thinkingaboutit

MW, that is rough. I have heard about excessive shock loss. It seems to be more prevalent with diffuse thinning, fine hair. What NW are you? I know it is difficult for you now, but 2000 grafts will give you a nice look.It will just require patience. Most of the shocked hair will likely return and so you should be very pleased with the final results. The time in between is the tough part.Stay positive through the journey. Be sure to contact your surgeon with your concerns. Good Luck. Keep us posted with your progress.

When you say shockloss, are you speaking of the shedding of the newly transplanted hair or pre-existing hair? Is it all over loss or located in one general area?

you say "90-95% shock loss." That sounds unbelievable. Dr. Charles is considered one of the best. That does not sound right.

This is an excellent thread. Thanks to mayer for beginning the discussion with such an eloquent post. As I am scheduled to undergo a first HT on 10/17, I think I am beginning to get cold feet. The surgeon I have selected is considered one of the best but I wonder if I really have done enough research. I was aware of the potential of pitting with the older methods but I was not aware the it was still an issue with the current follicular unit technique. Is it a common problem still? Also. I know that hair will continue to thin, but once again with the current all follicular unit technique performed by a quality surgeon, I did not feel that additional surgeries will be required for maintenance. Is it naive to think that 1 surgery would suffice, even if natural hair continues to thin? I mean, will it look peculiar if the transplanted hair stands alone. ( I am scheduled for 2000 grafts in the temporal recesses and front 3rd of scalp.

It was only a mistake if it looks bad, if your appearance would be more appealing without it than with it. There is no shame in having a HT procedure.Its not a deep dark secret, but no one needs to know.That does not mean you need to be ashamed of it. Do you tell everyone every time you brush your teeth? How about when you empty your bladder? Is it because you are ashamed? Of course not!Its your own personal business and if you choose to tell somebody that is your perogative,not your duty.

Thanks Arfy, I really look forward to your posts as I kow that you are very knowledgeable with straight answers. I am on propecia. I began taking it just shy of 2 months ago.At the time of my surgery I will have been on it for 4 months. I hope that is enough to make a difference. I do not smoke or drink and will cut back my hair but not to the extent that some surgeons might prefer.

I am scheduled for HT on 10/17 and perhaps my biggest concern is shock loss. ( I feel that the surgeon I have selected is quite capable of achieving impressive work.) On all of my consults with well respected doctors, each told me that their patients did not suffer much shock loss.Many of the posters here have undergone procedyres with these doctors and have lamented somewhat about shockloss.So, I am confused about who is the most correct. I wonder, would it be possible to post some theories ( unproven is OK )about what you believe a patient might do 1-2 months pre-op to reduce the liklihood of shock loss? Also,if you did or did not suffer shock,... What was the amount of swelling that youexperience post op? Could that be a factor in degree of shock? Did you ice and sleep upright? For How long? What was your rehab routine for first 2 weeks?

I am scheduled for HT on 10/17 and perhaps my biggest concern is shock loss. ( I feel that the surgeon I have selected is quite capable of achieving impressive work.) On all of my consults with well respected doctors, each told me that their patients did not suffer much shock loss.Many of the posters here have undergone procedyres with these doctors and have lamented somewhat about shockloss.So, I am confused about who is the most correct. I wonder, would it be possible to post some theories ( unproven is OK )about what you believe a patient might do 1-2 months pre-op to reduce the liklihood of shock loss? Also,if you did or did not suffer shock,... What was the amount of swelling that youexperience post op? Could that be a factor in degree of shock? Did you ice and sleep upright? For How long? What was your rehab routine for first 2 weeks?

If a NW 3 wants to keep the procedure private, what is the IDEAL amount of time he would want to be away from the public eye and what is the LEAST amount of time he would want to be away?

If a NW 3 wants to keep the procedure private, what is the IDEAL amount of time he would want to be away from the public eye and what is the LEAST amount of time he would want to be away?

Did you sleep in a slightly upright position (as in a recliner ) or were you lying flat as in a typical sleeping position? Some people think that Arnica Montana ( a supplement found in health food stores ) and Bromelain ( a chemical found in pineapple ) help reduce bruising and swelling. To control swelling some believe that reduced physical activity ( walking arounbd, moving about )is important for the first couple of days but mild activity is actually beneficial after about the 3rd day.

I have a HT scheduled for 1500-2000 grafts w/ Dr. Shapiro on 10/17. I would appreciate any thoughts and suggestions on what type of regimen ( vitamins, supplements,exercise,drugs,diet,ect,....)that you might recommend I adopt beginning NOW to minimize shock-loss and other possible negative consequences and maximize an optimum result. As always, Thanks.

Bill, how did your HT session w/ Dr. True go? OK I hope.

Bill, how did your HT session w/ Dr. True go? OK I hope.

I do not want to cut my hair for my HT. I know that buzzing the recipient area, according to the doctors, makes it easier for them but the surgeons that I have spoken to have also relayed to me that it is not necessary and that it would not affect final results. I have decided on a surgeon and am in the process of finalizing a surgery date for sometime in early October.I hope to have that secured by the end of next week. The surgeon who will perform the HT on me told me it would not be necessary for me to cut my hair for the HT.(I will trim it back somewhat though.)I will hold him to that. I do not want to be put in a position on the day of surgery where I am asked to buzz my recipient area. I expect to know now if the surgeon is able to perform the surgery without the buzz and still achieve high quality results.If he can't tell me now so that I can go with someone who assures me that he can.I would consider it a breech of good faith if I am pressured day of surgery to cut down the recipient area. For some guys this is not an issue but I want to keep this matter private and being in the profession that I am in the radical change in appearance would churn up a plethora of unwanted repurcussions that would last a very long time. I still have good coverage that will work well to mask the HT procedure. I don't want to relinquish that camoflouge to make the surgeon's job easier. I also still expect to achieve the same high quality results. All opinions are welcome. Thank you

I do not want to cut my hair for my HT. I know that buzzing the recipient area, according to the doctors, makes it easier for them but the surgeons that I have spoken to have also relayed to me that it is not necessary and that it would not affect final results. I have decided on a surgeon and am in the process of finalizing a surgery date for sometime in early October.I hope to have that secured by the end of next week. The surgeon who will perform the HT on me told me it would not be necessary for me to cut my hair for the HT.(I will trim it back somewhat though.)I will hold him to that. I do not want to be put in a position on the day of surgery where I am asked to buzz my recipient area. I expect to know now if the surgeon is able to perform the surgery without the buzz and still achieve high quality results.If he can't tell me now so that I can go with someone who assures me that he can.I would consider it a breech of good faith if I am pressured day of surgery to cut down the recipient area. For some guys this is not an issue but I want to keep this matter private and being in the profession that I am in the radical change in appearance would churn up a plethora of unwanted repurcussions that would last a very long time. I still have good coverage that will work well to mask the HT procedure. I don't want to relinquish that camoflouge to make the surgeon's job easier. I also still expect to achieve the same high quality results. All opinions are welcome. Thank you

thats 2000 grafts, not 200.Wish it was 200/.

Yesterday I had my consult w/ Dr. Shapiro and that makes my 3rd consult since March with 3 very capable and well respected HT surgeons. I was very impressed with Dr. Shapiro and his clinic. I found the surgical rooms to be immaculate and the tech equipment state of the art. I was able to witness a procedure. I looked through the microscope to see follicular uniits being prepared and watched as one assistant inserted some grafts into the patient's recipient area.I was impressed by her skill. Dr. Shapiro is certainly an all together guy. Very intelligent yet approachable and very generous in taking the time to explain various aspects of the procedure. There are 2 concerns that have me uncommitted at this point about which of 2 surgions to do to. I know that both can create the best hairlines given the current constraints of the procedure.I think that Dr. Shapiro might have the edge in leaving the least perceptible donor scar though I did not actually see a patient of his at the consult that would be evidence of that. I think that the other surgeon I am considering might have the edge with implanting greater density ( although through my discussions with Dr. Shapiro, density measured by number of grafts is not all that it seems) Dr. Shapiro thought I might need 200 grafts over 50-60+ sq cm. That is a larger area than I expected to cover.I also do not want to cut my existing hair, so the surface area that he envisions and that I envision are a bit at odds. ( I would appreciate opinions on this,...being conservative on a first procedure with the amount of area covered, especially with considerable existing hair, vrs a more aggressive coverage area. ) Cost is also an issue. I did not get a firm quote for the procedure with Dr. Shapiro but I suspect he is more expensive than the other surgeon I am considering.I would appreciate any advice on this issue as well as well as any other thoughts. I wish Dr. Lobbys offered more privacy/ Better arrangement of furniture and a well-placed plant might be all that is necessary.

Yesterday I had my consult w/ Dr. Shapiro and that makes my 3rd consult since March with 3 very capable and well respected HT surgeons. I was very impressed with Dr. Shapiro and his clinic. I found the surgical rooms to be immaculate and the tech equipment state of the art. I was able to witness a procedure. I looked through the microscope to see follicular uniits being prepared and watched as one assistant inserted some grafts into the patient's recipient area.I was impressed by her skill. Dr. Shapiro is certainly an all together guy. Very intelligent yet approachable and very generous in taking the time to explain various aspects of the procedure. There are 2 concerns that have me uncommitted at this point about which of 2 surgions to do to. I know that both can create the best hairlines given the current constraints of the procedure.I think that Dr. Shapiro might have the edge in leaving the least perceptible donor scar though I did not actually see a patient of his at the consult that would be evidence of that. I think that the other surgeon I am considering might have the edge with implanting greater density ( although through my discussions with Dr. Shapiro, density measured by number of grafts is not all that it seems) Dr. Shapiro thought I might need 200 grafts over 50-60+ sq cm. That is a larger area than I expected to cover.I also do not want to cut my existing hair, so the surface area that he envisions and that I envision are a bit at odds. ( I would appreciate opinions on this,...being conservative on a first procedure with the amount of area covered, especially with considerable existing hair, vrs a more aggressive coverage area. ) Cost is also an issue. I did not get a firm quote for the procedure with Dr. Shapiro but I suspect he is more expensive than the other surgeon I am considering.I would appreciate any advice on this issue as well as well as any other thoughts. I wish Dr. Lobbys offered more privacy/ Better arrangement of furniture and a well-placed plant might be all that is necessary.

$5000. for 1000 grafts is pretty average price I think for reputable docs. Many will charge more.The more grafts you get, the lower the price per graft. Flights to New York from Europe are probably best fare. There are several good docs from NY mentioned on this site.

I had my consult with Dr. Cooley yesterday. It was an excellent experience and I was very impressed with the facility. I saw a patient undergoing surgery.3 technicians were working at microscopes when I entered and the patient was alert, in good spirits and not experiencing any pain.He was at a stage in the operation where Dr. Cooley had already placed many grafts.I was amazed at the minimal trauma the scalp in the recipient area has seemed to undergo. There were multiple incision area but it was not nearly as " gorey" as I had expected it to be. Ailene, Dr. Cooley's assistant, made me feel comfortable and was thorough in explaining different aspects of the procedure. She was aware that I have been doing extensive research so I confined my questions to particular matters about Dr. Cooley and his staff.Mostly I just wanted to get a sense of the facility since most of the basic procedural questions I had already researched. I felt very comfortable with the facility. I recieved a much more comfortable feeling with this facility than I did on a previous consult with a very capable doctor. I was so at ease that I was initially tempted to cancel a scheduled consult with Dr. Shapiro in a bit over a week. I reconsidered that and feel it is important to keep that consult appointment before making a decision. I liked Dr. Cooley's personal style and felt very at ease with him.I have no question about his integrity or talent. I still have questions about the procedure itself, regardless of which surgeon is performing it. I am sure that natural results can be achieved. I saw those results on Dr. Cooley himself and another patient of his.( I am anxious to compare in more detail his approach to hairlines vrs. Dr. Shapiro.) My biggest issues are with density and donor scar.The donor scars that I have seen, by 2 different surgeons, are not nearly as imperceptible as I expected them to be. I am also coming to tnink that the amount of density that I would like to see is really not attainable, maybe not even in multiple procedures. Dr. Cooley said he could achieve 50 per sq cm in some areas for me.That is much more dense than the surgeon in a previous consult told me. ( 35 per sq cm. ) I was given a prescription for propecia and nizoral and I popped my first propecia pill yesterday. I will start off taking it every-other-day. I want to give special thanks to Robert, our forum moderator, who took the time to schedule to meet me at Dr. Cooley's office. He was gracious and generous in showing me his recipient area and scar. The recipient area is truly natural looking and at 1 year out gave no indication that it was anything but natural growth. He is a class guy and I appreciated his time and enyoyed meeting him.

I agree with Terry.Try not to let this break your spirit.Develop yourself in other ways, physically, mentally and see a REPUTABLE doc, in fact, 2 or 3. Ask them for their suggestions.

kg,..I have not had a HT yet so perhaps I am the wrong person to respond, but I sense your anxiety. You are young and if you have not had hair transplanted yet into the area that you would like more density,..I would be very cautious.We have a limited donor supply and you could end up with less hair AFTER the surgery. I think some of the problems that distingush successful from unsuccessful procedures are: Realistic expectations Accurate assessment of future hair loss progression Proper and efficient placement of a finite amount of donor hair If you have a familial pattern of extensive hair loss, imo, it is important to be very conservative in where you want to establish,...a line of defense, and consentrate density in a limited area where it will have the most advantageous cosmetic results. I would wait.

How likely do you think it could be that hair follicles develop a dependency on Minoxidil and Propecia and when men see a sudden loss of hair when they stop using those products MIGHT not have experienced that loss if they had never begun using the products? Maybe the loss that occurs is not because it would have happened any way but because the hair was " juiced up " by the introduction of those products, develops a dependency on them and then whithers away when they are removed. I don't know, I'm just thinkingaboutit.

I'm curious. You say that you had significant shockloss below the crown in the back. Do you recall,..How long after your procedure did you sleep in a reclined ( typical sleeping ) position? From the location that you pointed out it seems to me that would be a natural area for blood to flow increasing bruising which might impact the liklihood of shock loss to some degree. I wonder if bruising is better controlled if shock loss might be reduced.