I had expected. I guess I was expecting too much after witnessing great pictures on doctors' websites. But that may not be the case for you. And I guess that's why lot of people try all the shapoos and thickners even after the multiple HTs.

 

Now I would not say 'I got butchered', but I would say that I had very high expectations, now I know the reality. And yes, I might be going back for 2nd procedure to give me better appearance.

 

I can not say for you waiting for last 6-7 years was the smart move or not, because I don't think much has changed in last 4-5 years, plus we're getting the best that's available outthere. Yes they are talking about Cell Multiplication and cloning, but God knows when that's going to happne. I mean they're saying that it'll be available in 2-3 years for last 5 years. One of the docs who I really admire and respect for his honest opinions and straight forward answers told me that it won't be available for another decade! So you never know if the new technology will be available in near future or it may never be available. I have seen and read articles about this technology being available in 2007, but I think it's just bs. I won't believe anything I read until it actually happens.

 

anyway, I can go on and on. But I'll let other folks take it from here.

 

KG

[Robert_]

This is a great topic, Bob C.

 

It is important that the patient have realistic expectations and even more important that the physician expresses the limitations of surgical restoration during the consultation. An open dialogue is imperative between the two so that there less of an occurance of patient's dissatisfaction.

 

Hair restoration is great, awesome, and can be life changing if the patient knows exactly what to expect.

 

I hope more patients chime in on their thoughts and experiences.

 

-Robert

[Bob C]

KG and Robert,

 

Thanks for the responses. To eleborate on my own situation, I started researching out of curiosity - long before I needed a transplant. And I'm glad I didn't talk myself into doing smaller sessions to keep up with my hair loss.

 

As far as advances in technology in recent years, I think they have been mainly in the areas of larger sessions and better healing techniques. Ideally, the patient might get a better grasp of the big picture and future results sooner.

 

As for realistic expectations, we hear about that all the time. But it's different when it's YOUR scalp and hair and appearance. And YOUR money. That's why I said my perspective may have changed, now that a transplant is closer to a reality for me -- not just a novelty.

 

Shock loss and early permanent loss of miniaturized surrounding hairs is , of course, a very real concern. That plays into what I mean by "net gain".

 

My main point is that I went from "Boy, if I ever go bald, I'm gonna get me hair transplant and make everything right" to "My hair loss is really starting to show. I wonder if it's worth it to take this big step?"

 

More opinions and personal accounts are very welcome.

 

Thanks,

Bob

[Robert_]

Bob,

 

I spoke to an individual just the other day in length about density issues. He wanted to know why I am not jumping at the chance to get a 2nd hair transplant for the crown, since it is still thin.

 

I explained to him that my family is full of NW6 and 7's. My brother was a NW6 by the time he was 29 (using no meds). I was a NW4 by 24. I am pretty much pre-disposed to being a NW6 or 7 and pretty early at that.

 

I have to be infinitely careful with my donor area hair. To pack it all in to my crown now could very well be devastating in later years with the very real possibility of shock loss of existing hair. Sometimes, it just doesn't make sense to transplant, say 1,000 grafts in an area only to turn around and lose 400 grafts worth of hair. It is a risk I am not willing to take at 26.

 

This gentleman was almost twice my own age. He was only about a NW3 and creeping into a NW4 with what looked to be good looking donor area hair. It is for that reason that I told him that he could very well possibly be at least or even much more aggressive than me.

 

It's all relative. All of it.

 

Consider your hair restoration to be your coach. Both of you come up with the game plan. The more communication the better. Yeah, it's repeated all the time, but for good reason. After all, that's the way hair loss sufferers are going to remember it; especially when actually researching and trying to remember the hundreds (or thousands) of other tidbits of information to make sure their decision is one that will be one of the greatest decisions that they have ever made as averse to one of the worst.

 

-Robert

[tymman]

I don't have anything new to add, just want to agree. My family has a few NW 5&6's. I knowwhat's in my future. I am now 31 and have been waiting for a few years to do the HT.

 

Now that I have and I see where the "new" hair is going to grow it gives me good feelings. I never expected to get that old "hair helmet" back, but now I can expect coverage. I wanted to concentrate on the hair line first because it is the first thing people really notice(or so they say!!).

 

My doctor was telling that I still have 7-8 thousand potential donor hairs left. I think this is encouraging because technology changes at the speed of light! Maybe in a few years medicines will be more effective, but regardless, I have a hair line right NOW! I look forward to MAYBEdoing some more work on the crown, for better coverage but nothing more. I would rather do more work on the top and front first and get the best possible density.

 

I shaved my hair down to the skin to match up with the HT. http://www.hairrestorationnetwork.com/eve/showthread.php?t=

With it down so far I can see my potential/(inevitable) hair loss and I don't feel as concerned about it.

[Robert_]

tymman,

 

You are a brave man to shave your head like that with a fresh donor scar. The recipient area looks AWESOME, though. I have to know, what are you responding with when the inevitable "what happened to your head?" question comes up?

 

-Robert

[Robert_]

LOL!

 

I just checked your album comments again and saw this:

 

"Chicks dig the scar when I tell them I was attacked by a gang called the DHT's and they tried to scalp me!!"

 

Haha.

 

-Robert

[damo]

Bob thanks for your post.I have had 2 procedures now.The last one i had in May 2005 this year by a wonderful surgeon in Dr Martnick.Her work is outstanding as you can view from my website.My 1st procedure results are excellent and i had a follow up procedure to obtain the density.I couldnt be happier with the results so far.I strongly beleive that a good surgeon compared to a top surgeon will make or break you.The hairline is the biggest give away to people.If they can spot you have had something done then you know you have failed in a good hair transplant.Research is the key as it took me 4 years before i decided to go with her.Please have alook at my before and after shots so far and tell me what you think.

 

http://www.inperth.com.au/users/damo/

 

Rgds

Damo

[Bob C]

tymman,

 

Thanks for posting. I'm glad to hear things are going well for you.

 

To be clear to all, I'm not holding out for hair cloning or anything like that. And I'm certainly not speaking out against hair transplants.

 

The whole thing is a matter of perspective. Every patient must decide how much hair will satisfy him, and whether the procedure is worth the risk. He must take into account unforseeable future events. It's like devising a strategy for long-term investing, using best and worse case scenarios.

 

Okay, I don't want to beat this to death. Robert said a mouthful concerning planning and using donor hair wisely.

[baldcasanova]

I have been thinking about the "appearance of density" and i have come to the conclusion that I would love that. right now i have the appearance of my bare scalp, and since this an aestetic (eye pleasing) surgery anyway, then I figure thats all good.

 

Cas

[Smoothy]

Bob nice post and you raise some good discussion points. First being a vet of 15 years, I can say that I'm 100% happy with my results and no my hair is not thin. Is it as thick as 18 yrs old--no, but it as good as most 40 some yr old guys. Nobody can tell I've had HT, not even my wife after my last procedure with Dr. Shapiro.

More than likely, the techniques/artistary of the Surgeon with graft placement, angluation, zoning through the various hairline cores. If done with precision, hairlines and hair look 100% natural and dense-- now maybe the crown will still be thin because there is not enough donor to provide natural coverage to hairline and front then to do the crown.

[Robert_]

Originally posted by Smoothy: now maybe the crown will still be thin because there is not enough donor to provide natural coverage to hairline and front then to do the crown.

 

Exactly the conundrum that most of us find ourselves in. At 26 with my level of aggressive thinning I have planned for this same scenario. No, I don't and won't have a "wall of hair" up front, but I do have a hair line. The crown, I am still leaving in the "hands" of Avodart and Minoxidil.

 

Hair loss sufferers must have a sensible plan to abide by. Luckily, it is easier these days than before. It is by no means PERFECTED, but with a skilled hair restoration physician to help guide a patient, the donor hair can be used wisely enough so that the most possible coverage can be achieved sensibly.

 

-Robert

[baldcasanova]

Originally posted by Forum Moderator and Satisfied Patient:

Originally posted by Smoothy: now maybe the crown will still be thin because there is not enough donor to provide natural coverage to hairline and front then to do the crown.

 

Exactly the conundrum that most of us find ourselves in. At 26 with my level of aggressive thinning I have planned for this same scenario. No, I don't and won't have a "wall of hair" up front, but I do have a hair line. The crown, I am still leaving in the "hands" of Avodart and Minoxidil.

 

Hair loss sufferers must have a sensible plan to abide by. Luckily, it is easier these days than before. It is by no means PERFECTED, but with a skilled hair restoration physician to help guide a patient, the donor hair can be used wisely enough so that the most possible coverage can be achieved sensibly.

 

-Robert

 

 

SD,

you should post some pics with your hair combed back. I think all weve seen are pics with your hair combed forward. Thoughts?