10+ years Avodart Blood test results

[sunsurfhair]

On 2/21/2023 at 11:04 AM, Melvin- Moderator said:

I don’t think low T would contribute to thinning. Though, low T itself isn’t good, regardless of age. It’s like balding. Is balding okay just because you’re 50? Now, I think its a good idea to try and raise your T naturally via exercise and diet and get retested. If you’re consistently in the 400s. You may want to consider TRT.

As for hair loss, I honestly don’t see any hair loss at all. The meds are definitely working, you might be experiencing a seasonal shed. 

That’s actually not entirely true. Believe it or not, excluding DHT, Testosterone AND Estradiol can have positive effects on hair growth. That’s why the endocrine system is like a beautiful symphony. One thing out of whack and the entire symphony can be thrown off. It’s a delicate balance. All hormones, INCLUDING DHT have positive (and negative) effects in the body when either too high or too low.

Now that being said, men who are “DHT sensitive” are the ones who get the most benefit with DHT reduction from a 5AR. There are many men who can have higher levels of DHT and/or Test and do not lose hair. Hair is loss is much more complicated then just shutting down DHT. I wonder if another treatment angle would be some way to reduce the DHT sensitivity of the follicles (AR) vs just blocking DHT. 

 

3.1.2. Androgen Receptor

Androgens act through an intracellular androgen receptor in the cells of the hair follicle [9]. Androgen receptors are located in human hair follicles in the dermal papilla cells. Some reports also show the expression in the outer root sheath. They are not found in the hair bulb or the bulge [10]. They are activated by the binding of androgens—testosterone and the more potent dihydrotestosterone. The main action of androgen on the hair follicle is related to binding to androgen receptors in dermal papilla cells [11]. It causes an alteration in gene expression. Insulin-like growth factor (IGF-1) is the key signal responsible for hair follicle growth stimulation. By contrast, transforming growth factor-beta (TGF-beta) is regarded as the key signal responsible for hair follicle growth inhibition [2].

 

Conclusions

Subcutaneous testosterone therapy was found to have a beneficial effect on scalp hair growth in female patients treated for symptoms of androgen deficiency. We propose this is due to an anabolic effect of testosterone on hair growth. The fact that no subject complained of hair loss as a result of treatment casts doubt on the presumed role of testosterone in driving female scalp hair loss. These results need to be confirmed by formal measurements of hair growth.

Can Low Testosterone Level Cause Hair Loss?

 

Low testosterone and hair loss have a connection. Mostly, it affects the thinning or loss of male hair. This includes facial and body hair loss in males. Any hormonal imbalance in our body can directly affect our hair growth cycle. Therefore, when there is a rapid fall of the free testosterone in our blood, it affects our hair growth and usually leads to baldness in front and crown region.

 

 

[sunsurfhair]

On 2/20/2023 at 9:40 PM, Jayson1361 said:

Previous post didn’t update so I’ll repost. Having such low DHT from using Avodart and Pumpkin Seed Oil(test prior to using PSO and after confirm this)… hairloss is progressing rather slowly. These pictures are directly under some harsh lighting in the bathroom  

What was your pumpkin seed oil dosage and do you know what your DHT looked like on PSO alone vs Dutasteride? Did the PSO give good benefits you could see? Thanks!

[Jayson1361]

44 minutes ago, sunsurfhair said:

What was your pumpkin seed oil dosage and do you know what your DHT looked like on PSO alone vs Dutasteride? Did the PSO give good benefits you could see? Thanks!

Pre PSO it was around double almost triple all be it still low as Avodart was doing its thing. If I remember correctly it was around 6.8-7.2 relative to levels posted at the start of this thread. I do not have blood test levels on PSO alone. The dosage I take is 3000mg per day. It’s hard to say if I saw benefits relative to hairloss. My opinion is my skin looked better but relative to hairloss it’s just so hard to measure. But, I also started drinking much more water with a little chlorophyll added. 

[Tiger2050]

On 2/20/2023 at 10:40 PM, Jayson1361 said:

Previous post didn’t update so I’ll repost. Having such low DHT from using Avodart and Pumpkin Seed Oil(test prior to using PSO and after confirm this)… hairloss is progressing rather slowly. These pictures are directly under some harsh lighting in the bathroom  

Your hair looks amazing considering your age and nobody would think you have hair loss if you were walking down the street. There’s a strong possibility you will end up regretting surgery, a transplanted hairline will never look as natural as your current hairline. We are each our own worst critic and you will probably find something to nitpick even if surgery goes perfectly.

Edited February 24, 2023 by Tiger2050

[Rafael Manelli]

Blown away that you’re almost 50. Hair looks like a man half that age.

[Jayson1361]

4 hours ago, Tiger2050 said:

Your hair looks amazing considering your age and nobody would think you have hair loss if you were walking down the street. There’s a strong possibility you will end up regretting surgery, a transplanted hairline will never look as natural as your current hairline. We are each our own worst critic and you will probably find something to nitpick even if surgery goes perfectly.

Well, I appreciate that. I’m certainly not here to solicit compliments but thanks. I think the leave in hair conditioner and blow dryer helps. Yeah there’s certainly some validity to your statement I could regret it. I suppose that’s why I chose Dr Konior. To minimize regret if there is some. Certainly there will probably be a fluctuation of emotions. But, after seeing all the results here on HRN it’s hard not to want to at least try to reinforce things. I mean I’ve almost made it to 50 here with meds, why not? Serious question, why not?  Plus there’s story after story of people seeking a procedure when meds stop working. I mean I suppose if meds are continued for whatever time frame they’ll still be effective even though diminished over time, maybe… who knows🤷‍♂️.. pharmacology clearly isn’t an exact science in vivo + time based on the person. For as advanced as things are I think humanity is still rather entry level for medical technology, which is the scope of this website, not to mention… well everything else 😂😂

 Regardless, why not try when complications are mitigated by experience with a guy like Dr K, and meds. You have obviously hit on a thought that crosses my mind though. 
 

Ultimately, Avodart has clearly helped or delayed the thinning process I’m thinking. Also, oral Min is a double edged sword if indeed we accept the effectiveness diminishes over time. If it does I’m glad I waited until now to try it. Just over 4 months in. However, it has significantly reduced hair shedding around the 3.5 month mark, which makes me wish I started earlier. Where I use to come home from work after 8-12 hours and aggressively run fingers though my hair or a pick I could see 30+ hairs or more maybe even 50 hairs fall. I took this in stride thinking 50-100 hairs a day shed. Perhaps some got caught up in any product I was using🤷‍♂️. Now though at anytime I try the same process I might see 5-10 hairs. So I’ll continue on and possibly seek to improve things with Dr K. Who knows maybe I won’t, maybe I’ll chicken out and sacrifice my deposit… but you have struck a nerve because I do think about regretting things…I mean it is a surgery. 

[Sunset Dune]

On 2/20/2023 at 9:40 PM, Jayson1361 said:

Previous post didn’t update so I’ll repost. Having such low DHT from using Avodart and Pumpkin Seed Oil(test prior to using PSO and after confirm this)… hairloss is progressing rather slowly. These pictures are directly under some harsh lighting in the bathroom  

Dude when you said were you 50 I was just shocked…these pictures look like a guy in his mid 20s…your hair is beautiful btw 

[Tiger2050]

9 hours ago, Jayson1361 said:

I suppose that’s why I chose Dr Konior. To minimize regret if there is some. Certainly there will probably be a fluctuation of emotions. But, after seeing all the results here on HRN it’s hard not to want to at least try to reinforce things. I mean I’ve almost made it to 50 here with meds, why not? Serious question, why not?  Plus there’s story after story of people seeking a procedure when meds stop working. I mean I suppose if meds are continued for whatever time frame they’ll still be effective even though diminished over time, maybe… who knows

Because surgery is risky and you don’t have hair loss. I’m a Dr. K patient and think the world of him but he won’t be able to create a hairline that’s as natural as your current one, no doctor can. I think you might be over analyzing normal shedding as meds not working, you have near perfect density in your pictures and it seems unlikely your hair loss will progress any further given your age and medical regimen.

[Jayson1361]

2 hours ago, Tiger2050 said:

Because surgery is risky and you don’t have hair loss. I’m a Dr. K patient and think the world of him but he won’t be able to create a hairline that’s as natural as your current one, no doctor can. I think you might be over analyzing normal shedding as meds not working, you have near perfect density in your pictures and it seems unlikely your hair loss will progress any further given your age and medical regimen.

I have minor recession of the hairline left and right and thinning behind the hairline. With acceptable density elsewhere which I believe is due to a few styling products and obviously medication. Acceptable for now. I believe wet hair shows thinning well enough.  However, I don’t ever wear my hair wet and base how I feel about my hair by how I can get it to look  

[stephcurry30]

On 2/20/2023 at 9:40 PM, Jayson1361 said:

Previous post didn’t update so I’ll repost. Having such low DHT from using Avodart and Pumpkin Seed Oil(test prior to using PSO and after confirm this)… hairloss is progressing rather slowly. These pictures are directly under some harsh lighting in the bathroom  

Brah if I saw you in person, I would of never guessed you were balding. you are a norwood 1.5. 

Mad jealous!

[jim1973]

On 2/23/2023 at 1:32 PM, sunsurfhair said:

That’s actually not entirely true. Believe it or not, excluding DHT, Testosterone AND Estradiol can have positive effects on hair growth. That’s why the endocrine system is like a beautiful symphony. One thing out of whack and the entire symphony can be thrown off. It’s a delicate balance. All hormones, INCLUDING DHT have positive (and negative) effects in the body when either too high or too low.

Now that being said, men who are “DHT sensitive” are the ones who get the most benefit with DHT reduction from a 5AR. There are many men who can have higher levels of DHT and/or Test and do not lose hair. Hair is loss is much more complicated then just shutting down DHT. I wonder if another treatment angle would be some way to reduce the DHT sensitivity of the follicles (AR) vs just blocking DHT. 

 

3.1.2. Androgen Receptor

Androgens act through an intracellular androgen receptor in the cells of the hair follicle [9]. Androgen receptors are located in human hair follicles in the dermal papilla cells. Some reports also show the expression in the outer root sheath. They are not found in the hair bulb or the bulge [10]. They are activated by the binding of androgens—testosterone and the more potent dihydrotestosterone. The main action of androgen on the hair follicle is related to binding to androgen receptors in dermal papilla cells [11]. It causes an alteration in gene expression. Insulin-like growth factor (IGF-1) is the key signal responsible for hair follicle growth stimulation. By contrast, transforming growth factor-beta (TGF-beta) is regarded as the key signal responsible for hair follicle growth inhibition [2].

 

Conclusions

Subcutaneous testosterone therapy was found to have a beneficial effect on scalp hair growth in female patients treated for symptoms of androgen deficiency. We propose this is due to an anabolic effect of testosterone on hair growth. The fact that no subject complained of hair loss as a result of treatment casts doubt on the presumed role of testosterone in driving female scalp hair loss. These results need to be confirmed by formal measurements of hair growth.

Can Low Testosterone Level Cause Hair Loss?

 

Low testosterone and hair loss have a connection. Mostly, it affects the thinning or loss of male hair. This includes facial and body hair loss in males. Any hormonal imbalance in our body can directly affect our hair growth cycle. Therefore, when there is a rapid fall of the free testosterone in our blood, it affects our hair growth and usually leads to baldness in front and crown region.

 

 

 

[jim1973]

Just now, jim1973 said:

 

This thread caught my attention because I'm also taking oral Dutasteride, oral Minoxidil (for almost 1 year) but still losing hair fast.  I'm also 50 but have been slowing losing hair for 30 years.  This is the fastest I've been losing hair so I'm wondering if I need one of these topical antiandrogens.  You seem to be familar with topical options so wondering if you could offer any advice on what else I can do.