corvettester

I think a lot of the skepticism regarding the efficacy of FUE into donor scars is simply due to the dearth of examples and case studies we have available to us. These aren't the things that docs typically focus on in their B&A's.

In fact, this is probably the first FUE into a donor scar that I've seen on the HTN in two or three months...

Good luck GWN86. I hope it works out well for you.

Corvettester

Corvettester's information on FUE is definitely something I'll ask about, healing quickly and minimal scarring risk is important. But why could FUE be better for minimal hair loss?

Jim,

FUE is not better for minimal loss, per se. It's just good for small, potentially one-time jobs like yours because it's minimally invasive and won't leave you with the strip scar. You don't need that many grafts in the first place... The rest of your hair looks solid so I think that you have a good chance of not losing anymore provided that you stay on the meds.

I don't care what any doctor says about FUT being minimally invasive, it is not. It's a big deal in my opinion.

I just spoke with a friend of mine today who had an FUE procedure done yesterday. He had 275 grafts and said that he didn't even have to take aspirin afterwards. It took two hours and he just went right back to work after the procedure. There was no swelling, no oozing, no bleeding and no pain. He didn't take any pain killers after the procedure or the next day.

This is not the case with FUT.

FUT is designed for the big jobs. You'll get different opinions from everyone, but I think that there is broad consensus that FUT is generally not recommended for anything under 800 grafts. It's just too much trauma and too much of a scar to be really worth it, unless you're doing multiple procedures or scar revision.

I am concerned that with such fine hair I am not a good candidate for HT since they take hair from the back of the scalp?

I had the exact same concern. My hair in the back of my head is much coarser and darker than in the front, which is quite fine and lighter in color.

I discussed this with a couple docs. They told me not to worry about it. It's darker because it gets less sunlight than that on the top and in the frontal third. It's coarser because it's denser back there and kept shorter, so it feels differently. Regardless, it won't be cosmetically noticeable after the HT.

I'm only 10 months post-op so I can't really say with full authority that this is the case. I will say that it's looking to be just that though. My hair still has a lot of maturing to do so I'll have to wait it out, but I think the docs were right.

Corvettester

Hey dude,

Seems far too young to be considering a hair transplant.

I'm surprised either of the docs agreed to work on you even though you're only a NW2. I would think that they'd at least want to wait until you're 25 and have been on Propecia for a year or two.

It's good that you're doing consultations, but I'd put the brakes on this decision if I were you. I'd spend the next couple years monitoring my hair loss and the efficacy of medication, while researching hair transplantation, FUT/FUE.

However, I was not too impressed with his before/after results that were featured in a photo album in his waiting room.

This says it all. To me this would be a deal-breaker. I mean, if you're not impressed with his work, why even consider him in the first place? Why ask the community's opinion? You're the one that is going to have to live with it, not us.

I don't know if I'd agree with RCWest about overlooking disciplinary actions against Dr. Charles in Minnesota (that is, if it's true). I mean, I wouldn't drive a vehicle if I knew that my driver's license had expired... how can something as important as this slip through the cracks?

Corvettester

Jim,

Your story is very similar to mine in many ways. You and I have very similar hair characteristics and almost the same amount of hair loss. I never took meds though. The fact that you've been on meds for so long and that you appear to be responding well to them probably makes you a good candidate for an HT in the near future.

I do wonder what role the meds played in your hairline and temples though because so many doctors state that Propecia doesn't really address that area... Either way, if you're not experiencing any adverse side effects, then I'd stay on it and not bother risking more loss if I were you.

If there is one thing that I come across time and time again on the forums, it is men bemoaning the fact that they stopped taking Propecia after it initially worked well for them. Some times it's out of apathy or frustration, or it's just too high maintenance for them. Soon after stopping, their hair loss will pick up with full force and then they're left with patches and bald spots that only HTs can address... and they always end up regretting it. So long story short, be mindful of this and search the forums to see for yourself.

I did my first consult when I was 28 and had my first HT last year at age 29. I completed my second just two weeks ago. You can see my experience in the links below in my signature.

You're probably old enough to go for it if you feel like it is the right thing to do for yourself. SMG is a great clinic, both Paul and Ron Shapiro consistently produce great result. Vancouver has Hasson & Wong which are on par with SMG, in my opinion. I don't see how you could go wrong with either of them.

Also, due to your minimal hair loss, FUE may be a more viable option for you... so that is something to look into as well. H&W do not perform FUE, however, if I understand correctly, SMG does do it. Other great FUE docs are True & Dorin and Bisanga.

Regardless of your decision, it's clear from your post that you still have a lot of researching to do before you decide upon which clinic to go with. Feel free to ask as many questions and take as much time as needed. You really can't do too much research. You'll be glad that you took your time and didn't just jump into such an important and impactful life-decision.

Corvettester

Looking good, dude.

You'll be a new man in about 10 months!

Keep us posted.

Corvettester

MGZ,

I can appreciate your qualms regarding Propecia given its potential sexual side effects.

Few people on these forums understand what it’s like to be 24 years old, heterosexual and single in NYC. The high female-to-male ratio, coupled with the anonymity of a progressive, big city, make NYC is a straight man’s paradise… not to mention that the sizeable homosexual population only helps our odds! We’re killing it here!

So, to say the least, I get where you’re coming from buddy.

I am very weary of taking meds and I think you should be too. You don’t want to be one of the exceptions. It really hit home with me about how you “know your body.” I’m the same way: I work out daily, I take care of myself, I know my body well.

I don’t take meds and I won’t take them unless my situation gets desperate. Having said that, I do consider your situation desperate.

Your crown is going, big time—once it’s gone, it’s gone. Your temples are already gone and your hairline has significantly receded or matured. Based on your photos, I also see what appears to be thinning in the frontal third and midsection too. In my opinion, you have a clear pattern emerging, possibly NW5/6.

The fact that you’re only 24 and easily a NW3 Vertex isn’t helping the equation either. Therefore, you’re going to have to start preparing for a worst-case scenario, in my opinion. In your case, I think the benefits of trying Propecia far outweigh the risks.

I can see that you’re under the spell of dense packing, hence your selection of Rahal and H&W— the undisputed masters of dense packing!:cool: However, I don’t think you’re a good candidate for it at all because, when the time comes, you’ll have too much hair loss without enough donor supply. I imagine that they’ll tell you as much.

You don’t really have the option of an HT yet, not at age 24. Even if you did go for an HT in the next couple years, it’d have to be really conservative because of your potential for future loss, so forget about dense packing.

You’re going to need a shit-ton of grafts to cover your crown and another shit-ton to do your hairline and temples. Then you'll have to deal with your frontal third. Without Propecia, your mid-section is going and even more of your crown! :eek:

Judging by your current loss, I would say that right now, at age 24, you need a minimum of 5,000-6,000 grafts to get to where you want to be. I’d say 2,000-3,000 in the hairline and temples, and another 2,000-3,000 in the crown. But this is the problem: that is what you need right now, at age 24 and your current amount of hair loss; if you go through with it, you’ll probably need another 5,000-6,000 again in 10 years. Will you have enough donor in the bank to finance this? Of course not.

I don’t see any reason to assume that you have above average donor density. Let’s assume you have average donor supply. You’re looking at approximately 7,500 grafts between FUT and FUE that you have available. That’s not much, and god forbid you have less than average.

So all advice regarding an HT is essentially moot at this point considering that you’re most likely going to lose a lot more hair. This is why everyone is telling you to wait it out and get on Propecia, because it’s just too soon to say.

As for your questions regarding cloning, you’re in an excellent position to find out because you simply must wait a good 5 years before you seriously consider an HT. I asked the same thing to a well respected doctor once...

I said “Isn’t cloning just 5-10 years away?”

To which he replied “That is what they were saying 5-10 years ago!”

I saw the post where you shaved your head and I think it’s a look that you can rock, provided that you feel comfortable with it. It looks good on you, but personally, I always prefer hair on just about anyone for the simple reason that it allows for options.

As for financing, it can be done easily for less than $150 a month. Most plans offer 0% for the first year. I know this because I set my first HT up on a 24 month financing schedule, however, I ended up paying it off in about 6 months. Some companies offer 48 month plans.

It’s good to start doing consults now; you should have several. Since you’re in NYC, I would suggest consulting with Dr. Dorin, Dr. True, Dr. Wesley, Dr. Epstein and Dr. Bernstein. The more consults, the better. All five of them are relatively conservative and they’re not going to give you any false hopes of regaining that “soccer hairline” as you called it.

Yes, H&W and Rahal are great. They’re viable options for you in the future, among others. However, you don’t need to travel to Vancouver or Ottawa for them to tell you what any ethical doctor in NYC will tell you. So continue with your research and get on meds in the meantime so when it is time to take the plunge, you have the knowledge and realistic expectations that make for a success case.

If it's any help, I had my first HT in October of 2010, at the age of 29. I just had my second HT two weeks ago. My hairline and temples started receding around age 25. I did my first consultation at True & Dorin at age 28. The doc told me to wait a year to see what happened. So I did, and from there we developed a plan of action.

I live in NYC too. If you want to see my results in person or talk on the phone, contact me via PM and I’ll be glad to help in any way. You can see my hair loss website and photo album in the link below.

peace out,

Corvettester

Pleasure meeting you the other day Teach.

I just had my second HT too and you were right, so much less traumatic and less painful. I still take the Vicodin before I go to sleep, but that is it.

I thought your first result was truly impressive and, in my opinion, a stand alone procedure. Your hair looks really good grown out a bit longer like in the other photos but these look good too. You know have several options which is always a plus.

I'm really interested to see where this one takes you. Good luck.

Corvettester

I really like Dr. Dorin's scars as they are so fine and pencil thin. However, most docs should be able to produce the same thing.

My scar was pretty much impossible to find without the help of my hair stylist and good lighting. It was 1mm in width except for a small area on the right hand side that stretched a little to perhaps 2.5mm.

In my send HT, Dr. Dorin went back over and revised that small area that had stretched. It should all be 1mmm from here on out. You can see photos of my scar in my hair loss website under the 8 month mark, see link below.

Just make sure you take really good care of it post-op and apply the Mupironcin twice daily after cleaning and don't let blood crusts remain long as they will prevent the scar from closing properly, thereby making it wider.

Corvettester

cor, i looked into Dr. Dorin before you even posted...

 

what other doctors did you consider and what in the end made you chose dr. dorin?

 

Also, What about him specifically set him apart to you and why Dorin and not True?

I felt perfectly comfortable with Dr. True or Dr. Dorin. In fact, I consulted with each of them twice separately. Once I decided to take the plunge, it was only a matter of who was available first between Dorin or True. Dr. Dorin had an earlier opening so I went with it because I was so anxious to get it done and over with.

I consulted with several doctors in person and online. T&D just stood apart because they were so professional, established and had great results. Also, I could tell that Dr. T&D were stand up guys.

You can read the long, detailed version of my consultations and decision to go with T&D at the link below.

http://www.hairrestorationnetwork.com/eve/159626-review-true-dorin-part-1-3-pre-op.html

Corvettester

Hello forum,

 

I am a 24 year old male with a receding hairline and I want to talk to a hairloss Dr. about my options. If you could chose any DR. in the USA to visit and consult with who would your choice be?

 

Thanks.

I could have chosen any doctor in the USA and I chose Dr. Dorin. Actually, I consulted with him and his partner Dr. True. If I could do it all over again, I'd still chose him. True & Dorin are located in NYC. I consulted with several other docs too, but I went with Dr. Dorin for my procedure.

Regardless of who you chose, I'd suggest consulting with several doctors as well as doing a lot of research, scouring the HTN and other hair loss forums and speaking with several HT veterans online, over the phone and, most importantly, in person so that you can see their results for yourself.

Corvettester

corvette, i checked out your pics....really good looks. do you happen to have any immediately post-op pics....or "scabby" pics as i have begun to call them.

Yes, I do have immediate post-op pics from both of my procedures.

I understand that you are new to the HTN so I'll assume you don't know your way around the website quite yet.

To see my pics, please see my hair loss website. Here is how you get to it...

Click the link below in my signature that says "My Hair Loss Website- Hair Transplant with Dr. Dorin." It will direct you to another page where you can follow my entire experience. Click on the links on the left side to see bimonthly updates.

Also, if you look above, you can search through hundreds of HT patients experiences by their username or by their doctor. It's a very useful tool indeed. Good luck.

Corvettester

Capelli,

I don't think the proposed hairline looks aggressive at all. It's simply closing your temples, reconstructing your temple points and reestablishing your hairline. In fact, it looks almost exactly like my personal restoration case, perhaps less.

As far as the amount of grafts needed, I would say anywhere from 1,800-2,500. Since you seem to have good hair characteristics, I would suggest starting conservative because maybe you'll only need 1,800 to give yourself the coverage you want and need.

Also, I'd suggest going conservative for the simple reason that I like playing it safe. In your case, there is no need to risk shock loss or excessive trauma to the scalp. Also, save your donor supply for now... remember, you're still young!

By the way, I'm not sure if it's the lighting or the photos, but it looks like you may be thinning in the midsection, towards your back, left side. Is that accurate? If so, I'd definitely get on Fin and Mox as soon as possible. What did the docs say about this?

Lastly, I think you're a good candidate for FUE or FUT. Given the concerns we've discussed at length privately, I'd say go for FUE if you can afford it. You wear your hair so short, you don't want to complicate things with a scar... at least not yet. Your loss is not that bad and I think an HT will really frame your face up well. Your only real dilemma is whether to go FUT or FUE...

Corvettester

Nice... real nice.

I continue to be impressed with Dr. Bisanga's work. Thank you for the excellent documentation and the high def photos which really show your result well.

Your results are very impressive, especially considering that you're a repair patient. Good for you man!

Corvettester

Levrais,

Looking good buddy.

I really enjoyed reading about your experience, post-op care and follow ups with Dr. Bisanga. It's good to know that he looks after his patients and goes the extra mile to see to it that you're happy. It seems that his patient care, customer service and integrity is just as good as his technical ability. His reputation continues to improve with each new patient of his that joins the HTN.

Back to you, I'm really excited to see how your crown turns out too. I mean, 2,500 is a lot of grafts for a second procedure, and it already looks so good. I'm sure this one will complete your hair restoration journey.

Take care and keep us posted.

Corvettester

Archi,

Looking good bro!

I really like the new frame this is going to give you. That seems like a good amount of grafts to give you the density and coverage that you'll need and want.

Also, I noticed a pattern emerging in your pre-op pics... are you on Propecia or Rogain? If not, I'd definitely discuss that with your doc asap. You don't want to lose anymore now that you got this new head of hair coming your way.

Congratulations and welcome to the forum. Do keep us updated. I'm interested to see more work from Dr. Keller.

Corvettester

Sorry to say this, but this is sheer folly.

You can't just get strip and then think you'll be able to mask it with FUE so you can buzz like it were a FUE. (I assume best of both worlds is pointed at that possibility)

 

I have never seen, in nearly ten years of research a satisfactory result like this and yet many have tried.

 

Remember, if you get strip,

1) You may have to get further strips to 'keep up' with your loss and this will undo all the good work, expense and patience you exercised in getting the scar filled. In fact, most of us need multiple surgeries.

2) The scars aside from being unpredictable, change with time and maturing. Most docs will not even plant in an immature scar, and by the time they would, you'd be almost ready to cut it up again. (assummng you wouldn't do the unthinkable and actually create a new scar)

3) The density of the hair in the rump of the donor, is so good that even dense packing the scar ( and that is not recomended for yield by some doctors) will not match it. More likely, the course transplanted hairs and the unpredictable way in which they grow will make them stand out.

Well said Scar5...

I too have heard a lot about doing FUE to cover up a FUT scar, however, I've hardly seen any cases of it... It's one of those things that sounds great in theory, but for the reasons mentioned above, I don't know how common it is in practice.

Also, regarding BHT in the FUT scar, that's even less realistic than the FUE into the scar. I really don't think there are enough examples anywhere to recommend such an idea as a viable solution at this point in time. I'm all about playing it safe.

Also, I think Shadow of the Empire makes a good point... getting one procedure to cover up another just doesn't sit right with me. The scar should be thin enough to be virtually undetectable. Is it really going to make a huge difference for you to go from a 2.5 to a 3 guard?

I've seen your pics Capelli and we've discussed your situation at length over the phone. Given your concerns, perhaps FUE really is the best option for you at this time. If you're still worried about yield, why not go with a smaller, test procedure to see how it turns out. At worst, you'll only be losing a little more time...

Corvettester

Alex,

I think you'll find a broad consensus that FUE is the preferred method of choice for small jobs.

It's generally inadvisable to do strip for anything fewer than 700 grafts because is it really worth the scar for such a small amount of grafts? Maybe if you're having multiple procedures, but if you only have minimal loss on a virgin scalp, as you have stated, I'd only go with FUE.

However, you really need to post some pics if you want realistic and accurate advice. Often times on the HTN, new members underestimate their hair loss—I should know, I was one of them. I thought I was a NW2, but now I know that I'm easily a NW3.

In my opinion, the leading docs in FUE are True & Dorin in NYC and Bisanga in Belgium.

I recently had a conversation with Dr. Dorin regarding FUE. He told me that in the past two years they have made major improvements on FUE and were getting very high yields. I suggest you do a consultation with T&D, as well as Bisanga.

Corvettester

How much did this procedure run you? If you don't mind me asking.

Alexdelarge,

From the very beginning, Dr. Dorin always made it clear to me that he stands behind his work. However, at 8 months post-op, when it became apparent that my yield wasn’t coming through as we anticipated, Dr. Dorin offered me a complimentary procedure for however many grafts I desired.

I felt that he was being overly-generous because the simple fact of the matter was that my HT was a far cry from a failure. In fact, a lot of HTN members rave about what a great result I have!

Therefore, it wouldn’t have been right for me to accept a free procedure from him, so I insisted on contributing financially. Thus, he proposed that he would take care of the first 1,000 grafts and I could pay the normal rate for the anything after that. I still felt that to be overly-generous, but he said that he wanted to include lost time and failed expectations in the compensation... I'm very thankful to have such thoughtful, considerate and sensitive doctor.

At the time, we agreed to aim for 1,750-1,900 grafts or so with my second procedure. However, two months later, on the morning of my second procedure, we both decided that we wanted to go conservative so as to minimize trauma to the scalp and preserve as much donor supply as possible.

No doctor has a 100% success rate. What’s important is how they handle the few less than optimal cases. I’ve seen too many cases where doctors leave their patients out in the cold and I find that sort of behavior unacceptable.

Dr. Dorin was very supportive from the very beginning and I was never made to feel like I had done something wrong or had unrealistic expectations. He was very candid and up-front with me regarding my result and did not shirk from taking responsibility. I am very pleased with his professionalism and the way in which he handled my case.

Corvettetser

For those of you who have not had an HT, yet are wondering what the newly transplanted hair will look like when it first sprouts, I present to you these photos of some of my more unusual new growth.

These pics are by no means the majority of new growth. However, they do give you a good idea as to what to expect. This is what they mean when they refer to your new growth as "immature" hair.

The initial growth often times has to fight its way through the surface which causes it to initially come out crooked, straggly, wispy or curly. It will "mature" or normalize after a few months.

In my case, I have fine, straight, blonde hair. However, you will be surprised to see how some of my new growth is curly, wispy, brittle and dark. Plus, I wear my hair quite long so the first two inches of growth is pretty much worthless. I'm 10 months post-op and my new hair still hasn't caught up in length with the rest of my hair, but that is the price I pay for wearing my hair long... but on the bright side, the chics really dig it!

Again, these are some of the more extreme examples. I'd say about 10-15% about my new growth came out funny like the examples below and in my profile photo album. The rest were mostly just really thin, wispy or had a slight curve.

These pics were taken anywhere from 6-9 months post-op. For this reason, you will see that some of them are as much as 2" in length or more. For better quality photo examples, go to my profile photo album, Here.

Corvettester

On August 10th, 2011 I underwent my second hair transplant of 1,305 grafts FUT with Dr. Dorin in NYC. The graft break down consisted of 534 singles, 728 doubles and 43 triples. Tricophytic closure was used in the donor area.

The procedure went without incident. I arrived at 8:00am and was out the door by 4:30pm. Even though this was a smaller procedure than my first, it actually took a little longer because Dr. Dorin and the technicians were not placing on a completely bald surface like the last time. Being that they don’t shave the recipient site, doctor and technician have to be extra careful not to transect existing FUs.

I specifically requested that Dr. Dorin contour out my hairline because of my personal preference for a more straight or linear hairline. Although Dr. Dorin prefers the more jagged approach like most doctors, he was happy to accommodate my personal request. Thus, it may appear as if he has lowered my hairline, but he really hasn’t, just squared it off more or less.

I believe that a more contoured hairline will suit me well due to the fact that I have very fair skin and blonde hair, so it’s already difficult enough to see where my hairline starts because there is so little contrast. Again, this is a personal preference— to each his own...

Also, for those of you who have been following my progress, I had originally intended on having anywhere from 1,700-2,000 grafts FUT for my second procedure. However, after a lengthy deliberation, I decided that I wanted to stay conservative this time around, yet again.

My reasoning is that due to the fact that I had a lower than usual yield with my first HT, I theorize that perhaps my scalp is super sensitive to trauma. Even though 1,700 grafts from my first HT is not considered aggressive by any means, perhaps it was simply too much for me…

The simple fact of the matter is that we may never know why I had a low yield. In the absence of any definitive explanation, I decided to play it safe. After all, who is really to say?

However, I do applaud Dr. Dorin for exploring all possible explanations and not shirking from responsibility. Dr. Dorin genuinely cares about his patients and is accountable to them unconditionally. This is the type of quality I look for in a doctor and in my opinion it is what sets the great doctors apart from the mediocre ones.

It’s funny, because on the morning of the procedure, just as I was about to voice my thoughts on the matter and request a smaller session, Dr. Dorin, seemingly reading my mind, said that after giving it a lot of thought the night before, he only wanted to do 1,300-1,400 grafts, instead of going up to 1,800 or so. I had to laugh because I was literally seconds away from saying the exact same thing to him! Funny, right?

Looking at my second HT now, I must say that the work looks really clean. The FUs are packed really tight and I have just they type of hairline I want. I’m even more excited about this one than I was my first because I’ve known all along that I would need two HTs. Thus, this one will give me my final result.

Also, the whole ordeal of the actual surgery was so much less traumatic and took much less a toll on me both physically and mentally. Of course, the meds still made me nauseous but there isn’t much I can do about that. All in all, it was much easier than the first HT.

You can find loads of high resolution pics in my profile album, or go to my hair loss website.

As always, your opinions, thoughts and comments are welcomed…

Corvettester

I know Pat outside of this forum. I know the amount of dedication and research he has done for HTN and I know him to be a fairly perceptive and thorough person. He knows Dr. Feller beyond just visiting him once and reviewing his practice.

Hairthere,

Although I do not personally know Pat, I have heard as much and do not doubt your opinion of him for one second. I don't doubt his intelligence either. From what I understand, he is a true patient advocate, and an inspiration to us all.

Calling someone "genuinely nice and approachable" is in direct contradiction with having to walk on eggshells around them. Dr. Feller is claiming the OP is not what he seems and his posting here on the forum is a performance to gain leverage and free surgery.

I think this explains it all. Jessie was trying to be civil and diplomatic... but Feller just wouldn't accept the fact that Jessie was disappointed with his work. Feller views this as unrealistic without any regard to the opinions or concerns of his patient. What's more, Jessie stated that Spex was in accordance with him. So he was only relaying what he and Dr. Feller's representative had concluded...

Knowing Dr. Feller the way I do, and seeing the work he did on Jesssie, I'm going to chose to believe him. Does that qualify for "reason and rational perception" in your eyes?

Don't worry about what I think about you. You're well within your right to your opinion. You'll never hear me say anything at odds with that..

This is the crux of my argument!

Nobody has questioned you or accused you of having an agenda... because you're always advocating on behalf of Dr. Feller! I can assure you that if you sincerely and genuinely advocated on behalf of one of Feller's dissatisfied patients, as I have done, you would be denounced as a disingenuous, malicious poster with an agenda... and perhaps Feller wouldn't be so keen to discount your procedures anymore either?

Corvettester

And so far every one of those cases have shown a patient who everyone agreed experienced good growth, yet an unhappy patient who wanted more. Doesn't that say something to you about the character of the patient? Believe it or not Corvettester, there are lots of unstable people in the world. And when you combine an unstable person with hairloss it can get ugly. I can see why most doctors (and you're naive if you think every clinic doesn't have unhappy, unstable patients) would just want to push patients like this under the rug."

Hairthere,

You’re points are well taken.

However, I disagree with your conclusion that everyone agrees that all of Feller’s complaints have had good growth… I don’t and I know I’m not alone.

Also, I don’t doubt that all clinics deal with unstable patients. It’s just how they deal with them that raises so many questions. Do they make them sign non-disclosure agreements as Dr. Feller suggested? Or do they sue them as Dr. Feller does?

It's an internet forum, not a courtroom--no one is swearing on a bible here. What other than a longstanding reputation is there to go on? Pictures? Yes. The pictures presented here in most posters minds show a successful HT. You have yet to comment on them, btw.

I would say: one’s reason and rational perception. I don’t trust the opinions of others because I know how biased people can be.

As per the photos, please do your homework before making accussaitons…

I did comment on them... twice! I commented on the photos Jessie posted and on the photos Dr. Feller posted. I agreed that the photos that Dr. Feller posted didn’t look like that bad of a result. Why don’t you go back and read my posts…

I commented on Jessie’s photos in comment #12.

Once Dr. Feller posted his version, I then commented on the pics Dr. Feller posted in comment #38 where I said:

"I have to admit that it doesn’t look bad according to the pics Dr. Feller posted; however, the ones you posted at 9.5 months do seem less than stellar—certainly not a failure though."

I really do hope Pat addresses this as he should be insulted by it. The guy has been in this industry a very long time and knows Dr. Feller on a far more personal level than you know Jessie. And I resent being called a "fanboy" and would ask that you please stop throwing the term around as you do. It's an insult to someone like myself who has dedicated plenty of free time helping patients no matter what clinic they come from.

Why don’t you worry about yourself, Hairthere? Let others stand up for themselves if they feel it necessary. The HTN doesn’t need anymore “manufactured outrage.”

I wasn’t bringing into question the integrity of Pat, by any means. Please don’t read it that way or attempt to twist my words. I was trying to make a point. I don't think Pat will be dissecting my comments with an eye for offense, like you have.

Pat is only human. He is capable of error or being mislead, just like anyone. I’m sure if any doctor knew that Pat was coming in for a review, he is going to make sure to give him the best experience possible… who wouldn’t?

And I didn’t call you, Harithere, a fanboy. I never addressed you or anyone by name. I was speaking in general. Perhaps you’re just projecting your own negative self–image onto me?

Corvettester, people think you have an agenda against Dr. Feller because you never attempt to see things from his point of view. It's always the big bad bully doctor versus the poor hapless HT patient, no matter what the case is. Don't you find it odd that at one point the OP said this about Dr. Feller:

 

"No matter what is decided, and I don't want to get ahead of myself, Dr Feller is a genuinely nice guy and very approachable."

 

Why the sudden change?

Obviously, he was trying to be diplomatic and even admitted as much, and that he always felt that he had to walk on eggshells around Dr. Feller to express his opinion, etc...

I hope this clears up your questions…

Corvettester

Right to get this thread back on topic who hear feels that the work dr feller did grew in fine but the native hair behind thinned out and who here thinks the Ht didn't work? This thread is about the result really.

Bonkers,

It's good of you to try to get this thread back on topic...

I think it's clear that Jessie lost some native hair after the procedure. I also think it's been established that this was due to genetic hair loss, not shock loss. Feller isn't responsible for this and I haven't seen any suggest that he is.

I think Dr. Feller is trying change the true subject at hand to distract the community, which is the fact that Jessie is dissatisfied with his current result that he received at the hands of Dr. Feller.

Only two people have seen the result in person: Spex and Jessie. According to Jessie, they both agree that it is a poor result and that something is off. Whether or not Spex publicly owns up to his private comments is of little concern. The fact of the matter is that Jessie isn't happy and Dr. Feller is basing his opinion off photos that even Jessie admits were more than flattering due to the favorable conditions that they were taken and that he was using styling product.

I think most of us will concede that often times photos do not show the true result of an HT... sometimes it flatters an otherwise bad job, other times it depreciates an otherwise good job.

I simply chose to take Jessie at his word, as I hope the community would do for me. The fact that he posted such a detailed account of his opinion and Spex's opinion only makes me believe him more. He has no reason to lie.

However, I disagree with Dr. Feller's claim that Spex has no reason to lie. Spex has every reason to protect his reputation and his job!

I've worked in sales before, for which I underwent intensive, formal training. I didn't last long. Let me give you a little insight into the world of sales...

The modern day salesman has nothing in common with that of the high-pressure, hard sale used-car salesmen of the past... In fact, it's quite the opposite. Consumers wised up to these tactics long ago to the point that they've become cliche.

The new strategy is to be the "go to" guy for the customer. Customers don't have time or resources to research most products so they rely on the expertise and honesty of sales reps.

In order to build trust and establish rapport, a modern day salesman with get to know you personally and find things that you have in common. You will like them as a person, a friend and, therefore, trust their judgement. After all, the salesman has a family and friends and is highly regarded in the community and social world. He's well-know and well-regarded.

What's even better though, is for a salesman to get to know you on an emotional level: If they cry, they buy! That is what they teach the modern salesman: if you cry, you buy. This means that if you can connect with them on an emotional level, if you can tap into the pain, humiliation and self-consciousness that men who suffer from MPB have, then you can sell them anything.

This is why it's always better to have someone who's "been there." A salesman that has had an HT before, especially a botched HT....one who will protect you from the bad guys.

Do you see where this is going? Do you see how powerful this can be?

It is common practice to hype a product to a naive customer only to see them come back some weeks later complaining. The salesman has plausible deniability in this situation and can only blame his superiors (in private), but can't risk his job by publicly denouncing the product or the case that it was the wrong product for the wrong person... thus, the salesman has plausible deniability in the eyes of the hapless customer who is left out in the cold.

You see, this is how doctors circumvent accountability. It can all be chalked up to an unfortunate case of miscommunication.... every single time! Now both doctor and sales rep had plausible deniability. Usually, there isn't a forum such as the HTN where customers can see patterns such as these emerging so they go unaddressed. However, this is what the HTN is here for, and I'm not alone in noticing such things...

Corvettester

Jessie claims Spex misled him. That is untrue. If he could convince me that Spex lied to him, then I would cut loose from Spex myself. But Spex has a ten year reputation of giving accurate and detailed information to potential patients and the omissions that he claimed Spex made in their pre op discussions just isn't believable. Spex has credibility with me and on this forum, Jessie has not earned that. So Spex gets the benefit of the doubt. Furthermore, Spex has no motivation to lie or omit information, Jessie does.

 

As for my attitude, I can no more judge your attitude from an online forum than you can judge mine. But if you wish, spend a day with me in my office and find out what I'm about. Spex did that and it began a ten year long friendship and collaboration. Pat Hennessey did this and wrote an extremely favorable review of me, my attitude, and my business. There must be a hundred of my patients online by now who have written that I have a friendly down to earth attitude. It may or may not be true, but how could you know?

"If one’s actions are honest, one does not need the predated confidence of others, only their rational perception. The person who craves a moral blank check of that kind, has dishonest intentions, whether he admits it to himself or not." Ayn Rand

Every time a Feller complaint comes up, which relative to other doctors is quite frequently, he denounces his patients as liars, villains and disingenuous leverage-seekers.

He then goes on to invoke the good opinion other’s have of him and request that the community take him at his word, and asks us to consider all the good things that others have said about him and Spex.

I don’t trust those people who rely upon the good opinion of others at the expense of our own reason and rational perception, because such things can be easily manipulated. We can easily form our own opinion based upon how Feller handles such cases. We see in his own words the true nature of his character…

So Pat-Publisher gave him a favorable review, so what? That could just mean that Feller put on a good show that day. Some of his former patients come to his aid, so what? That could just mean that he takes care of his fanboys...

My point is the fallacy of relying on one’s reputation and the good opinion of others at the expense of one's better judgment and rational perception. It doesn’t take a rocket scientist for anyone to see in his own words how Dr. Feller treats his patients. Nor does it take exceptional powers of observation to note that it’s really only ever Dr. Feller that has so many complaints and dissatisfied patients, on the HTN.

I’ve been a member of the HTN almost 10 months now, and I have seen no other doctor come close to receiving as many complaints as Dr. Feller regarding poor patient care, poor communication issues, poor results, etc… I’ve seen a few coalition doctors get at most one complaint, since I’ve been a member. However, Dr. Feller has at least 6… and a few more that can be regarded as a less than favorable reviews.

I doubt the HTN will ever see the day that Feller admits that he has made a mistake. He does not accept criticism. It’s just too easy for him to cast his opponent’s character in a negative light and accuse them of trying to shake him down for a free procedure.

Speaking of which, it’s interesting to note how Dr. Feller talks about shakedowns when his threats of litigation are virtually the same thing: silence, or else he will sue you!

To my knowledge, he is the only coalition doctor that sues patients. Why is this? Why is it that he is the only one that ever has to go that far? Why is there this conspiracy out to get Dr. Feller? I know why: because there isn’t!

Lastly, Feller’s apologists love to accuse anyone who stands up to his bullying of having an agenda against Dr. Feller. However, a mere cursory glance at the forums will demonstrate that I advocate for any and all patients with bad experiences. I’m all over the forums and I especially find the bad experiences to be of the most value because they show how a doctor handles his less than optimal cases. Thus, I will continue to lend my support to any and all patients seeking it.

I can’t help it that Dr. Feller has more complaints than any other coalition doctor. It’s not my fault that he has more dissatisfied patients than any other coalition doctor. This should be setting off alarm bells to the community!

To be honest, I’ve seen more complaints against Dr. Feller than I do regarding a lot of non-HTN doctors. In the 10 months that I’ve been here, I’ve seen more complaints against Feller than I have against Armani or Larry Shapiro… what does this say?

The accusation of an alleged “agenda” against Feller is untenable and is obviously a desperate attempt to discredit the very serious questions that I and other members raise regarding Dr. Feller’s ability and integrity.

Corvettester

I'm trying to arrange an appointment with Dr Farjo but I can't even get a call back from them at the moment, obviously they are very busy which doesn't bode well if I wanted to get a transplant with them anytime soon. I guess all the top clinics are booked up a few months in advance.

Hey London,

I saw that you were looking into Farjo in the UK just a few days ago, but have suddenly changed your mind. Based on your last post, it appears that you've decided to return to Dr. Feller.

Why the change of heart?

I'd like to echo The Emperor's comments in stating that, although the allure of a highly discounted procedure may be tempting, one should never let price or location determine one's decision. This is your head and your hair that you're dealing with and you only have a limited supply of donor available. In some cases, it's better just to cut your losses and walk away... demanding a refund won't hurt either.

Although I emphatically disagree with Dr. Feller's characterization of your result as "a perfect success," I do wish you well in whatever decision you come to.

However, there still hasn't been any answer to the following questions that I raised in this thread some weeks ago...

1. Why was London advised to return for his second procedure only 6 months after his first one?

He said he completely understood this but would "rather have a thin lower hairline than a thick higher one", and that he would come back in 6 months to fill it in to achieve the density I recommended.

 

He also wanted to do his temples as well, but I advised him there wouldn't be enough grafts for such an ambitious plan on the second procedure. So we agreed to do the aggressive surgery now and then for him return in 6 months for a fill in and temple work.

...The plan was for LondonHT to return in 6 months time to perform a fill in procedure. This was a condition of my agreeing to perform the procedure. Unfortunately LondonHT never returned to have the job finished.

 

...I knew with 100% certainty how this procedure would look when grown, that's why a second pass was agreed to 6 months later.

2. How many square centimeters were covered in your first two procedures? Why did Dr. Feller claim to have no idea how much area was covered in the first two HTs?

I don't have a clue as to the surface area covered in terms of measurement, but it is larger and lower area than my average patient...

3. Lastly, how many more grafts does Dr. Feller anticipate that you will need? I mean, he already transplanted 3,250 grafts into your hairline and temples alone... how many more before you're complete? You do understand the limits on your donor supply correct?

All in all, I wish you the best. You've been a perfect gentleman as well as a valuable new member to the HTN. You truly do deserve a world class HT... let's hope this third pass will give you just that!

Corvettester