MayiraP0chu

Rawkerboi,

Well, I will need a couple more months to decide if the surgery is an overwhelming success. The kind of success that will make it very hard to move away from Radha Rani. I have lost a lot of hair in the last few months, both native and transplanted on the right side of my head. From hairline, all the way to the vertex. It’s bizzare! It’s nothing ackward to look at or strikingly obvious, but, a good observer will notice the difference from the left side. The left side is almost a 100 percent. It’s just beautiful! As I have reported earlier in my updates, it’s the right side that took a long time to heal. The right side has the widest of the scar too. I still experience a very, very mild pain on the right side scar, when I workout. The hair fall thus could be related to this stress and trauma that has always been on the right side. I expect the lost hair to come back in a few months, as they are not genetic loss and I have been on Fin for a year now since the operation. So, I will form an opinion then.

The other thing is that, I don’t think I will be able to afford the downtime in the future the Strip surgery brings along. So, even if I am 100 hundred percent happy with Radha Rani in due time, as I expect. I don’t know if I will go to her again, as she is not known for her FUE practice. Anyways, I don’t think I will have the headache of thinking about the next surgery for a year or two. So, judgement reserved until then.

Thanks Khali!

————————————————-

I have stopped updating the thread, as there's nothing really to report except for some trivial matters. I believe, I won’t have the need to update in the near future as well. Il probably do half yearly updates from now on to record the long term experience. Il be glad to post pictures in the meantime on request.

As to why Erdogan has refused to operate on you, is because, these miniaturised hair are so weak, they would not able to handle the trauma caused by a surgery. A normal, healthy hair lost due to trauma will come back in its next growth cycle. But, the miniaturised ones have had their knockout punch. They are lost forever.

As you must know already, most doctors advise their patients to be on Fin for a certain period before they operate. This is because, Fin helps in improving the health of the miniaturised hair. Thus, minimising the loss of hair permanently due to trauma from the surgery.

Miniaturised hair is a very common terminology used in hair transplant literature describing a DHT affected hair. I am surprised you haven’t known about in all these years.

In individuals with healthy follicles, hair growth will follow the cycle of growth, rest, and shedding for the entirety of one’s life. This means a full head of hair with little to no thinning or loss.

In those with hair miniaturization, the cycle is interrupted for one reason or another.

The two most common interruptions occur during the anagen phase of growth (typically experienced by those with Male-Pattern Baldness (MPB)) and the telogen phase of growth (known as telogen effluvium, and triggered by a number of causes).

These interruptions can lead to shortening of the hair strands and constricting of the follicles, and this eventually leads to hair thinning and loss. MPB is caused by sensitivity to androgen hormone DHT. This sensitivity leads to irritation and inflammation of the follicle, and eventually contributes directly to hair miniaturization.

In simplest terms, hair miniaturization is shrinking of the hair strand – and, eventually, the hair follicle.

Generally, you will be able to see a clear difference between a miniaturised hair and a healthy hair. It’s as apparent as a difference between a malnutrioned person and a healthy person.

Thank you SWdan! You are very generous. Half the credit should go to the filters.

Lol Rawkerboi! It was a shortlived Christmas. I started liquifying the foam before application. It becomes just like regual rogaine. Thanks for your wishes!

And, thank you too Rajiv Kumar! I am glad you found some useful information here.

Hello and thanks FortunePlant!

Thanks boys!

BjornBorg, never have used fibers in my life. Neither do I use any other hair products.

7 Months, 2.5 Weeks.

I think it is time to declare this surgery a success.

My observation still largely remains the same. Those patches without growth still remains without growth. The major ones are, a couple of spots on the right side with visible scalp and a single spot on the left side with sparse growth. Like I have reported from the 5 th month or so, it's the length of the surrounding hair, type of the hair and the type of my balding pattern has all helped to give a pretty good final product.

HT s are all about optics and illusion, the following pictures will make you endorse that fact.

They are mighty impressive!

Just imagine if the growth was uniform and full. Phew!

So, like I said, I am declaring the surgery successful, if not outrageously successful.

I figured why take pictures specifically for the monthly reports, but would rather post real time pictures taken of the month.

6 Months, 1 Week.

Rawkerboi,

My monthly reports here are just reports and nothing more. It doesn’t and I don’t intend to use it as an emotional outlet, be it good or bad. They are just collection of events leading up to the next month. More like a log, which might be useful for someone down the line.

My prediction of a moderate result is not based on any rationale or my fear/worries, but just a gut feeling. I went into this surgery well prepared for a complete failure. Besides, I am a sort of a person who will get ready for another surgery than sulking at a failure.

Anyways, thanks for your interest. Thanks for being kind.

To bring in some perspective,

One month before surgery.

Though, a short hair cut (my general/forced appearance) drastically changes the dynamics for me. My first post has pictures of my hair cut short a couple of weeks before my surgery. It doesn’t look half bad as this.

I had them too. But, I am not really sure if it is okay to have them. I had them pretty late though, like in the 3-4 th week. I thought I was shedding. So, dint do anything about it.

5 months, 2 weeks. Haircut. Daylight pictures.

Hairbomb,

I do not believe there s a good FUE surgeon in India. So, can’t recommend. Sorry! My next destination is ASMED, unless this turns out to be a super success, which I highly doubt it will be.

Got a moment today.

Here s a sample of what’s up.

Like I said in my earlier post, il try and give a detailed report with more detailed pictures when I get a breather. But, my utter lack of sleep and at the rate I am losing hair from dandruff, il probably end being completely bald by then. Lol!

Thanks Louisjams!

But, it is too early to declare the surgery a success.

I have been absolutely time constrained the last month or so. I will continue to be the next month as well. So much as no time to even breathe. So, there won’t be any detailed updates.

Il just keep it simple. The transplanted hair has grown to a length where there is no visible scalp anymore. But, I dont think I have seen any massive growth or new growth since my last update. It’s just been the same more or less and the length of the hair giving the illusion of a good coverage.

I have started smoking again about 5-7 cigs since my last update - 4 th month. I am relocated temporarily to a very cold place (a shift from 35+ degrees to 15 degrees) since then and been having massive dandruff problems. I don’t scratch, but I do keep finger brushing my hair all through the day. I don’t know how healthy that is. Obviously, I am losing hair because of that constantly. This has been the only hiccup on an otherwise breezy recovery.

Adios, until my next report which I hope to be a detailed one with pictures.

Happy New Year!

I resumed my exercises 10 days post surgery. Everything was normal as before.

Nice!

I wrestled with myself if I should write here again. I am not liking arguments as I used to, healthy or otherwise. I am growing old and being political for the last 7 years has taken its toll. I am too tired.

I knew I was going to get brickbats as anyone gets, when one goes against the establishment and a popular notion. But, I din't think I would be this misunderstood. Either, I write piss poorly or you guys are just looking at the surface and not actually looking into what I am saying. This is a classic case of a Jackfruit. I guess Il have to peel my post and the outer thorny layer one by one for you guys to see the well intentioned fruit I had inside.

Whether they do or not is their choice of course as it would be for us to not use them based on their actions with clients but to call out a sub par result as being sub par is what we do here, we give the drs lots of respect when they deliver a good result and those comments lead to their getting patients, it works the other way as well.

Giving respect and appreciation to a job well done is fine. But, respect to a fellow human is paramount.

I could have written my piece in any other 'undeserved, poor growth' refund thread. I had a lot of times in the past started writing and dropped it to avoid conversations exactly like this. I was forced to finally write here, in this thread, after seeing this post from BlessUP.

All those blocks of text but no resolution. Doesn't matter what happened it matters what we can do moving forward

Are you going to refund some of his money or do a free repair that's all we need to know.

Looks like a no.

 

You agree this is a horrible result as does the community why not fix it. We're not asking you to fix a case unless its extremely poor outcome. He came out worse than when he went it. I mean wtf man you say yourself you only get few bad cases a year why not fix him for free. It's like pulling teeth you greedy fcks. Why lose out on bunch money when people read this thread and don't choose you when you can fix him and people will like that. It's shortsighted and dumb your stance bro unbelievable from someone with 27 years of experience.

This is disgraceful! This is no way to talk to anyone let alone to a stranger, a doctor and someone with whom you have no business with. This is plain bullying and harassment.

This is why I went a bit specific and wrote this part. Otherwise, my post was addressed in general towards the practice of asking for refunds for unsatisfactory growth.

Why should Dr. Lindsey give a discount or a free procedure?

 

1. Was he found to be negligent while he conducted this surgery?

2. Was he found to have made a mistake in the surgery skill wise or otherwise?

3. Did he promise a result that he could not deliver?

 

Unless Dr. Linsey was found out on any of the three counts above, I do not see a case morally or legally.

I also didn't say this, go back to primary school reading comprehension class buddy. Try not to make yourself also sound like an illiterate when you're being blatantly insensitive and illogical too.

 

I said "expect that in a case of cosmetic surgery where the person looks worse than when they went in you should be willing to compensate them."

 

That clearly isn't the same as "outcome that is not desireable." Surprised that the son of a lawyer (maybe not a great one) doesn't know how to be objective when analysing the facts of a case.

Jean has already called me illiterate, insensitive, illogical and my father a substandard lawyer. My poor father unnecessarily dragged in the mud for merely citing him as an example to make a point. Before anyone calls me a shill and a doctor's rep,

Bachelors in computer science, Masters in computer science, A Commercial Pilot flying the 737's, I am anything but illiterate. Neither do I have the need or the time to shill for anyone.

If you have read my 'PS' in my first post, you'l know I am anything but insensitive.

And that post was anything but illogical.

If anything was illogical, it was this.

Surprised that the son of a lawyer (maybe not a great one) doesn't know how to be objective when analysing the facts of a case.

A lawyer's son automatically inherits his father's abilities in judging a case? Since when did law get genetically transferred? A mathematics teacher's son has to be great at mathematics then?

I could have said all this when I replied to Jean earlier, but, thats not the way I operate. I don't mud sling. More than how many degrees you ve got next to your name, I believe in being honest, compassionate and respectful. I believe I am more of a literate because of that. Besides, I set Jean up by deliberately making that mistake so I can prove him my point. I am not mad at him. I have no problems with him whatsoever.

The other reason I wrote this piece here is because, I think Moustafa's is a genuine case that deserves a free fix by any standards. My 'PS' was a key part in that post. Looks like it was conveniently forgotten, which clearly shows my sentiments on this case and how I feel this is a meritorious claim.

PS:

 

ZeroMoustafa,

 

I am sorry if my post seems insensitive and unwarranted when you are suffering. It was more of a generic address than specific to your particular case. I just used Dr. Linsey as an example. Your donor state is much worse than what it was before going in to the surgery. If I was the surgeon, I will take full responsibility and try and fix it the best I can for free, even if your condition was not a result of my incompetence. But, thats just me.

 

I am sorry you ve had complications in your surgery. I wish you a speedy resolution.

 

Cheers!

The following quotes too share the same sentiments of how I feel this is a deserved case.

By crying wolf all the time, we might put legitimate claims for compensation in danger.

But, if you go around the forum, majority or almost all of the refund cries are for poor growth. And, there lies my gripe. It has set a dangerous precedent. If we had not done that, Dr. Lindsey, whether it was his mistake or not, would probably have fixed ZeroMoustafa for free without batting an eyelid. Like I said, when you cry wolf all the time, there will be no help when the wolf comes for real one day.

And since when did we become more invested in protecting the doctor's establishment and business? I think it is safe to say Dr. Lindsey or any another doctor for that matter cares more about protecting their business than us.

If these unfortunate cases where the patient suffers permanent shock loss in the donor , pitting in the recipient etc are not common as the top docs claim, then I agree with Jean LDD it makes sense from a marketing point of view they stand by their work and do whatever they can to rectify the situation

On the profits they're making, Lindsey should be HAPPY to help you for free as currently you're a walking sign post screaming "don't go to doctor Lindsey if you don't want this!". Confuses me as to how poorly some doctors understand marketing in this regard.

this.

If a dr isn't motivated morally to do make it right then hopefully our voices can stir them to action.

When these kind of statements get repeated, they sound more like a thinly veiled threat than being a harmless observation. If they are indeed harmless observations, then my apologies.

I'm shocked to see Mayiras post, what a load of garbage. Sorry I can usually hide my contempt a little better than this but to belittle the memberships ability to distinguish a horrible result vs a guy who didn't get his native hair density back is a joke. The idea that we're all just screaming refund every time a patient doesn't get a home run is absurd.

Misunderstood again! Why do you take offence Mikey? I never said all the members indulge in this practice. There are threads where quite a few members advocate or endorse a refund. There are threads, where only one or two who shouts for a refund. There are threads where only the thread starter looks for a refund, while the rest shoot him down as he doesn't have a case. There is one even in today's posts. So, I was never questioning the collective ability of the memberships to see objectively. But, a lot of people's minds are infested with this thought of refund as a fall back. As a safety net. There are people who start thinking on those lines even before they get their procedure done. Yes, we are paying big bucks. But, that doesn't justify a refund for unsatisfactory growth. I don't believe in compensation for unsatisfactory growth. Search 'refunds' and 'discounts' and see for yourselves how many such posts are lying out there. My whole post was to point that, because of those posts and complaints and harassment of the doctors, genuine cases like Moustafa's doesn't get its fair due.

Mikey, Jean, Mick - I have nothing against you guys. I quoted you guys to just put my point across. Nothing more.

Finally, let me make this clear in simple, plain English.

Through my post, I was indirectly appealing to Dr. Lindsey's guilt and humanity. And, I strongly believe the chances of the doctor changing his stance is high reading my post than BlessUp's. I have great respect for Dr. Lindsey, for his work and as a person and I implore him to consider my/our plea.

This took some considerable time off my evening, when I could have chilled with a couple of cold beers after 8 hours of flying. I will not be indulging in anymore discussions. I consider this subject closed.

"Jean, above here says he 'expects' cosmetic surgeons to compensate if the outcome is not desirable. Why do you expect that? Who made it the norm? Just because its the norm, does it make it an obligation? "

 

I also didn't say this, go back to primary school reading comprehension class buddy. Try not to make yourself also sound like an illiterate when you're being blatantly insensitive and illogical too.

 

I said "expect that in a case of cosmetic surgery where the person looks worse than when they went in you should be willing to compensate them."

 

That clearly isn't the same as "outcome that is not desireable." Surprised that the son of a lawyer (maybe not a great one) doesn't know how to be objective when analysing the facts of a case.

Exactly!

Humans make mistakes. Even the best of them. It is how you handle them defines who you are. If you had made such a mistake, I would have quoted you and myself and would have said a simple ‘I think you have misread/misunderstood what I meant‘. I would have been sober and mild about it.

It was a bait! I made that mistake by choice. That is primarily why I highlighted your name in bold, as I knew you will come swinging at me with all the aggression you got, like I ve seen you in previous occasions. That doesn’t mean you are a stupid boy. I think you are a very smart kid. You have a great head over your shoulders at a very young age, who handled a tricky operation aplomb with some solid ground work.

People are different!

I am sure you read my ‘PS’ as well. I have said, ‘your donor state is much worse than what it was before going in to the surgery’ and so I will take full responsibility. That is basically what you are expecting the doctor to do too. We both have the same understanding of the situation. Only, the way we approach it is different.

The point I am trying to make is, people are different. There are always different approaches and outcomes to the same situation. Same applies to the doctors as well.

I was about to cite a horrible necrosis case we all saw recently as an example of doctor’s liability, which begs not just a refund but beyond that. But, if you go around the forum, majority or almost all of the refund cries are for poor growth. And, there lies my gripe. It has set a dangerous precedent. If we had not done that, Dr. Lindsey, whether it was his mistake or not, would probably have fixed ZeroMoustafa for free without batting an eyelid. Like I said, when you cry wolf all the time, there will be no help when the wolf comes for real one day.

This is one part I never understood as a hair consumer myself or otherwise. At the risk of incurring brickbats, I do not agree with patients asking for a refund or a freebie, every time when he or she does not get a result he or she considers satisfactory. I have seen a whole lot of members, innumerable times in this forum either advocating or endorsing this unjustifiable dogma.

Why should Dr. Lindsey give a discount or a free procedure?

1. Was he found to be negligent while he conducted this surgery?

2. Was he found to have made a mistake in the surgery skill wise or otherwise?

3. Did he promise a result that he could not deliver?

Unless Dr. Linsey was found out on any of the three counts above, I do not see a case morally or legally.

Consider this.

My mum recently had a knee replacement surgery. 3 days PostOp, she was in a real bad state. Weakness, nausea, dizziness and finally lost her sense of space and reality. Shit was crazy! We rushed her to the hospital. It was found that she was losing blood internally because the surgeon had sutured a vein along with the skin when he closed up.

Now, this is a classic example of the surgeon's liability. It is his mistake that resulted in this unsavoury episode. Here, you can hold the doctor responsible and demand compensation. My mum has recovered now. She walks very well. The surgery is a success.

Assume there was no error in suturing and the surgery was completely error free and the PostOp was a breeze, only to find out the knee din't respond well as hoped and the surgery was not a success. Can I ask for compensation here?

Absolutely not!

Because, not all knee surgeries can be a success. Much like any other surgery. Be it heart or hair. Every surgery has a certain probabilistic chance of a failure. We already knew and were told by the surgical team of the possible outcomes of the surgery in detail. So, we would have had no merit morally or legally in demanding a compensation.

When you won't ask for a refund if a heart transplant din't turn out as expected, why should a hair transplant be any different?

Jean, above here says he 'expects' cosmetic surgeons to compensate if the outcome is not desirable. Why do you expect that? Who made it the norm? Just because its the norm, does it make it an obligation?

Lets say I go to a restaurant. Am I obligated to tip the server? Everyone here will agree I am expected to tip the server. It is nice to tip. But, am I obligated to tip?

Absolutely not!

I’m a chronic over-tipper, so shouldn’t the server refuse my money if the service wasn’t extraordinary? Philosophically, I don’t think one can have it both ways. Either the money is intrinsically tied to performance or it’s not.

When a surgery is a success, do any of us pay the surgeon extra money other than the fees we ve already agreed to/paid? If we do, then I see a fair point in asking for compensation when there is a failure.

This is not just about medical industry. No industry will or is obligated to compensate, unless the resulting unsavoury condition is because of their implicit mistake or false promises.

My dad is a lawyer. No client in his 40 years of practice has ever asked for a refund when he lost a case. No profession or business can run that way. It's as simple as that.

I believe it all comes down to an individual s philosophy on how to conduct his business. If the doctor is willing to compensate an undesirable outcome, excellent! Thumbs up to that! But, when one doesn't, it doesn't make him any lesser man. It's a free world. No one is being force fed. Choose the philosophy you buy into. The choice has always been yours!

Forums like HRN are an amazing platform to learn and share. By crying wolf all the time, we might put legitimate claims for compensation in danger.

PS:

ZeroMoustafa,

I am sorry if my post seems insensitive and unwarranted when you are suffering. It was more of a generic address than specific to your particular case. I just used Dr. Linsey as an example. Your donor state is much worse than what it was before going in to the surgery. If I was the surgeon, I will take full responsibility and try and fix it the best I can for free, even if your condition was not a result of my incompetence. But, thats just me.

I am sorry you ve had complications in your surgery. I wish you a speedy resolution.

Cheers!

Thanks AAH!

I forecast an average density and an average scar. It’s obviously not based on any sound rationale, as there is no premise to that this early in to the growing months. It’s just a gut feeling.

Out of the other 4 possible outcomes, I would happily choose 1, 2 and 3 any given day, in that order. No complaints.

1. Great density, great scar.

2. Great density, bad scar. (Errr...Not so gruesomely bad of course:D)

3. Bad density, great scar.

4. Bad density, bad scar.

An average density and an average scar will be so meh! Boring! Lol!

The biggest thing to report is the scar. I would have mentioned in my previous updates about how my scar on the right side is wider than the left.

PS: When I run my hand through the scar, its even with the rest of the head and I don't feel a thing except for a small area on the right side of the head. There is a clear bump. Clearly uneven. If you look at the pictures, the scar on the right is much wider than the rest. So, it sorta makes sense. Wonder if this happens to all or if its just me and if it will even out with time.

 

The right has always been wider and slow to heal while the left has been nothing short of 10 on 10. Could it be because of http://www.hairrestorationnetwork.com/eve/187669-spot-blood-donor-stitching.html this? I wonder!

Anyways, the story is, I was able to move my lazy butt off last week to begin proper workout after a few failed dalliances with some minor cardio earlier. Naturally, I began slow and steady. 3x400 meters of mild-moderate running and wait for this....just 3 reps of pull ups, 10 reps pushups and 2 reps of double bar. That is it! The plan was to warm up my upper body and keep idling for a week before I push.

I din't feel one pinch on the scar while indulging in these activities. As soon as I got back home, there was a mild pain on the right side of the head around the scar. Very mild that you are not sure if its the regular muscle soreness that comes from the first few days of the workout or the scar wasn't agreeing to the physical stress. This pain was not constant too. It was on and off.

So, I had to give it another go to see what is what. I gave a day s rest and doubled up the reps with the same routine the next day. Again, din't feel a pinch while doin it. But, the same pain retuned as I got home. This time not just the back, but the whole of the right part of the head. It slowly crossed boundaries and the left side scar too started feeling a bit sore. And, it was a bit stronger relatively than the first time (still mild though) and also constant, lingering longer than before.

I am clearly not comfortable as I was without the workout. The discomfort is slowly fading off. I should be completely off it in a couple of days. It feels like my healing has relegated by a month. It is a bit strange, considering people start working out as early as 1 month. Obviously, healing depends on the physiology of the individual, but 4 months past, I expected it to be a breeze especially at this extremely mild intensity workout. Anyways, I am giving it another couple of months before trying again. I don't know how stretching works. Hope this has not done any harm.

Anyone with insights on scars and scar stretching, please jump in.

Okay, enough of that. Let me get to the main attraction.

Growth has been sober but sure. There will be clear differences from the 3 rd and the 4 th month pictures. But, it could be because of the hair from the 3 rd month growing longer and covering a wider space or that there has been real new growth. I can't decide.

I have been shedding the whole of this month. I am attributing it to Rogaine's initial shed.

As the hair line is fortified, it is fascinating to see a rectangular forehead as I have always been with varied degrees of 'M' shaped hair line.

-- I will be throwin in a couple of wet hair pictures as well from now on --

Fin - 10 days post.

Biotin 2.5 ish months post - not by choice. I would have started much earlier along with fin.

Minoxidil - 2.5 ish months post - again not by choice. You can start as soon as you are thoroughly clean of scabs. Usually post 15 days. I would say give it a month.

Day 3(31/10/2017)

Today surgery started at 10 AM. Today I also saw images of a grafts with 6 hair follicles but sadly it is not mine but of a patient admitted in adjacent OT.

Hahahaha!