recedingboy

Thanks for all the feedback, its appreciated.

Presuming I go the FUE route, I still think its best to shave at op and not pre-op. Wait for that right time when grafts have not shedded but redness is gone and then go to work.

But after that, why do people who have had an FUE transplant not continually shave until their hairs start growing in? Then, after 5-6 months stop shaving and let it all grow?

I don't understand why youre confused. You just go on holiday with your hair as it is, have it shaved for the procedure and then go back to work with a shaved look.

 

Just tell them that you got the urge to shave it all off in the heat in India or that you were having a haircut and the hairdresser accidentally took a lump out of your hair so you had to shave it down to even it all out. You could make up anything.

the only reason i am confused is because almost everyone that has had an FUE HT before recommends to shave pre-op, let coworkers see, and then come back. I never really understood why.

Hi Johnny,

Thanks for the photo update. I'm no expert, but have seen many photos and think your growth at 5 months is in line with what is expected as pretty good.

Considering your procedure was FUE and through use of motorized extraction tools (Harris SAFE tool), thats actually a big relief for you i'm sure!

I have ZERO problems travelling to India to get a HT done. I've been there a few times already.

The ONLY concern I have now, and I'm hoping that as a head shaver you might be able to help out is, how do I get this done and keep it low key? I have 3-4 weeks I can take off for work, I cannot wear a hat. I have never shaved my head, but have a NW3 and have successfully covered my receded hairline.

I've been told I need 2500-300 grafts. The question is, if I reveal a shaven head PREOP or go back to work with a shaven head post op only? My thinking is if coworkers see my head shaven pre-op they will see all the roots missing from my hairline. As that is the first time I will have been seen with a shaven head, it will be a focal point (the fact that I had hair on Friday and came back on Monday with a shaved head). Its easy to spot when you have dark hair and fair skin the hairloss areas.

HOWEVER, if everyone sees my head shaven post op, catching that right time when the grafts are still in but redness gone (i'm not very fair, probably like your olive complexion) and THEN come back, it will "appear" that I have a full head of hair just shaved from "my adventurous trip to India" or something. Yes, the grafts will fall out shortly thereafter, but, by then it wouldn't be as much a focal point as the change would not have been as drastic.

Thoughts?

p.s. sorry for hijacking your thread... as you said you did the right thing and stopped HJn'g others threads... I'm not there just yet!

If you dont mind me asking, how old are you guys? I think if you are relatively young being open about a HT is not so easy. When you are in your 40's and 50's I guess it is inevitable for most people, but when most of the people around me don't have hairloss issues it does become a bigger deal imho.

Additionally I am a manager with 30 people under me, mostly women. I'd rather not be the butt of jokes or be perceived as being vain/sensitive/insecure.

I think the people that promote fue do so due to the pros of faster recovery time and the ability to buzz down in the future.

Why did you shave down your transplanted hairs?

Who did your surgery?

One thing worth noting is that it is not guaranteed you will have shock loss - I didn't. I could be wrong, but I think most people do NOT have shockloss.

 

I'm trying to honor your request to not debate FUT -vs- FUE :-) but.... a few things to consider (you probably have)

 

I just don't understand why people want FUE for large cases (2000+ grafts). Is the idea that you can always shave your head down in the future if things go "wrong"? I would think with that number of FUE grafts, you wouldn't do this anyways as it would look weird with little tiny

pinprick scars everywhere. By having a HT I feel that I've committed to having my hair at least 3/4" long anyways - so that will cover up the FUT scar. This presumes that you have good laxity and that is not a concern.

 

So, enough said on that but if "consealing" your HT is a primary objective, I think FUT is the better option - provided your hair is long enough in the back. I would suggest letting it grow out at least an inch in case you experience shock loss from the donor site (plus they have to shave a small strip in the donor area down).

 

"Consealment" has been difficult/impossible for me as I am a NW6. On top of that, my scalp stayed redder MUCH longer than 3-4 weeks. It can be done though, with green tinted concealer and some sort of powered mineral "foundation" (sure there are other ways). At 3-4 weeks I used an *electric* razor to shave down any transplanted hairs that did not fall out on their own.

 

Me personally, I would use FUE to fill smaller areas, e.g. touch up.

 

Either way you go, I would suggest using a copper peptide spray on the receiptent area..... and use it quite generously for the 1st 3 days. For me at least, this reduced scab formation significantly and most of my scabs were gone about 10 days post op (believe it or not).... and now at 3 months post op, I have a significant amount of growth. Hairs on the top of my head are about 1/2" long now.

 

Of course, there are other factors that influence this, notably good surgical technique, e.g. using different/matching blade widths to ensure the grafts fit snugly - reducing exudate. And of course, every individual is different :-).

 

Either way, good luck. I can only advise that you make the most informed decision you can, pick the best surgeon you can and then go with it. You can analyze this to death and be paralyzed with indecision. Ultimately, even if you "fail" at consealment, you are only going to look "bad" for 6 months or so.

Hi,

Based on the numerous opinions, and my own research, I am wavering between FUE and FUT. I won't discuss the pros and cons here as that has been beaten to death. I've also posted a similar thread in the past but feel more perspectives are needed.

One very important factor for me personally, is the ability to not only conceal that I had a HT, but to hide or mitigate the fact that I had hairloss to begin with (in the 0-4/5 months post op). I have been concealing (or reducing the appearance) of hairloss for many years now through styling aids concealers, hairstyles.

Two options:

1) FUE= full shaved head (I need 2500+ grafts, and the best docs with manual punches all seem to shave pretty much the entire head), shockloss, can't cover hairline where I need (but on the other hand would I need to cover it? Shaved heads visually make it more difficult to determine the extent of ones hairloss IMHO). There are docs that can perhaps do it with shaving rows, but none that I would consider, I'd only go to the best 2-3 in the world, and they require (effectively) full head shaves.

2) FUT = no shaving, greater recovery time, shockloss, I can have some hairs to cover my temporal areas (but after shockloss and perhaps minimal shaving even there by the doc, are those hairs any good anyway, or would it look stringy and thin?

So what I'm trying to figure out it is, in reality (as opposed to theory), which method would a say NW3 patient be able to better conceal or mitigate at least, their appearance of hairloss post HT?

The concealer angle: If use of dermatch /toppik is an option, does that have a role in all this as far as mitigating the appearance of hairloss post op?

FUE approach: Some that advise FUE say to shave your head weeks prior to the procedure, let the 'look' sink in for your co-workers and then get the op done. However I was thinking might it not be better to "take a long vacation," come back with a very low buzzed head (mind you with plenty of saplings the first couple weeks, prior to fall out of grafts), at which time I feel my head might be more a focal point (as no one at work has seen me with a shaved head before), and then buzz it even lower in the weeks that follows as the grafts start falling out more and more? I'm guessing the first few days upon return to work people will notice more, when the grafts fall out by then it would be a dead topic?? So the first few days upon return to work, everyone is seeing a guy with a great hairline and plenty of saplings, allbeit buzzed down, and then, after a couple weeks when my grafts start falling buzz it down more and by then it will be off people's minds anyways. So this is one approach. The FUT is more straightforward and is below

FUT approach: Grow top of hairs/vertex as long as possible. Use hair growth aids such as Biotin perhaps and thickening shampoos, concealer such as dermatch add a bit of product such as wax, mess it up and brush hairs forward... BUT, between the shockloss and *IF* the doctor requires some minor shaving of the temporal area will doing all this help anyways, or will the hairs at the vertex fall out leaving basically a "poor guy with serious thinning trying to brush his hairs forward and scalp showing at the hairline"

So, in sum:

FUE VS. FUT(STRIP) (first column is FUE, second is FUT)

-shockloss -shockloss

-full head shave - no head shave (but perhaps minor at recipient site)

-quicker recovery -ability to use concealer

-concealer use obvious - as grafts fall, front hairs may become thin anyways

-expensive - cheaper

-far from US -closer, in N.America

-buzz cut reduces appearance of h.loss -brush hairs forward, but too thin?

-minor scarring, not obvious -obvious HT scarring (can go for FUE revision later)

-more expensive - half the cost of FUE

-reduced yield/growth -greater growth

-capping/"collateral damage" -no or reduced "collateral damage"

For those that have had a HT before, please respond!

I have many patients who use combinations of different concealers including Dermmatch, Toppik, Prothik, along will several others not mentioned. It is a trial and error situation. The more options you give yourself the better the chance you will find something you can work with. Good luck.

Dr. Charles,

So is Dermatch safe to use after a HT, and after how much time post op?

I like the product but was thinking it might clog pores more than say a toppik type product (which I actually don't like as much).

Anouar,

Thanks for the update. I think your hair is looking much better than before. I'm still confused on the FUE vs FUT procedure thing!

There is so much dissension on this topic by very reputable camps on both sides.

Recedingboy,

 

I am grossly disturbed by the implication that we'd not only suspend "AmanIndia's" account in attempt to protect our credibility (which makes no sense at all I might add) but actually view and respond to private messages sent by and to other members.

 

Firstly, suspending a member's account for sharing their genuine experience and concerns would hurt our credibility, not retain it. Secondly, this community has a long history of allowing members to share their genuine experiences and concerns on this forum. All physicians (including world renowned ones) have patients who are less than satisfied and/or who have less than optimal results. The publishers and moderators of this community have been broadcasting these statements for years. However, in the event a physician recommended by this community shows evidence that they're no longer producing consistent excellent results, we've removed physicians from our recommended list.

 

I suggest that you go back and look through our very long history of patient advocacy before even suggesting that we'd attempt to manipulate our own community and its members.

 

Bill

,

Bill,

When I wrote my possible explanations as to why he did not respond or provide an update, I didnt even remember if it was this site. I actually feel this is one of the most respectable and transparently administered website. As it is now clear it was this site, and based in my continued confidence and faith in you and your fellow admins, I will happily edit my post. I mean you posted my post, which can be construed as having content critical and presumptious of this site. There is no reason you would permit this if you were not transparent..

I remember the "AmaninIndia" situation, with his poor results after a Hasson and Wong procedure. He had a long thread going (I think it may have been a different site though), and eventually stopped replying.

I PM'd him, but did not hear back, and when he finally responded, I got an esoteric sort of "Hey, hows it going?" To which I responded and then no response. I do not know if it was him who really responded and if so why the sudden quietness. Here are the possibilities: 1) H&W told him they will somehow (refund, repeat session, something) take care of him, contingent upon him going on lockdown 2) His results still sucked but he moved on in life.

This is probably what happens to most patients who have poor results by highly reputable clinics.

I would guess that, in this industry, reputation is paramount. Companies will have to stand behind their procedures to any degree. Those that don't will probably suffer from bad stigma that is hard to shake off.

All 3 of them are leading clinics in the world, and I would have a procedure by any of them.

 

But there is not going to be one surgeon anywhere who has not had below par result.

 

The more online patients a clinic has, the more susceptible they are to having a bad result online. No online patients theoretically means no bad results, as the clinics can pick and choose the results they post, meaning their reputation remains untarnished.

Yes, all three are great clinics, but lets be specific, Bisanga has more documented successful cases (either by patient or clinic submission) than the others when it comes to FUE procedures.

On the other hand, Rahal probably has the best FUT results esp. with hairlines and dense packing.

And Shapiro probably has the largest, most professionally run organization of all with many long term employees and mature and experienced advisors and employees.

All three are great, just not in the same areas.

I don't honestly believe whether it is done with the Artas, a manual punch, a motorised tool,choi implanter or whatever tool used to harvest the grafts, there will still be some poor results.

 

A bad result is more likely with fue than strip regardless of the surgeon.

 

No surgeon is exempt whatever claims they make.

Do you feel that some are just not good responders to FUE procedures, or even HT's in general?

FWIW, Dr. Bisanga has consistently shown good results from his procedures, however I have now read of two examples of poor results from otherwise world renowned clinics (Rahal and Shapiro Medical). Both used motorized extraction tools.

As the title implies, who are these docs?

I'm leery of going with a any surgeon that uses motorized extractions. Even in the best of hands there can be problems.

Does Bisanga still require full head shaves? What about Dr. Lorenzo of Spain or Feriduni?

I need to get this done in a low key manner, even if I go for smaller hairline session now and get another one later.

Thanks

I sent him PM. Hope he is doing well. Perhaps (hopefully) he is busy with his personal life and will come back soon and just wants a mental break from all of it.

It really sucks to hear how personal lives and relationships can be affected by our own mental state.

The ironic thing is I too was considering getting an FUE procedure from Dr. Rahal. Even did an in person consult. I feel the operation/clinic itself seems legit, but for whatever reason Sean's results were less than satisfactory.

Many, seemingly old timer posters, seem to say that manual extractions are the only way to go. I was considering a procedure from Dr. Bhatti in India because his rates are very low and his photo results seem pretty good. He uses Dr. Harris' safe tool as well.

I am now having second thoughts of going through with ANY surgeon that uses a motorized punch. I'm now thinking either strip or FUE by Bisanga only. I have not heard a single bad case, has anyone here?

Hey, if you have in fact confirmed it is MPB, I don't think getting the meds from a chemist shop is difficult. I would think in India you could tip the guys at the chemist shop and get what you need... always struck me as the place that sort of thing would work. I mean, if you can buy a politician I'm pretty sure you can get some finasteride.

If you are in south, maybe pay a visit to dr. radha rani, not for a procedure now, but maybe for some advice. Wait until you are NW3 or worse before considering HT.

Thanx guys for those kind advices.... I was feeling very depressed yesterday :mad:

 

I feel sorry for having born in a family with 0 hairloss... None of them would understand my feelings... its not their fault.... I would also never give a **** about it if i wasn't balding....

So I always act like it doesn't bother me.... but deep inside its killing me... that fun loving guy is dying inside me.... I am now like a reserved one... What i like now is Loneliness

 

India is probably not a country to live on if you are gifted with the gene.... When you go out you see a lot of Flex Boards about "Hair oils that's going to sprout out Hair from slick bald Spots" , Tons of Boards (Virendar Sehwag, Gautham Gambhir Testimonials... Hope you know them)... And whats even greater is out of every 15 Television Ads there would be atleast 2 ads About Hair Fixing and Hair Systems... And yet what's funny is that none of them wears these kind of ****....

 

argghh Just leave it...

 

Doc's here doesn't prescribe Fin.... 2 months ago i went to meet a Trichologist who confirmed its MPB.. but refused to prescribe me fin because i was not accompanied by my parent... After few days i somehow managed to bring my father to him.... Doc explained the Side effects and said that Doctors here aren't that desperate.... We left the room in silence... Later Dad just bursted upon me in the Car... I Still remeber the exact words he Said ("Whom do you think you are a Celebrity, a Film actor... U want to turn into a female.... Shut your hole and never bring me to these kind of Drama's... Just live with it" )... That was the first moment i felt sorry for Him in my entire life.. He was never fit to be a DAD... I mean i would try to understand my son's feeling if i were him..

_______________________________________________________________________

 

.OK so now here's what i am going to do... I am going to Get a prescription for Fin somehow. and Getting on it ASAP.... I Don't know if i'm doing it right... If any permanent sides occur then i would have to deal it on my own and expect no support from my Family....

 

If hairloss halts within an year then i would just sell my Motorbike to get an FUE and correct my Hairline.... My maternal Grandpa was a NW 2A when he died... He developed this during his 20's and just maintained it till he died... I hope it doesn't go beyond that...

 

And like some of you said... Shaving head is not Accepted in South India... Society just relate you to Gangsters, Rapists... heh ... :rolleyes:

 

I really hope a real cure comes in the meantime... I have to start making some real Big Cash... I am not going to beg in Front of anyone.... :cool:

Does Dr. Bhatti use a manual or motorized extraction tool?

Thanks

Hey, does dr. bhatti require head shaving? or do you think he can do a 'concealed' fue treatment (grow back hairs a bit longer, pick up and shave a few rows.

Can't decide:

Your observations are anecdotal of course, however my own observations are commensurate with this. I don't know if Indians are the worst in this regard, however I am Indian American with a number of family members in India and they were the most vocal about my hairloss cracking jokes and laughing in my face. One day, out of the blue an uncle who is bald said I should wear a turban. At first I didn't get why he would say it, but in retrospect I think he was being facetious. The thing is, they will crack on you in your face in the presence of others and don't give a damn.

Baldat21: don't worry man, I know how it can be. And you know shaving your head is getting in fashion in India, finally. Look at the guy from Vishal Shekhar: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d4/Vishal_shekhar_live_hungama_concert1.jpg

I think he pulls of the shaved look nicely. You will need to bulk up though, being a scrawny guy with a shaved head makes one look sickly as opposed to macho. Hang in there man. Get blood work done though to make sure you dont have any deficiencies, and consider getting on natural aids like saw palmetto and maybe some ayurvedic medicines. Also, at this point get on Nizoral shampoo if not done so already. 3 x a week, 2-3 minute soak each time, then rinse. I wouldn't get on finasteride until you are absolutely sure it is MPB and not some other issue (inflammation, deficiency, etc.). If it is MPB and you are comfortable with finasteride, start with .5mg approximately. You don't need to take 1mg per day.

Hi,

I ran into a similar issue. Sent my pics a couple weeks ago but did not hear from her. I am presuming her clinic is getting busier and busier.

Few HT clinics from what I have gleaned have a big setup and many don't seem to have patient advisors. You know I'm sure these PA are (obviously) paid marketers. Administrative overhead, PA's, fancy websites... all have a time and place depending on the stage and scale of a business, perhaps her clinic is getting there now. Not to mention, all these things drive costs up.

I'll try calling or emailing again. If the clinic is good and the prices are a steal I don't mind doing a bit more legwork.

Please do update though if they got in touch with you.

Hey... work looked clean, you had severe loss for age 28 imho. I feel locating grafts towards the vertex-crown region would have been a more conservative approach, as you said though you insisted on temple work.

I think you could have gone with more grafts. I believe hairs falling out after a couple weeks is normal and expected. I will say that on your day 12 pics with the shaved head it looks like if and when they grow in, you will look completely different. your day 12 pic from the front you look much better imho than pre-op photos. Though shaven, the stubble helps frame your face.

Good luck and let us know how it progresses. I am considering her as well.

is it just me or are the photos I see coming from this clinic demonstrate some of the cleanest scars I have seen?

I might be going to India in a few weeks, I'll try to head down south if I am there to see for myself. I'm a big skeptic on internet stuff.

I work in a school and know kids can be bloody mean. Kudos Dr. Lindsey I hope you get the boy fixed up!

Hi Sean,

Congrats on your results. I noticed your 7 month mark results looked thicker than now. I'm guessing everything will become better in a couple months.

I did want to comment about Finasteride. I have noticed my memory has gotten really bad and have had difficulty concentrating as well. I have been on it for more than 10 years.

I recently switched to .5mg per day to see if that helps. Too bad we seemingly need to be on it to preserve our existing hairs, even after a HT.

Z, I remember the different estimates given for the grafts. Are you going to give this one go or do it like 6-12 months apart? I remember you asking me about a FUE test with a smaller session earlier. My hairline was placed at 65cm2, so, 60cm2 should set everything nicely in a 2000 graft session. Even though you may have fine hair, the one thing that may make things even better for you is the actual donor density. The number of 1's , 2's, 3's, 4's and so forth extracted from your donor area. Remember, the newly transplanted hairs from the back are suppose to grow thicker in the front as they mature.

 

I understand what you mean regarding finasteride. My fears are similar. I still fear immediate stop may make hairs shed. I know you have been on it longer than me so it may vary. I have seen the impact the drug made along with rogaine on my crown and midscalp areas so stopping does worry me. But then again, David, one of the moderators on this forum, stopped finasteride a few months ago and he hasn't reported any shed or difference in hair after doing so. As far as noticing anything, well, I started to think that I had some brain fog or lack of concentration after reading that was one of the reported side effects. However, I don't know if that occurs from finasteride or if it could be from thinking too much/stress about hairloss and what not. I know that stress can overwhelm the brain to the point that a person may forget tasks/have trouble concentrating. So, I am not 100% sure if it is finasteride related or just my own stress levels. I don't want to alarm anyone without the facts, but the thing that worries me is it is one of the reported side effects of finasteride use. The issue probably started more about a year ago. I started taking finasteride a little over a year ago. I just don't know if the two are interlinked.

 

I know man, everyone wishes to forget about hairloss. It's a completely natural thought. I wish there was something that could put a stop to it or reverse the genes so people don't have to get surgery. It's the only feasible option out right now other then the medications which temporarily hold things at bay until they wear off possibly. So, it might be the route to take now, just get a solid front made up front, and hopefully, these other technologies with Histogen or Replicel kick in within the next 5 years and we can just relieve any added worries with those therapies. I think it's gonna happen, technology has overwhelmingly changed and this time human subjects were used. So, yea. In the meantime, give it a shot, it'll keep you more calm psychologically so you can at least try to enjoy your life without the worries. Just think how many years we waste on worrying about hair. Might as well try to move away from those worries so we don't waste the years worrying. Just a few days ago, I saw a tv documentary on the discovery channel or national geographic. One of those two. They were showcasing lions and their prides. I saw a similar thing happen. The lion that was bald had trouble getting the ladies or impressing the other pride members in general. It was the one that would get the least amount of food and basically could not rule the pride. It looked psychologically worried and depressed. The one with the largest mane held the dominant stance in the pride and got everything. I realized that hair plays a big role in a lions world as it does in a humans. I know some guys can rock the bald look, but society makes it seem hair is the fountain of youth, or masculinity, or virility etc. Do your research on how you want to have the hairline, and then set the date and best of luck. Address any issue you feel that you need to get tweaked on your hairline. After that, it'll take a year at least. Then, just enjoy.

I too am looking for an update. For me, i will probably rule out a strip procedure, and go FUE, so H&W won't be on my list.

However, considering the scenario this guy is/was in, I am concerned for him.

I agree with Bill though, that assumptions on the success or failure of Aman's procedure should not be made until Aman responds. This said, I do not think we should assume that he would have only responded had his results been unsatisfactory.

Some posters on this forum fail to understand the cultural difference. In general, Westerns are more direct people, whereas some other cultures people are more reserved and keep to themselves on things. It is possible he is feeling that posting on here will only get him further backlash from H&W supporters, it is also possible that things turned around and he is not wanting to think about his procedure and enjoying the results.

For the first above mentioned reason, I do feel that all posters should be 100% supportive without making personal attacks on the mental strength or other characteristics of individuals, we never know how deeply hairloss might be affecting another person due to that person's unique circumstances. For this reason, it is better to err on the side of politeness, understanding and sympathy (unless there is good reason the poster is simply a fraud trying to defame a clinic for some reason).

I hope Aman the best and hope he will consider PM'ng me if he is reading this.

Hey,

any update? I recall you stated your transplanted hairs never fell out:)

What about now? any recent photos?

thanks