pkipling

Hey Steve. Welcome on board. I think your best bet is to take a look at the full list of recommended doctors here on this site. Then look at their results, patient reviews, etc. and go from there. There are lots of HT doctors out there, but to make the most out of quality forums like this one, it's best to take these recommendations into account when looking for a doctor.

Obviously, I support Dr. Mohebi and would highly recommend him - especially if you're looking to stay in the LA/OC area. But most importantly, do your research and make an informed decision that feels right for you. What factors are most important vary from individual to individual, whether this be location, price, availability, etc. However, the most important factor is that you choose a surgeon who does good work, whether that be here in SoCal, Canada, or even somewhere in Europe - and this forum is a great place to find those. Start to get a list together of some of your top picks and then weigh the pros and cons from there.

If you have any specific questions regarding my experience with Dr. Mohebi, feel free to message me privately.

Best of luck!

Based on the placement alone, I vote whorl as well. It's very off centered and would be a strange place for balding to start - almost in the back of your head. I'd really be surprised if it turned out to be balding.

On a side note - you seriously do have a great head of hair - making lots of us guys on the board quite envious, I'm sure. :cool:

Are you serious? 120 pills at $10?

:eek:

Haha. Not quite. I should've clarified... I get 30 pills for under $10, but I get the 5mg and cut them into quarters. It's a shortcut that allows you to get more bang for your buck. So essentially, the one prescription lasts me about 4 months.

Thanks guys, very helpful. The only thing is where to buy it, can i just go to my doctor and the chemist or buy online somewhere?

The Rogaine/Minoxidil you can just buy at your local drugstore. I get a prescription for Finasteride from my doctor - and the generic is pretty cheap. I get a 4 months supply for under $10. I think some guys buy it online, but I'm not familiar with how that works. I think the safest bet is to get a prescription from your doc.

I had the same type of sensations after my surgery as well, but mine were in the donor area and subsided after the first couple months. Gillenator is correct in that it seems to just be irritated nerves, as that was what was causing mine as well. They felt like electrical shocks to my scalp almost, and it was sometimes even hard to pinpoint the exact central point of pain. The only thing I found that would help ease the pain for me was to put an ice pack on the areas that seemed to be irritated. It would numb the scalp just enough that the pain would subside and I could get some sleep, since mine seemed to be worse at night. I believe this was because my mind was quiet and I was therefore more focused on/sensitive to the discomfort.

So scabs in themselves can cause a graft to be dislodged? How?

Not the existence of the scab itself, but pulling on a scab instead of letting it run its course could cause a graft to be dislodged through day 8. I don't believe the mere existence of the scabs would affect growth, though you'll see that even that is being debated in this thread.

The primary point though, according to this study, is that the grafts should be completely secure by day 9. I think that's a very comforting fact to know post-surgery when so many of us are so paranoid and afraid of dislodging the grafts - some guys even for several weeks after surgery.

"The study showed that for the first two days, pulling on a hair always resulted in a lost graft, but the chance of the graft being removed started to decrease by the third day. By the sixth day pulling on a hair would no longer dislodge the graft. Pulling on an adherent scab always resulted in a lost graft through day five, with the incidence decreasing through day eight. However, by nine days post-op, grafts were no longer at risk of being dislodged."

The paranoia isn't going to do you any good, my friend. As difficult as it can be, try to just relax, especially since you're just now "coming up" on the 3 month mark. I told myself not to expect any significant improvements until at least the 6 month mark. That way if the hairs came in faster (which they did), I would be pleasantly surprised, but if they didn't, I wouldn't be disappointed.

And ZeoRanger is correct. Comparing your results with others on such a fairly loose timeline that varies from individual to individual may end up with you being more stressed out than you need to be. If you were concerned about growth at the 6-7 month mark, it would be worth looking into, but at this early stage, I think you should just wait it out. Keep your mind focused on other things and put your energy to use elsewhere. You'll be happier for it.

And regardless, happy growing! The fun is just about to begin.

Rogaine and minoxidil are the fertilizer if you will. The company promotes use of twice daily but if you look at the peak effect it is at 22 hours so once a day is fine. But it does not inhibit DHT, it only promotes hair that is resting to enter the growing phase ie fertilizer..... Proecia inhibits the conversion of testosterone to DHT. Sorry you were in small percent that did have an issue. Peak effect for this medication is at 72 hours so if you could even do 1/2 twice a week or even once there would be some effect. But, both of these products work on all areas. They do help to preserve the hairline. It is FDA mandate that if they want to promote this they would have to redo the billion dollar studies so they only say it works in the crown where it was tested. There is some evidence that topical caffeine products can also help. Hair Surge shampoo by Ultax labs has a lot of good ingredients and is one option. It can be ordered off the Internet. Another is Alpecian solution. It is not a shampoo. The supplement MSM seems to have some positive effects on hair. Ketaconazole shampoo and also even Head And Shoulders with Zinc have good properties and can help with scalp health.

Excellent point regarding the study and how they only focused on the crown, which is why it is technically only promoted as working on the crown. But the science behind why it is effective on the hairs in the crown area is just as applicable to hairs in the front as well. There should be no difference.

Anthro - I wouldn't worry too much about the side effects. Not only are they extremely rare, but should you experience them, you can always stop the medication and they will subside. Furthermore, due to the nature of the side effects most commonly associated with Finasteride being sexual, I believe a lot of these reported side effects are "mental". Any type of stress in our lives can lead to low libido, ED, etc. and many times, just the thought/fear of those things happening is just enough to actually cause those things to happen. Our minds are very powerful. Granted, I'm sure there are people who do genuinely experience the side effects, and I'm not discrediting their experiences. But there is a lot to be said for the power of suggestion.

Look at the WebMD phenomenon, for example. How many times do any of us go on WebMD looking for an explanation for whatever symptom we're experiencing, and within 20 minutes of "research" we've recognized 15 other symptoms we weren't aware of before and diagnosed ourselves with at least a handful of possible ailments before finally settling on the one that is probably the most fatal, only to go to the doctor and have him tell us that we simply have a cold as he then forbids us from ever using WebMD again... (Just me? :cool: )

The point I'm attempting to make is this: Try it out and try not to even think about any potential side effects. Chances are you'll be fine.

I would pay huge attention to scabbing and its prevention to be precise. I had 2 major scabs that formed after my transplant. Exactly where those large scabs formed was where i had a really poor yield. I think the scabs formation stopped the grafts anchoring properly.

It does seem that the problems are more likely to occur when the scabs come into play. I'm curious as to what all can be done to actually prevent scabbing from taking place. Aside from keeping the scalp very clean and following all the post-op care instructions, I wonder if some people are just more prone to scabbing than other. Regardless, according to the research, even the scabs are only problematic for the first 9 days.

I have heard it said that past two weeks the only way a graft can be dislodged is with the surgeon's scrapel, I.e. there is little if any physical trauma that could result in you losing grafts after this period. Having said that, I believe Dr Lorenzo instructs his patients not tp buzz their hair for at least six (6) months. Whether this has any relationship with him thinking the grafts are not completely secure then and/or susceptible to damage from the blades, I don't know.

Nine months must be addressing something totally different because even the slowest of healers are not going to have any dislodged grafts at that point in time...:rolleyes:

This was actually in another thread where a surgeon told a patient not to buzz his head for 9 months after his procedure, similar to what FUE2014 stated regarding Dr. Lorenzo's instructions to wait until month 6. Both of these seem excessive to me, and I can't think of a reason to wait that long if the grafts are completely secure within the first couple of weeks. Maybe they have a different reason altogether for why they have their patients wait so long to buzz their hair, but I can't think of what that would be. If the grafts are secure, I don't know what the issue is...

I've noticed the question coming up a lot about how long it takes after surgery for a graft to be completely secure, and based on the wide range of responses given, it seems that there is no definitive answer for this that is agreed upon. I've seen people giving answers ranging from 5 days, to 10, to 14, all the way up to even 9 months. I'm curious as to why so many doctors seem to have differing opinions on this, as it often seem like everyone is just pulling numbers out of thin air.

I was told when having my procedure that the first 72 hours were the most crucial, and that after the 5th day, the grafts would be firmly in place (given that there was no excessive scabbing). The scabs were often what caused a graft to be dislodged, but that even then, it was only a risk up until day 9 after surgery. Thus, by day 10 post-op, I could relax and breathe easily and stress free, knowing that I was out of the woods. However, many guys come on the forum and are stressed out 2, 3, even 4 weeks out of surgery that they may have damaged their grafts. Given what seems to be lots of misinformation online and in the medical community, I understand why they seem to be so worried.

Once I started seeing the large discrepancy on here about how long it took for the grafts to be anchored, I reached out to Dr. Mohebi about this. Dr. Mohebi then informed me that this is all based on a study done by Dr. Bernstein and Dr. Rassman where they set out to determine the definitive answer for this. According to the study, this is what they found:

"The study showed that for the first two days, pulling on a hair always resulted in a lost graft, but the chance of the graft being removed started to decrease by the third day. By the sixth day pulling on a hair would no longer dislodge the graft. Pulling on an adherent scab always resulted in a lost graft through day five, with the incidence decreasing through day eight. However, by nine days post-op, grafts were no longer at risk of being dislodged."

So that leaves me with this: Since the above time frame that I gave seems to be based on facts and research, where are the other numbers coming from? Are there other studies out there that show different results? Was there a study done that supports doctors telling patients they have to wait 9 months after surgery for their grafts to be secure? Why does there seem to be such a wide range of answers on what should be a seemingly scientific question? Do you think there's a way to come to a unified decision on this, or will there always be this large discrepancy?

Interested in hearing other thoughts and facts on this matter. It seems to be a topic that causes way more confusion than I think it should.

At the risk of being called crazy (or foolish, as I believe one member called me once before when commenting on a similar topic ), I buzzed my remaining native hairs to match the previously shaved donor/recipient areas 6 days after my surgery - all with complete success and zero complications - and with the go ahead from my doctor. Granted, I had a guard on the clippers and didn't run them across the actual recipient area, but I did very gently buzz down the remaining native hairs so that everything was uniform and didn't look strange.

According to research, the first 72 hours are the most crucial, and after day 5, the grafts are completely secure given there are no scabs present. If there are scabs, by day 9 even these are grafts are still secure. Based on this research, by day 14 it would be more than okay to buzz your hair. I understand that there are always going to be doctors/patients who err on the side of caution, and I do agree if you want to wait an additional week or two past these dates for your own peace of mind, there is no harm in that. But waiting 9 months seems more than excessive to me.

This is all based on a study done by Dr. Bernstein and Dr. Rassman. The results of their study concluded the following from Dr. Bernstein's website:

"The study showed that for the first two days, pulling on a hair always resulted in a lost graft, but the chance of the graft being removed started to decrease by the third day. By the sixth day pulling on a hair would no longer dislodge the graft. Pulling on an adherent scab always resulted in a lost graft through day five, with the incidence decreasing through day eight. However, by nine days post-op, grafts were no longer at risk of being dislodged."

As always, you should consult with your doctor and follow the guidelines that they have given you. However, do your due diligence to make sure that what you're being told is based in facts.

Thanks for these great replies -

 

I'm 3 months removed from surgery I just mean generally - will towel drying cause hairs to come out or fall out or is probably OK once hair has been established?

If anything, some would even say this is superior to blowdrying your hair, as the heat from the blowdryer can sometimes damage the hair depending on how long you expose the hair to the heat and how hot the air gets. (It won't damage the root/graft itself, obviously, but it can affect the health of the actual hair). I always towel dry mine first then finish it off with a quick blow dry. It just seems to style better that way for me.

Hey Sean. I think your best bet is to look at the full list of recommended doctors here on this site. Then look at their results, patient reviews, etc. and go from there. There are lots of HT doctors out there, but to make the most out of quality forums like this one, it's best to take these recommendations into account when looking for a doctor. You can also do a forum search for posts about the doctors you mentioned and see what others have said over the years. Dr. Ziering doesn't appear to have the best track record on here.

Obviously, I support Dr. Mohebi and would highly recommend him - especially if you're looking to stay in the LA area. But most importantly, do your research and make an informed decision that feels right for you.

Best of luck.

I've never heard of the temperature of the water being a factor when washing the hair after the transplant. The main things to watch avoid would be rubbing/scrubbing the grafts and/or applying hard water pressure to them. It sounds like you did everything correctly - gently applying the suds with the sponge, letting them soak, then slowly rinsing them with water from the sponge and/or a cup is the ideal method for me. I believe the temperature is a non-factor.

I'm not convinced that there's anything that is scientifically proven to reduce the redness. It really just matters on your skin type and how your scalp/skin responds to the procedure. The primary things you need to focus on is keeping it out of direct sunlight by wearing a hat when possible, applying sunscreen for times when a hat is not possible (the spray really worked well for me) and keeping it clean to prevent dryness/infection. Aside from that, I think you may just have to let it run its course.

I know some guys on the board have seemed to have had success with aloe vera, so that may be a good option to keep continuing. As always though, I would run anything you wish to apply to your scalp past your surgeon first to get their official opinion on the matter and to make sure you're following their post-operative guidelines.

You are correct in assuming that it's normal. The transplanted hairs will begin their own growth/shedding cycle just like our normal, native hairs. Nothing to worry about.

Even knowing this, I still get alarmed sometimes when I don't wash my hair for a couple days and the build of hairs that have shed over that time end up in my hands. It can take me back to when i first realized my hairline was receding.... Then I have to talk some very common sense back into myself... "It's totally normal. Hairs shed."

I had this for a bit too in my donor area where it looked almost identical to yours. I remember mine being more prominent in the back than the sides, but I was keeping my hair buzzed completely down, so it wasn't as noticeable as it is in your original photo. I agree that keeping it shorter makes it less obvious. However, it was indeed temporary and is completely undetectable now. You should be fine within a couple more months at the most.

Thomas:

 

yeah i think you are right.

if it is any consolation, the deign is great.

 

you can probable get a refund on the difference in the amount of grafts actually placed.

 

maybe go to one of the recommended docs on here and they have instrument that will be able to count exactly how many were placed. then you can go back to your doc and tell him: THE JIG IS UP!

 

ASIDE:

 

WOW! PK

 

If anyone is a poster child for FUE it is you!

 

Congrats!

Thanks man. I'm definitely happy.

And this post just reiterates why I love this forum so much. There are so many doctors out there doing bad work, but it's nice to have a place like this with recommended doctors with proven track records that we can all turn to.

OP: Going forward, I suggest you look at the recommended surgeons on this site and see if any of them can help you out. Keep us posted about what comes of this. Wishing you luck.

Hey man. Sorry to hear about what you're going through. First things first, I hope you've been able to make headway and get some ongoing help with a therapist of some sort to work on your image issues, and most importantly to address the suicidal thoughts and make sure you stay safe. I'm glad to hear your mom was proactive in getting that set up for you, so keep it up.

A few thoughts: As much as many of us men (both on this forum and off) care about our hair and want to do everything we can to fix/maintain it, at the end of the day, we all have to realize it's not the absolute end of the world if we're not able to. There are many talented, successful, attractive, funny, smart men out there who don't have a full head of hair - some that have none at all. My brother-in-law, for example, is practically completely bald at 34 - but he genuinely doesn't care (nor does my sister). He's an extremely funny, smart, talented guy living a full and happy life. And on the flip side of that, there are men out there with full, gorgeous heads of hair who have zero personality, charm, or anything else of substance to bring to the table. Point being - the hair does not make the man.

I say all of this to point out to you that on the chance that you're not a good candidate for a hair transplant, you realize that your life isn't over. I know you're young and it possibly seems like it would be the end of the world, but I promise you it's not. Find other outlets you can use to express yourself and build up your confidence, and understand that our innate worth as people doesn't come from anything physical. We are all so much more than our physical bodies, and if you can self identify with those other parts of yourself, you'll find yourself much happier, carefree, and alive - with or without hair.

Now, as for the hair transplant: I'm glad you're at least seeking out other opinions so that you feel you're doing everything you can do. I will say, however, that based on the photos, you don't appear to be the most ideal candidate. You're still quite young, and based on your description, your hair loss is still quite aggressive. This mean it hasn't stabilized and could continue to progress. Without getting your present hair stabilized, a hair transplant wouldn't do you much good. It's unfortunate that the Propecia didn't work for you, as that's usually one of the best ways to help stabilize the hair loss.

You do have quite a lot of hair loss, and I agree with Dr. Dogonay that your donor doesn't seem to be sufficient. It's also important to note that you have been turned down by several other doctors as well. When surgeons turn down a patient, it generally is for no other reason than they believe it is in your best interest not to have the procedure. Unfortunately, hair transplants just aren't a viable option for everyone. If the surgeon feels like a HT would not lead to satisfactory results, they have an obligation to be upfront and honest with the patient about this. (And at the end of the day, an unqualified candidate would be grateful for the surgeon's honesty years down the road when they finally realize that it was a good decision.)

I hate to be the reiterator of bad news here for you. But who knows - maybe some surgeon somewhere could come up with a master plan for you to get you headed in the right direction. But more importantly than anything hair related, I would love to see you gain some confidence and get out there and conquer the world - hair or no hair. :cool:

This is extremely puzzling. I hope you're able to get to the bottom of this. Document it with photos and set up an appointment with another HT surgeon asap to get another professional opinion on the books.

I really can't imagine how this could've happened - and why the doctor is seemingly acting like this is completely normal is beyond me.

Best of luck.

I understand fully the obsession that you deal with, as I'm sure many of us on the board have dealt with this in some fashion or another to varying degrees. I suggest you look into discussing this with a therapist, specifically one who deals with Cognitive Behavioral Therapy. This is one of the most practical forms of therapy out there and could really do wonders to help with the ruminating you deal with on a daily basis.

I suffered from OCD for over 20 years before I finally sought out treatment. There are a lot of parallels between what you're describing and some of the main characteristics of OCD. It was the CBT that really helped me get my life/mind under control, and I think it's worth looking into for you. The results are proven, practical, and generally very fast.

Feel free to shoot me a private message if you have any further questions. Wishing you the best of luck.

I can understand both sides of the issue, but Blake hit on a good point. In a sense, it's a way for the doctors to weed out a lot of the guys who aren't serious about actually even getting a hair transplant, which frees up more time and resources for the doctors to dedicate to those of us who are serious about it. When something is "free" people come out of the woodworks to get in on it, so if it's a smaller practice that doesn't have the resources to handle this, then it makes sense to charge for the consultation - especially if the surgeon himself is the one doing the in-depth consultation. And in the grand scheme of HT costs, the standard $100 fee is extremely minimal - not to mention that it goes towards the cost of the treatment should you decide to follow through with it with that surgeon.

Ultimately, you're paying for their time and expertise. I paid the fee with Dr. Mohebi when I met with him, and given the amount of time he spent educating me on the process, evaluating my hairline, hair, and scalp, and going over all my options, etc., I never once felt rushed, and thus, I never once felt cheated. Even if I hadn't followed through with my surgery with him and had my fee placed towards my procedure, it was still money extremely well spent.

I don't believe there's a "right" or "wrong" approach to this. Each surgeon has to do what is best for their practice and business, and it ultimately wouldn't even be a factor for me in deciding which surgeon to choose. There are lots of bad surgeons who give free consultations and lots of great ones who charge.

This seems to be just fine. Everyone's growth is different and some start growing faster and sooner than others. There's no hard and fast rule for how the growth should progress. And since the hairs really don't start growing until the 3rd month anyway, that means you haven't even had a full month's worth of growth yet - so just hang tight. I'm sure you'll start seeing stronger results in no time.

I'm just so confused, after the initial smp it looked awesome. The redness due to the procedure masked the large dots. Now that the redness dissipated the dots are noticeable. I'm so sad right now and disappointed. I hope what you say is true, that the large dots will shrink. I have a presentation in front of a conference next week and my ego is so shot! I. I'm depressed, I called my smp vendor and they stated I had to wait a whole.month until june.

 

My wife even told me, what happened to your procedure. Even she noticed. Please if you had any similar experience where large dots are left, after 2 weeks. Please reply your experience. Im so lost and defeated. Help me. I wanted to finish this amp in preparation for my conference next week, now I look like a total clown show. Help. Thanks.

Hey Sanchoy. Were you able to get this resolved before your conference? Curious to see if the dots shrank in time. Also, did they not give you a timeline of what to expect after the procedure so that you could plan and time your procedure accordingly?

Hopefully it all worked out.

Good lord, my hair in back is always about 3 inches and it's still half of what I want! Not that that helps, I just wanted to point it out .

 

Length means different thing to different people.

Haha! Yes, very valid point. It is all relative to a certain degree. Once mine gets over a half an inch on the sides, I start itching for a haircut... An inch of length on the sides is considered long for me. I've tried to grow it out many times over the years but can't seem to pull it off.

Also, there's the very good chance that I just have no idea how to measure the length of someone's hair and his could be longer. Lol. So let's say this: He doesn't get it cut with clippers, so the sides are done completely with scissors... 4-5 inches or so on top, with about a third of that length on the sides? Whatever which way, you can see his scar right through it sometimes, which really bothers me for him.

And remember Voxman.... Not all of us are rockstars that need half a foot of hair to toss around while we're on stage. :cool: