Robert_

I think it would depend on how long a minoxidil user has been using it. I've been on it for years so I'm not getting any growth benefit from it - only maintenance. I'm also going through a killer "fall shed" which I always get for some reason so I'd have to take that into consideration if I were to take part. We'd have to set up some guidelines. If anyone is interested in participating, reply to the thread! Let's get something going here! -Robert

Like I said in the other thread I used American Crew's copper peptides shampoo and conditioner for a little while but I dropped them because I am fond of my regular shampoo and conditioner. I may try folligen's cream when I get around to it. I've looked into copper peptides periodically for the last few years. The science looks great, but there is just next to NO anectodal evidence that it actually does much to write home about. Perhaps if we get enough guys willing to participate in a little study of our own? Anyone willing to try a copper peptide product for 6 months or so? I think if we got 8 or 10 guys to do it, we can possibly get some kind of notion of its efficacy. -Robert

I'm blow-drying for about 30 seconds max. Directions be damned, it makes my hair look a little better. Of course, I may be screwing the pooch on the entire application and ruining this whole month but I'm not that worried - I'll be returning to traditional minoxidil after this can is gone. The foam may be a bit more convenient and all, but I really feel I get too much in my hair as opposed to the lotion. I had my procedure down pat with the old stuff and it worked well for me. You know what they say, "if it ain't broke..." -Robert

Good God. This is how much of a wuss I am, I guess. I can take a lot as far as getting injured is concerned (in fact, I just got hit by a car a couple of weeks ago) but the thought of pulling the staples out myself makes me dizzy. You're a bigger man than me, Bill. -Robert

I've been taking Avodart for 2 years now. I'm a big fan of it. However, before you go running off to get your own little yellow pills, please take the time to know the possible risks. The half-life of the drug is MUCH longer than that of Propecia/Proscar. So if you suffer from side effects, they can take MONTHS to disappear as opposed to merely days or weeks with the Propecia. Check out these articles I wrote on Avodart that I posted on the Hair Loss Q & A blog: Propecia vs. Avodart: Which Internal DHT Inhibitor Should You Choose? Part 1 Propecia vs. Avodart: Which Internal DHT Inhibitor Should You Choose? Part 2 Avodart (Dutasteride) Dosing Charts And here are some more articles on Propecia and Proscar you may be interested in: Propecia 101 Save money on your Propecia Propecia (Finasteride) Dosing Chart Yeah, I know it's a lot of reading. It was a lot of research and writing too. But it will help you determine (along with your doc, of course) if Avodart is a possible viable solution for you or if you should just stick with the Propecia. I really don't think that taking 5mg of finasteride (which is what you're taking when you take a full Proscar pill) per day is going to give you much, if any, improvement over the 1 mg per day. But that's just my opinion. -Robert

I think that the multiple delivery systems are meant as a convenience, not as a system. Meaning that if you don't feel like using it as a shampoo, you can just use the cream. If you hate the cream, they have a spray. And so on. I definitely think using more than two of them would be overkill to the nth degree. -Robert

There are actually three Shapiros, to be exact. The Coalition's Dr. Ron Shapiro has been training his brother Paul Shapiro for a few years now. Dr. Paul Shapiro is performing great work and will no doubt be an industry leader. -Robert

Dr. Reddy's has recently released a generic Proscar. That is probably your best bet instead of trying to chase down Propecia. Use a pill cutter to split the pill into quarters and take a quarter a day. Please don't take what I'm telling you as medical advice. Consult a physician to get this medication. Also look into starting a regimen of 5% minoxidil (Rogaine) applied twice daily to your crown area. Use that for a year (at the LEAST) before seriously considering a hair transplant. If you are diligent (keyword being diligent), you will likely see some good results. Good luck! -Robert

Which Dr. Shapiro? There is more than one. There is one located in Florida that is not a part of the Coalition. The Dr. Shapiro that is a part of the Coalition is Dr. Ron Shapiro of Minnesota. I agree with the other posters that you would be doing yourself a GREAT service by reesearching your chosen physician a little more. Dr. Tykocinski offers world-class hair restoration in Brazil. Please don't let price be a major consideration for you. Ask yourself what is more expensive? A great hair restoration procedure that will be natural and flattering for the rest of your life or a cheaper procedure by an unresearched doctor that may cause you to end up needing costly repair work? Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to scare you. However, I and the others on this forum have seen unfortunate results so, so many times before. We just hate to hear about someone else going into a procedure blind. We really do hold ourselves up to the responsibility of making every attempt to caution you and help you out any way possible. And many times great doctors are not the cheapest. Here in the U.S. or elsewhere. Just look at the rates the "hair mills" charge in comparison with the Coalition physicians - most of the time it's about double or MORE. Let me know if you have any questions, I'd be glad to help you out along with all the other very knowledgable posters here. -Robert

NIzoral 2% dries my hair out too. I just follow it with Nioxin shampoo and that tends to make it a little better, but doesn't completely put the moisture back in. I just know that on those days my hair will be a little straw-y. I've used copper peptides in the form of American Crew's shampoo and conditioner before. I honestly didn't give it much of a shot. But I have my favorites as far as shampoo and conditioners go and to add yet another combo in the mix would be overkill. I am thinking of trying folligen's cream a shot sometime, if I get around to it, that is. I don't think copper peptides are junk science or snake oil at all, but I don't think that it's some kind of miracle cure. It certainly won't take the place of minoxidil or propecia, but used in conjunction with them I can see where it can possibly help a good bit. -Robert

Yeah, it can very well be the weight loss, but better safe than sorry when it comes to your heart. And dude, don't worry about your hair at the gym. To this day, I wear a backwards ball cap at the gym. It's totally normal and keeps my hair from pasting to my forehead. Just throw it on and forget about it, get in there and move some weight around. Good luck, bro. -Robert

dhuge, Those are some good prices. I'm really into BSN products like CellMass, Nitrix, and NO-Explod right now and their prices are really good on those. I typically go through Bodybuilding.com and the difference is about $5 apiece so I'm going to stick with them since they've never done me wrong and I get my stuff fast, fast, fast. But I will definitely consider this place if BB.com ever slips up! -Robert

I just let them wonder. Seriously, though. Even though the transplants take only a few short months to start growing, it's slow enough that those that see you day-to-day aren't really going to notice. And those that don't see you every day probably won't be able to put their finger on what it is that is different about you. But you'll know. Anyone that has noticed my new hair that I didn't just up and tell I had a hair restoration procedure done were content with me just telling them "Hey, they have pills for that now, don't you know?" The average person's knowledge of hair restoration treatment is surprisingly lacking and most don't care too much about it anyway. So while your question is valid and one I asked before my own procedures, you will find that it won't be as big of an issue as you may think. -Robert

Rogaine (minoxidil) can accelerate your heart rate so if you are having an inordinate amount of pain or discomfort definitely let your doc know. And don't stay away from the gym because you think it accelerated your hair loss. I have heard a million times how people think that working out will increase testosterone which will lead to increased DHT which will lead to more hair loss. Any amount of increased DHT production will be so minute that the extra two hairs per day you lose is absolutely nothing as compared to the benefits you recieve from a normal exercise regimen. Go to the gym. Don't let hair loss stop you. Trust me on this one. You may also want to look into splitting Proscar to save you some money on your finasteride. Do a forum search on Proscar and you will find a ton of posts on it. -Robert

tkerr, Thanks! It's good to be back. 2% is, of course, going to be more effective, but really only marginally. I mean, of course if you can get the 2% (available by prescription only in the U.S.) then I would say to go that route but if it's downright impossible or a real hassle, then I don't think you'll be missing out on too much by using the 1% OTC Nizoral AD. Typically, those that use 2% Nizoral do so 3 times a week. I do that myself. If you absolutely cannot get a script for the 2% and have to use the OTC 1% you can up that from 3x to 4x per week. That may help to offset the difference in percentages. Let it sit for at least 5 minutes. I usually put it in before I get in the shower and do other stuff like brush my teeth, etc. while it sits. Then, when I get in the shower I use my regular conditioner (Nioxin). Hope this helps! -Robert

compgeek, Welcome to the forums. You are right that minoxidil (even the foam) can be kind of a pain. However, before you select Propecia (or Proscar) over it, you have to realize how differently they work and how both can play a major part in helping you keep the hair you have and possibly regrow the hair you have lost. Take a look at my blog posts on minoxidil here . As far as the docs, go. I am under the firm impression that if you don't feel comfortable with a doc, then your overall experience probably isn't going to be that positive. Plus, low-level laser therapy, while sometimes shows promising results, is something you can try down the road. I'd go with the *proven* minixidil, finasteride, nizoral combo for a year first. I can almost guarantee you'll be impressed with the results you get if you use them diligently. -Robert

using this name, You can contact me via private message if you'd like by left-clicking on my name and selecting from the drop-down box: "Invite to a Private Topic." -Robert

I just picked up a can of the foam myself. I plan on writing up a full review of it in a couple of days but I'll go ahead and give my knee-jerk reaction to it: It is certainl not as greasy or as irritating as the traditional minoxidil lotion. Well, as far as I can tell, anyway. The traditional lotion didn't irritate me other than some itchiness and that was taken care of by using Nizoral 2% regularly. It also dries fairly quickly. I put it on right after a shower, allow it to dry for a few minutes and then blow over it with a hair dryer for 45 seconds to a minute and it's really like I never applied anything. I can then apply Toppik like normal. It leaves my hair feeling a little hard, as if I had put a little mousse in it or something, but it isn't bad. It actually (kind of) has a bit of a thickening effect, but that's nothing to get excited about. All-in-all, I like it. I have been spoiled by buying a three month suplly of generic minoxidil at the same price as one bottle of this foam, but the mess it makes of my hair in the morning when I have to be out of the house is atrocious and caused me to miss a lot of application days. My bottom line: so far so good. -Robert

Whynot, Welcome to the forums. I am confident that a well-planned hair restoration surgery (or multiple surgeries) can be a successful venture for your if you are reasonable in your expectations. Reasonable as in, you will never regain a full head of hair with current hair restoration options. However, with the latest techniques in ultra-refined follicular unit hair transplantation the illusion of coverage can go a very long way. Don't be put off by that word "illusion." For instance, a person generally is not visibly thinning until a full 50% of his native hair has already jumped ship. That means, for all areas that you would like to have good coverage regained, you can have transplant far less than what you originally had to achieve awesome results. With the impeccable artistry of Coalition hair restoration surgeons, the number needed for an aesthetically-pleasing result can be remarkably small. However, here is where your expectations need to be reasonable. You have lost a lot of hair. You aren't going to get it all back. I'm sure you know this already since you seem like an intelligent guy, but if anyone has to be the bearer of bad news, it may as well be me. You are doing good to start on the Propecia, the minoxidil, and the nizoral. Use them diligently. As in, NO DAYS OFF. Ok, ok. Give yourself one day off a month. But no more. We have hair to grow here. Now, as you may or may not know, all of those products work best on the crown. They just do. You also have a lot of sparse real estate back there. The crown can be a virtual "black hole" for grafts. Eats them right up. Now considering all of this, you may want to consider an initial procedure that concentrates on framing your face; that concentrates on your hair line and forelock. You can have a hairline back that will suit your face today and 50 years from now. Take a look at my own pics in my hair loss weblog if you want an example of this. While that initial HT is growing in, you will be giving yourself time to see how you react to the Propecia, the minoxidil, and the nizoral. Don't expect miracles, but you may be surprised and see some growth back there on your crown. Some guys respond really well to it but it takes a few months to see. During that time, your first HT will be growing in. You could be sitting pretty well in a year's time with some good planning and diligence with the meds. Dr. True is a fantastic physician and I have watched both he and his colleague, Dr. Dorin perform surgery myself. I would have absolutely no qualms about sitting in the chair with either of them doing surgery on me. So I recommend them both highly. You can read about and see photos from my visit to their clinic here. I hope this helps and I'll be around if you have any more questions. Good luck! -Robert

Wow, I missed out on some great conversation in this thread! Bill, you gave a good rundown of what we all feel. Our actual appearance almost never represents the way we see ourselves. Our "minds eye," so to speak, is generally a much more accurate representation of how we feel. I think there are generally two kinds of people when it comes to how humans see themselves in a mirror: optimists and pessimists. The optimist looks at himself in the mirror and is either content or sees things he would like to change and takes action to do so. This person, in general, is probably more apt to be the same way in other areas of his life: business, romance, etc. He is a go-getter; a take-charge kind of guy. The second is the guy that looks in the mirror and just gets depressed. Instead of taking action, he lets the negativity of how he percieves himself to poison his self-esteem, therefor affecting the rest of his life as well. There are both types of people here on the forums. The optimist is no better than the pessimist, per se; but guys that have taken action to become what they want can help the other guys out. And that's what the forums are for. To help give the other guy a leg up. And by action, I certainly don't mean to run out and get a hair transplant right away. There is, of course, a difference between action and recklessness. However, the action of starting, of learning, of getting that motion of inertia behind you, is really the hardest part. Once you get it rolling it's all downhill from there. And no matter what, it's never worth crying in your soup over. I have friends that are in their late 20s and are NW6s. Yeah, I've taken them to the side and talked to one or two of them about what can be done. Some listen and some are (believe it or not) content to "bic" it all off and just not worry with it. Am I just a bit jealous? Hell yeah I am! But I'm just one of those guys that looks terrible with a bald head. It would never work for me. Confidence is the key, gentleman. And if you can't change something about yourself then you just have to let it go. Good discussion, Bill. And it's good to see you're still on the forums. -Robert

It depends on the physicians' preferences, but most great physicians can accomodate you if you prefer to keep your native hair. Dr. Cooley was able to safely place grafts in between my native hair without causing shock loss and without shaving the area at all. You can see photos of this under the very first entry in my hair loss weblog. Check it out in my signature line. -Robert

The same factor that causes scalp hair loss also increses body hair - go figure. So it is quite common for Propecia users to experience decreased body hair while on the medication. Consider it an added bonus (that is, if you don't want it). Trips, you are probably experiencing a temporary shed. Conduct a search for the term "shedding" under the "find" button to learn moe about this phenomenon. -Robert

Yup. Your new best friends will begin jumping ship any minute now. It's a good sign, though - a sign of progress. If I had to put a number on the number of grafts that will stick around for the average patient, I'd say about 85% shed and the rest stick around. All just part of the fun! -Robert

Shedding is dependant on the individual. While I had a few good sheds, you may not experience any. I had one at about 2 months after I started the drug that was pretty rough, but nothing I lost sleep over. I think the idea of shedding is more traumatic than actually going through it. It really isn't that bad - especially when you keep in mind that the shedding's very existance verifies that the drug is working for you. If you aren't on Propecia do yourself a favor and get on that first. Avodart is nothing to jump head first into. While I don't experience any side effects (that I know of) the potential for serious effects are there, especially since it inhibits 5AR-1, which is located in the brain. I mean, who knows? I could just keel over any minu... Heh heh. Just a little joke there. Hope this helps. -Robert

There are a few hair restoration physicians that practice in India. Do a search on the forums and you'll find plenty of posts. To do a search, click on the "Find" button, select "Advanced Search" (otherwise your search will be limited), enter your keyword (ex: "India") and click "Submit." I can't give a recommendation on who is good and who is not in India, so I apologize. However, there is a number of posters on the forums that have had procedures with Indian doctors so you should get plenty of feedback. Best of luck to you! -Robert