Surfarosa

I fully agree with EpSc - photo's do not show anything beyond an impression of what is happening. I could show you picture of my hairline that makes it look like a brick wall. You have to move the hair and look at HTs with a naked eye to really understand what you are dealing with. Also, wetting the hair really helps.

RCWest - I have super fine hair. My density is comparable to my safe zones - I just have really, really fine hair. My work has been looked at by 2 other coalition doctors who agree the work is great given my fine hair. The plus side is that it looks natural......

Thanks for the advice guys. Concealers are not a viable option for me as I live in bright sunshine year round. A thinning crown is kinda OK with me these days. It hurt in my early 20s but I feel it's somewhat stable & matches the rest of my thinning. Hopefully the meds will continue to be my friend. Also, without concealer the white bits can tan and that improves the appearance by taking away the "white flash" of skin ! Hairline & front 2/3 must be the sacred grail IMHO.

CopaSurfa - My hairline is dense packed. Approx 60 FU per cm. You hair is thicker & mine is very fine. Yes it is see-thru - I think that is inevitable with any HT unless you are a NW2 with great hair characteristics. Mattj - 50-60 singles pscm is considered dense packed right ? CopaSurfa - I wanted the same thing as you desire. But HTs can only go so far. Get back on the Minox - you don't have to stop it before surgery - that's bogus! Meds are you friend - see the post I did showing my crown. Surgery is not an answer on its own. What we want and what we can have are not always the same. You have to accept you will look better but not 20 again IMHO ! If you shop long enough someone will tell you what you want to hear. My new goal = look as good as I can whilst looking natural. Your hair is just one part of your appearance but to those of us hair obsessed it becomes everything. I feel you man but you have to listen to those who have done this. No surgeon is so skilled that he can change the absolute constraints of HTs - period.

A surgery shot showing the design

Thanks EpSceptic - I'm going to show all the pics - including surgeries - if you would like. There must be a better place to post multiple pics. An album maybe ? I'm new to adding pics but felt its time to stop just watching & start adding to the community ! Bottom line HTs are always see-thru. CopaSurfa you need to understand that my friend. Photo's show nothing ! I've been there, gotten great work (verified by coalition doctors) & its still not as dense as I would like. Now you have to accept the limitations that I mentioned in other posts. I fear for you that "good as it gets" may well not be "good enough" my friend.

Her is the left side in 2003 6 months after a tiny 500 FUG procedure (I wanted to check the results before committing).

I'm posting this to show the effects of getting on Propecia early. I got on it in 1998 I think (I bought Proscar online). In 2007/8 I really felt it was losing it's efficacy & got on Avodart. Avodart seemed to really take the baton from Propecia and I had zero side effects. I hope this is useful. Just learned how to post pics and I have a library form many years !

Here's the crown in 2002

I have had a couple doctors suggest starting some crown work but it scares the hell out of me as I'm really concerned that I've already had 3000 single hair graphs in my hairline. I'm nearly 36 and have been losing my hair since I was 20. Luckily I got on Proscar, then Propecia & now Avodart. I will post a pic of my crown 10 years ago after this. The thing is my crown is the dead give away as I have dark hair and a white scalp - it's what screams hair-loss - my hairline just looks mature. As for how thin I am, that's the really difficult part as my hair is very fine. When I compare to the safe zones its quite hard to tell a difference. I can make any part of my head look thin due to my hair characteristics.

Ok - here we go - this is the left side of a 3000 single hair graph hairline reconstruction. EpSceptic - be gentle ! I am 36 years old in a couple of months & have been losing my hair since I was 20. If I can get this pic up I will post more including the outside top down shots. These pics look harsh compared to the flash ones. Skeptic is right - indoor with flash does nothing for critical analysis but make you feel great !

I will post some pics but need to get some taken without my face showing. What kind of shots would you like to see ? Is it better with flash or without? I usually wear my hair forward so would really need to brush it back to show the hairline.

Your hair color is also very very favorable. I have fine dark hair.

BTW - I tried to get the result (a more modest result than you seek I think) with 1500 & was back for another 1800 asap. Wish I had done that in one shot. A waste of recovery time and emotional energy. The time after surgery is truly awful - get it right first time Copasurfer. BTW I'm having consults again now as I'm concerned about what is happening on the rest of my head. Had PRP 3 months ago. I've just become so paranoid that 3000 in just the hairline was a mistake. I think I'm totally wrong (let's hope so) but am seeking reassurance to calm my fears. People think my hair looks great but the fact I know I had surgery & I am on meds makes me paranoid. I also have a slight imbalance that could be fixed with a few hundred graphs but I'm too over the whole process right now.

I doubt 2000 would get you the result - but you have more corse hair than I do so maybe. I have had 3000 in my hairline. As Doc Feller said, singles is the only option for someone with your goals. I'd also drop the FUE option. Strip will give you the best quality & yield. Unless you want to clipper cut your hair then what's the point (I actually wanted to clipper cut my hair so am really bummed this option is off the table). I started properly at 31 (small procedure at 28 - 500 FUs) & had a second at 33. I'm 36 in a couple of months. Looks like I'm very close to you in terms of age and goals. If I can help I will. The whole thing was and remains an incredibly difficult journey emotionally most of all because I had no person to relate to. Even on the forums it's v. hard to find input that actually pertains to your case. If you need a hair buddy I've been researching this stuff for 14 years. 1st advice is get back on the Minox asap. I made that mistake. Just use the foam at night. The twice a day thing is a pain and not necessary IMHO.

How old are you now ? Do you have any thinning in the crown ?

CopaSurfer - I have had nearly 3000 single hair graphs in my hairline over 3 surgeries (1 baby one of 500-600 when I was 25). I starting receding in late teens I think. 2006 & 2008 I had the hairline restored. I'm 36 in a few months. If it sounds like my case is close to yours (I have not read all your stuff yet) let me know if I can help.

Good luck brother !

It's all so individual. I'm glad I have had work done (if I maintain reasonably from here). The results are very, very good but HT is a very limited and fundamentally difficult game. My hair stylist is my best friend (and brutally candid) & she cannot tell. Think about it from a simple facts perspective: 1. There is no widely accepted objective measure of hair loss - it's a guessing game based on pictures etc = brain damage & way too much opinion vs. science. HT has a huge quantitative dimension yet we cannot measure stability beyond looking at miniaturization? 2. There is limited donor supply for an unknown quantitative task !! Very risky - would you start building a bridge across a canyon if you did not know for sure you had enough to get there ? What design would you use. Your life depends upon getting it right. 3. The condition is progressive (drugs help but do they really stop ? If they did halt the process then this factor would less important). 4. The qualitative aspect is mind blowing in terms of artistry and technique. 5. The baldies last resort (shave or buzz your melon) is eliminated once you cut that first donor strip. These fact make it a pretty crazy task. Use a limited amount of stuff to fix a problem that is only getting worse, whilst potentially causing more problems.

Danielkiwi - I have no experience with FUE & it would totally depend on your individual case. I would consider FUE if I decided to do say 500-700 more in one session. I say this as I have an imbalance in my hairline & can't decide if it's worth the brain damage of another procedure (I've had 3) to address.

RE001 - Do yourself a favor bro - get on Propecia asap. When that starts to not work as well in your 30s switch it up to Avodart - hopefully you will not get side effects. EpilepticSceptic is right to highlight that a man's mind evolves and changes over time. I guarantee you will regret not saving what you have. I started on Proscar when I was 22. I still have the appearance of a full head of hair with the help of 3000 FUGs. I'm 36 in a couple of months. HT's are nothing compared to keeping what you have. If you wish to forgo part of the process, skip the the HT - it's a complete pain in the ass & so much stress & anxiety. And it is still a crap shoot. You look good with clipped hair. Take the pill & rock that look and you will be all good my man.

Can't decide - you are correct and yes we are indeed a strange bunch in that we get a HT in order to cut our hair short. I think that most guys want the same thing - a decent perimeter (hairline) & good density. The (well one of the many) cruel reality of HT is that styling really is very, very limited. The 2 main options facing a hair loss suffer is to either buzz it or get a HT (going on meds I taken as a given). What would be great is if you could do both. HT for perimeter, buzz for appearance of density & a hassle free style. That was kinda my goal. The truth is that if you buzz, it seems you will be showing your scars. Unless you have really thick hair perhaps. if you are like me the #1 goal is not to be found out. Scars are a dead give away. Yes most would not notice but then most don't need to. One person spots it & you can be sure your entire world will know before you do. People are cruel. Scottish guy's style was the ideal IMO.

I have had a second opinion on my scars by a Coalition Dr. from this site (to check they were in good shape) & was told that my scars are excellent. I was really surprised I could not clip to at least a #4. I am going to maybe try - what is one barbers opinion anyway? It will grow back & I can always wear a hat. I'm just sick of styling my hair & it's been 2 years since my last procedure. I have very fine hair and it can be hard to keep in any style & I'm very active. My Dr. is not popular on this site so I wont post his name.

Scottish guy - I think the improvement is significant & completely natural. Has anyone noticed or commented? Also, are you happy with the appearance of your scar with a #4 clip? I went to a barber yesterday and was bummed when he told me I could only clip to a #6.

EpilepticSceptic - why throw words like freak around ? The guys is clearly concerned and does not need words like that in his head. Hair can be permanently removed far more convincingly and effectively than it can be added. I had work done at 28 - it's a different game with younger patients.