V-Beam tips after Butcher job in London

[Redmann]

Hi all, new member here.

It's been just over 4 months since I got an absolute butcher job done on me in London. The short version: early 40s, NW 5/6, 2000 grafts. So far, everything that could have gone wrong, has gone wrong. But my overwhelming concern for now is the lingering, persistent redness in my recipient area. Never mind the considerable shock loss, the sparse density, the patchiness. I know 4 months is still "early days", even if we all know it would take a bit of a miracle. But frankly, at this point I don't even care about "results". It's the redness that still massively concerns me because a) it is a massive tell-tale, b) it's still the same as it was 3 weeks in, and c) if it didn't get better by now, with each week chances increasingly are it never will.

So I'm looking for tips on V-Beam treatment. I've read some people here had it done with good results. On that - Massive THANKS to everybody on this forum, as without it I would not have known about V-Beam. Where did you get it done? Was it in the UK? How much did it cost? Really appreciate any input.

On the procedure itself, I'll post some photos below so you can have a look too - Many thanks for your opinions on that as well. I've frankly lost all faith in my clinic. Please PM me if you want to know more, just don't want to reveal it in public yet. But, predictably, all they (well, their sales / front person, as seeing a doctor is nigh-on impossible) have said is - "Everything is fine", "There is no redness", "Give it time". In fact, they changed the surgeon who was going to do my procedure on the day. It was one of their junior surgeons. So, yes, on the day of the procedure I am presented at the last minute with this junior surgeon I had never seen before. Yes, all this in the UK. Not one of those daaangerous hair-tourism destinations, oh no siree, safe, developed, reputable London.

I naively said yes. Looking back, I was naive about the whole thing - Isn't hindsight wonderful. There were a lot of signs I saw but somehow ignored, thinking for all the slickness the work would be good. After all, this is a long-standing clinic. With endorsements. With recommendations. Whose doctors appear in the media. And so on.

So I'm here just trying to find some kind of way to reverse the worst aspect of all this - the redness. The chances of me getting another FUE (for repair or any other purposes) are zero. I'm happy to wear a grade 1 for the rest of my life and just get on with it now. Am I being impatient? Could this still be turned around? What can we tell about a procedure 6 months in, or 12, that we can't at 4?

Thanks a lot for everything, all. This is a tight spot for me at the moment, and this forum has been great help.

[HappyMan2021]

Can you find a different HT doctor or a dermatologist to give you a diagnosis on the redness? It sounds like you are diagnosing this all yourself and proscribing what you think is the proper treatment as well. 

Definitely have an independent MD with no financial interest in your HT give you a proper diagnosis on the redness before pursuing vbeam or any other repair treatment. 

Any capable dermatologist should be able to do this if it is hard finding a HT doctor local to you. 

Edited February 26, 2023 by HappyMan2021

[Redmann]

Hi HappyMan, thanks for checking this. You are correct that I am prescribing this all myself, and I totally agree that is far from ideal.

I have based a lot of this on a couple of threads here - by far the most informed and thorough info I found about this anywhere - especially the posts by Jay Bandana, Unbald Eagle, and Harry for Real:

https://www.hairrestorationnetwork.com/topic/48816-very-red-at-2-months-transplant-disaster-health-issue-or-just-luck/

https://www.hairrestorationnetwork.com/topic/67208-redness-pitting-cobblestone-after-3-transplants/#comment-692604

In particular the post by Unbald Eagle on the second thread is a great summary. I do this because, as Jay also says, a lot of HT surgeons are a bit oblivious (the honest ones due to no ill will) to this problem. My own clinic I already know I can't trust anymore, unfortunately.

That said, I do have a consultation with a dermatologist this coming week - a laser specialist - and should be able to find out more.

[Redmann]

Adding some photos here...
(edit was due to format)

4 weeks after procedure

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

4+ months after procedure

 

 

Lighting is key to understanding the redness as other posters mentioned. Here's a couple where you can really see it. The one under low light is admittedly low quality, but it shows the contrast between natural and recipient skin clearly.

4+ months after procedure

Edited March 2, 2023 by Redmann

[germangal]

Quote

On 2/26/2023 at 12:14 PM, Redmann said:

Adding some photos here...
(edit was due to format)

4 weeks after procedure

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

4+ months after procedure

 

 

Lighting is key to understanding the redness as other posters mentioned. Here's a couple where you can really see it. The one under low light is admittedly low quality, but it shows the contrast between natural and recipient skin clearly.

4+ months after procedure

 

Can you tell us how it worked out with your redness? I have severe redness 7 weeks post-op as well, it's not really getting better.

[Redmann]

5 hours ago, germangal said:

Can you tell us how it worked out with your redness? I have severe redness 7 weeks post-op as well, it's not really getting better.

Hello! Before I really answer your question, please let me preface it with something you might have heard before but... 7 weeks is a bit too soon to tell about anything. From my research and understanding (and here's another necessary preface - I am not a doctor, each case is different, do not take this as medical advice, etc) in most cases the redness should be gone by about 12 weeks, maybe 16. That is the sign of a well done procedure. Sure, in some cases it might take 5 months or maybe 6, but not much more than that in my opinion. Anything more than that is a sign that something went wrong - incisions too deep / shallow, wrong punch used, excessive trauma, etc. And it should get progressively better with time. From what I have seen myself (caveat above still applies)  - there is a correlation between lingering redness and poor yields.

Now, on my case: It's been almost exactly 10 months and the redness still lingers. My growth has been so poor that I have even given up on that. If I can just fix this redness somehow I'll be happy to give up the follicles (I might actually have to because they look so naff). Is it improving? A little, maybe. I am still not sure, despite having had multiple treatments for it over the past 4 months.

So, treatments, ie what can you do? The first port of call is vascular lasers. You might have read it here before (the posts above are still some of the best sources for info on this) but V-Beam is something a lot of people have had good results with. It is just a specific type / brand of pulse-dyed laser, made by Candela, but it is one of the go-to-brands. One of its advantages is that it can be delivered such that it does not harm the follicles. That is what I have been doing. I have had 4 treatments so far. I think I see some marginal improvement. I will do a couple more sessions. If by then I can definitely say this is improving, I will continue.

Other alternatives are LED therapy (such as Dermalux). That is very minimally invasive (actually just a light you shine on your red area). It's a low-risk, low-return kind of treatment. PRP is also a possibility. There are only small-scale studies for this, but in one of those (done with only 40 subjects) the group receiving PRP *during* the procedure showed no cases of redness after 6 months. The control group had 2 (so 2/20 vs 0/20). Slightly more uncharted territory. Also, microneedling - Some people have had success with it to restore texture. This is an option much further down the line.

A question - Has your doctor / clinic tested the area for infection? There is also the possibility of a low-level infection or folliculitis. It should not be difficult to do a swab test. If it turns out positive, dang, you've got an infection. But at the same time, great, you treat that and your problem should go away. I've done one and it came back negative.

So, sorry for the long-winded response, but hope it helps! My humble bottom-line is - It's too early to tell. Rule out infection. Wait until 6 months. Then start thinking of V-Beam, maybe. Also: Do yourself a favour and take consistent photos of the area. Consistent meaning, always the same (good) lighting, same angles, in regular periods. That way you can genuinely compare if there has been natural progress. If possible, have someone else check it for you, as there are of course daily fluctuations and we are not the best at evaluating ourselves. Hope this helps!

 

[germangal]

Hey. I am very sorry to hear about your experience and I can fully relate you. I hope that in the end things will turn out better for you. Thanks a lot for sharing your experience. This is definitely a thing most people do not talk about a lot. All the best! <3