ChristopherJ

Amazing.

By the way, does Dr. Koray demand that people take propecia? I'm looking at getting work done by him but I only use minoxidil.

Any other input fellas?

FUE has been achievable in cases similar ro yours. Id say consult a couple of doctors, those docs that visible in online marketing and those that dont partake in forum marketing techniques. There are unfound gems out there. Look at the costs, the quality, andformer patienta if availavle. Cost doesnt mean nothing as to how some marketers may portray. You can have a guy that charges $2 bucks a graft outperform a guy that charges $8. To say that higher cost equates to higher quality is downright fraud according to communication etc regs per the FTC. You can have a guy tgat pays much more and end up with a poor result and even more harmed after with multiple procedures. Trust me i know a few.

 

So, the key here is to be transparent. Im bein transparent by telling you to get consults from docs that indulge in heavy forum marketing and those that are not heard of online. Weigh the pros and cons and see if proper surigcal procedures are followed and that NO TECH extracts your grafts. Your paying for a doctor to work on you and any surgical incision or extraction should only be done by a doc. I dont care how artificially inflated a doc presence is, but a doc should do the job if you are paying a premium. It aggravates me to see few docs, such as in Turkey that do the entire fue procedure themselves and come out with excellent resulta and yet the consumer only pays like $1-2 per graft. Yet we have clinics here tht invoke fear of travel or their reps do and mention all the negativities about it. Honestly, i think i wish i can turn back time.

 

Im being basically told to get an expensive biopsy test out of my pocket as a prerequisite to my repair. This is even when military docs cleared me of the suspected condition the doc claims he thought i had.. Being told i will have to pay for my own expensive airline tickets and suffer more damages, in order to get repaired where the doc couldnt deliver. Not many people know these things but it is really making me think about what i went through. Then there are patients who boast about the clinic going out of their way to help me. Help me? it is always wise not to comment on someones procedure based on what you are told regarding that patient.

 

 

So, i just wanted to let you know. Dont believe everything. Talk to real patients and not celebrities or folks advicating a clinic or defending one profusely. Just do your own research. If you in the area i can show you my donor and hairline density right now in person.

Thanks for the feedback. I've had my eye on some of the Turkish FUE wizards. It's just a matter of making that commitment and trip all the way from Canada.

Have you considered buzzing down to a 3? I think you have the head for it.

I am currently buzzed down below a 3. I buzz down to a 1 every week. That photo was taken less than a week after I buzzed down to a 1.

I have been on minoxidil for several years which has maintained by crown fairly well. The pattern on my crown has not changed since I was 22-23. Unfortunately finasteride had side effects which forced me to stop using it.

Knowing my crown loss has slowed, do you believe I'd be a candidate for FUE?

I'm a 27 year old male headed for what I believe is a norwood 5a? Would you guys agree? How smart would it be in your opinion to get a FUE procedure done at this stage? How many grafts do you believe it would take? My hope is to keep my hair buzzed so density isn't as great a concern for me as it may be for others.

My hair in these photos were buzzed at a 1 last week.

I have a really embarrassing/funny story to share with you guys.

A quick back story first though. I've been seeing my girlfriend for a year now and she has no idea I use toppik daily. We live together and she hasn't noticed anything. It doesn't come out in my pillow so that hasn't been an issue. I also never let her touch my hair which she finds odd, but mostly just humorous and an accepted part of my neurotic personality.

However, for the first time in our relationship it became pretty obvious that I have something in my hair. Usually when I put toppik in my hair I will have to shake out the excess fibers once or twice before the proper level of toppik is blended into my hair. But this time I didn't do a good enough job I guess.

Anyways, so here's the story.

When she gets out of the shower I always have the privilege of rubbing lotion all over her body. Sometimes I will go a little farther than that depending on how much time we have. In this case, I decided to pay a visit down there.. if you know what I mean. I've done this literally countless times with her and it's never been a problem, but I guess the combination of the position of her legs/my head, the lotion, and the excess toppik, caused quite a mess. After I finished I look up and the entire inside of her legs are covered in brown toppik. She was so confused.

Finally, after what seemed like eons, she asks, "do you dye your hair?" I never thought I'd be so relieved to hear that question. I told her that I saw a few grey hairs a week ago and bought this cheap hair dye. She thought it was the dumbest-cutest thing ever and we haven't talked about it since.

But seriously, that was like my 'worst toppik nightmare' come true.

I'm just not ready to admit the extent of my hair loss with her. The good news for me is that she knows I use rogaine so she knows hair loss is in the equation. And she's also told me she'll love me no matter what which should go without saying when you live together with someone, but it's still very comforting to hear.

So there's my little story.

I find toppik more and more difficult to apply. I think it may be because my hair is longer than in the past, but it may also be a simple matter of having less hair and therefore using more of it. I've ordered Dermatch so I am going to try that as well.

Hi there,

1. I've just ordered rogaine foam. I've read conflicting reports on whether taking it once per day rather than the recommended two times a day decreases the affectiveness of it.

Apparently is has a half life of 22 hours so taking it once a day should work just as well.

Tell me where I'm wrong...

2. I took propecia for over a year and started getting weaker erections/difficulty maintaining erections. If I were to cut my dosage in half, and/or take it once every two days, do you think that would decrease the chance of side effects? Anyone have any experience with this happening?

This will probably be a mess. I suggest putting the toppik on in the morning, wash it out at night, and then put on the rogaine before bed (just once a day).

Aren't you supposed to apply it twice a day?

I've decided to give the rogaine foam a go. I ordered it through amazon -- is there a more cost affective method that you guys know about?

The one major nuisance I foresee other than the daily maintenance is how I'll work around the toppik. I guess I'll shower in the morning, apply the rogaine and then the toppik. Then apply the rogaine again at night with the toppik in? I don't want to shower multiple times a day, but then again, would the toppik block the minoxidl from reaching my scalp?

This all comes back to not being comfortable around anyone without toppik. I don't want to take the toppik off, especially around the girlfriend. Perhaps this will become unrealistic if I use rogaine twice a day, but I'm hoping I can just apply it over the toppik. Thoughts on how affective that may or may not be?

I'm also fairly certain I won't be combining both. The side effects of propecia, whether medical or simply psychological, was simply not worth the stress.

Hey everyone,

Just a short update.

I didn't go through with the hair transplant, thank god. I really appreciate the advice given to me on here because it definitely made the difference. I was three days from going through with a transplant that would never have worked because I'm still losing hair.

Because I still continued to lose hair, coupled with some sexual side effects, I've gotten off propecia starting about two months ago. What has helped me is that I guess abooouuut nine months ago I started using toppik. It's been a wonder in helping me get over the psychological burden of balding. It appears as if I have a moderately full set of hair, even though I don't at all.

Of course, there are problems with this. I really don't go anywhere without it, unless I'm wearing a hat. I have a new girlfriend, who I've been dating for 9 months, and she has NEVER seen me without my 'toppik hair'. She assumes I have a lot more hair than I do. We're moving in together in January and we've agreed to move from Vancouver to Ottawa (from western to eastern Canada) for her school.

What stresses me out is that the hair loss has escalated. I don't dare pull at my hair because I know I'll grab one or two strands every time. And of course, as you may have already predicted, I'm very worried that she will in short time find out I'm going bald. That scares me. We love each other and I assume nothing will change. But at the same time I'm only 23 and I don't look good bald. If she isn't attracted to me physically anymore will it work out? Girls say confidence is what really matters, and on the outside I have a confident personality, but on the inside this is slowly eating me alive.

I can only dump so much toppik on my head, ya know?

I guess my update is more a search for advice. If you're in my situation do you just tell the girlfriend "hey, I'm going bald, deal with it". Or do I not risk it and just maintain the illusion as long as possible?

Here's a pic of me with my toppik hair attached.

Ultimately, you have to make the call and live with the decision.

 

What I mean by the "right time" for an HT is when age, experience, financial conditions, known (and proven) surgeon/clinic skill, known balding pattern, known donor supply/condition, expectations, and degree of hair loss all dovetail together and an informed decision can be made.

 

In a nut shell, you want to be a 45 year old guy in a solid financial situation whose balding is fairly well along and who is not concerned about getting chicks at the clubs. Or whose concerned what his 20 something buddies are saying at the pool party. (that's a little tongue in cheek, but you get what I'm saying I hope)

 

But anyway---

 

My advice to a guy in your shoes would be to at least be on Propecia for at least 18 months to 2 years. That way you can really see what it can do for you. You'll see if there are any sides and what degree of stabilization/re-growth you get.

 

I should also say that I'm not a big fan of playing with your body's chemistry and wouldn't take Propecia myself, but that's another conversation.

 

Ultimately, you are going to be counting on Propecia for quite a lot, correct? If you move ahead with the transplant to the temples, you need to be sure you will not lose hair behind the transplant and end up chasing your hair loss. That's the big danger.

 

Because if that happens, you're going to end up with multiple surgeries, multiple scars, a depleted donor area, (probably) a tight and/or numb scalp, and I be willing to bet you wouldn't be happy with the results. Plus the fact that the state of your hair will consume you for the next 10 or 15 years. And of course a huge financial drain.

 

So if you go ahead with the transplant, you're going to have to depend on Propecia-- for life. You'll be worried about sides or if it will one day stop working. Those thoughts are going to be constantly with you. Are you prepared for that? is that any better than worrying about your current recession? see what I mean by trading one set of issues/concerns for another?

 

You also mention that you can mostly hide your recession with longer hair but that it takes a lot of work. I'm assuming fussing in the morning, maybe using a cover product, etc. Maybe worrying about wind, water, and weather. Well, welcome to the club! you needn't feel special about it.

 

So your current hair loss is not that bad and you can mostly hide it with longer hair, which you state is your preference anyway.

 

You're on Propecia, which you've recently started. You've started your research and seem willing listen and learn. You've also showed good judgment in looking to a top rated clinic (H&W) for a possible future procedure.

 

For the present, I think you're in good shape. Give the Propecia (if that's your choice to take it) another year to 18 months and the re-evaluate a surgical option.

 

That would be my call, but again, you have to make the decision and live with it.

 

Hal

Your rationale sounds more logical by the hour. Thanks for the response and the honesty, I will definitely consider all your guys input. I'm very strongly leaning to the 'just deal with what you got' side of the fence at this juncture. We'll see how things are in the near future.

Hi ChristopherJ

 

I have just a couple of queries and statements to make regarding your recent decision to opt for FUT transplantation.

 

Have you contacted the Hasson and Wong clinic (Joe or Doug?) with photos to receive a proper evaluation of your current hair loss situation? If not then this would be a wise decision especially to find out if you are indeed going to make a good candidate for Surgery. Many hair loss sufferers around your age who I have seen floating around the forums describing very similar circumstances to yourself have made identical declarations when discussing a prospective scar. Why has FUE not been addressed? What is your current understanding of FUE? Have you approached clinics discussing your concerns (with photos) whom are offering this technique? Exploring all procedure options is definitely a MUST when deciding on any form of surgery.

 

You have claimed throughout your posts that this factor of sporting a scar will not phase nor deter your decision to go under the surgical knife.

Regardless of the amount of research you may have conducted surrounding this topic I honestly hope you do understand that once the surgery is complete and you have been left scarred as a result of this process future scar revision surgery will only aid the dimension previously set. A surgical scar is very difficult to remove, also noting that the revision will only increase the likelihood of stretching.

I would strongly recommend looking outside the box, amend your research and commence an investigation into closure techniques/scar revisions etc. This is not intended to come across in a condescending manner.

 

 

I cannot sit here completely judging you on your philosophies, I too was at your age and in very similar shape with my hair loss (technically I still am), and a receding hairline is obviously situated within a very difficult section to conceal. I went through all the similar motions as you or anybody posting on this forum would of/may have gone through and blatantly putting it, the experience sucks! I have also been advised by consultants and physicians (long ago) too simply “wait it out”, during this occasion going out of my arrogant mind of course. Reminiscing now however, this was the best option I ever took relating to my hair loss battle, now at 28 with my knowledge intact all spontaneous decision making relating to HT surgery is a thing of the past. There are many highly educated and fantastic people posting on this site mate, I strongly suggest taking their advice on board.

 

Looking at the photo you originally posted it is somewhat complicated to assess the future pattern of loss, I can however confirm the sign of recession, but would not say this is terribly prominent (with the buzzed style that is). Seeing as though you have only been consistently taking Fin for 7 months it is far too early to determine the probability of success with this medication. Has the thought of adding Minox into your current regimen come into play?

Like others have mentioned during the discussion, sticking it out for a slightly longer period of time will only benefit the outcome.

 

I will be brutally honest with my final conclusion; please do not view this as being victimised. I am honestly only attempting to assist you in making the correct decision.

If I were a HT physician or represented a HT physician in a consultancy type role and stumbled across your post I would basically note that you are truly not yet ready for a HT procedure at this particular point in time.

 

Mate I realise the responses posted are not exactly what you would like to be reading right now, but one of the main focuses of this forum is to further educate and hinder poor decision making.

To this very day I am still yet to make an exact selection on physician and procedure type, a far better situation to display in my honest opinion rather than having described to you a poor decision of the past.

 

Feel free to PM me anytime, but would always firstly insist on speaking with one of the many super HT educated consultants posting online such as Spex or Mattj etc…

 

Cheers,

 

 

 

 

Really appreciate the response.

I actually did contact Hasson and Wong, and met with Doug and Dr. Wong. They said I was an ideal candidate because I had thick density, lots of donor hair, and I was realistic and conservative in my expectations. Having said that, I only met with Dr. Wong for about 5 minutes and I never truly felt comfortable in their assessment. It's not really their fault, I did tell them propecia had worked to stall my hair loss... however, to be honest, I'm not entirely positive of this. It has definitely slowed down the process, but I still lose some hairs... I haven't been able to conclude one way or the other whether my hairline has still receded since propecia. But you and others are likely right, I need a longer period of time to truly judge its effectiveness.

I have not looked into FUE. I understand its benefits, but I know Hasson and Wong have proven results using the strip method. I don't really have the capacity to travel too far to search out these places, which is another reason I like H&W -- I live a 10 minute drive away. But I can definitely see the benefit of FUE, I just have no idea where to begin looking within Vancouver.

I've admittedly come off as pretty naive about the scar issue. You don't come off as condescending at all, it's something I'll have to look into later on. I guess the idea of a scar hasn't concerned me since I already have a prominent scar on the back of my head, and was never bothered by anyone about it when I had my hair buzzed a couple of years ago. And the plan is to have hair, right? So I guess the scar issue never truly crossed my mind, although in hindsight, perhaps it could be a factor later on down the road.

And nope, I have not tried minox... it's something I really don't want to try, but who knows, I may become desperate enough. It's just a very high maintenance product, and I have pretty sensitive skin as it is... I just don't foresee it working. And after using a bit of toppik around the thinning portions of my corner hairlines I guess it doesn't look that bad.

You are still taking one heck of a chance. In effect, you're rolling the dice, hoping everything works out right.

 

Maybe your plan will work, maybe it won't.

 

Reading over your replies in the thread, my concerns for you are as follows:

 

1). You say you are miserable and want to "enjoy your 20's" and not worry about your hair. Many is the guy who has thought that only to find out that a hair transplant was just the start of their worries. My concern is that you won't be happy with the transplant, or you'll start to loss more hair behind it. Instead of "solving" your hair problems, you'll just be trading one set of concerns/problems for another. This by the way is the same thing that guys who opt for hair pieces go through. I just don't think you have the right mental attitude.

 

2). You don't see to be looking at the long term. Its as if you think life stops at 30 or something. As other have pointed out, life can do funny things to even the best considered plans. You may not believe this, but your hair issues may one day take a back seat to other priorities. 10 or 15 years from now, you'll probably look back and wonder why you wasted so much time worrying about this issue. That's not to say it still won't bug you and that you'll want to do something about it-- only that it won't seem like the end of the world as it does now.

 

A hair transplant can be the right choice for the right candidate at the right time in life. I just don't think that's you at this point.

 

I understand that's not what you want to hear-- basically, you think a transplant is going to solve your hair problems, at least for the short term. And for the future? well, you'll deal with that as it comes up and surely there will be options. Isn't that about the situation?

 

As I said in my earlier post, that kind of thinking (and those expectations) just throw up a lot of red flags-- at least to me.

 

Hal

I appreciate the response.

What do you suggest I do? The thing about waiting until my hair loss pattern shows and taking propecia is that they contradict one another. If I take propecia it will stall my hair loss and therefore only mask my natural hair loss pattern. So I don't understand when the 'right time' is for a hair transplant?

And I'm not miserable, that's a silly exaggeration on my part. But I am quite frustrated. In a moment of madness I buzzed my hair but I've masked it fairly well with longish hair. It's just a lot of work and very tiresome sometimes.

But you are. You're giving up your option to ever cut your hair shorter than a given length again (without displaying a linear scar), and you're committing yourself to additional future procedures to keep up as your hair loss continues.

 

 

 

If you don't know the pattern of your future hair loss, you can't definitively state that you'll "still have plenty of grafts from donor hair for extra procedures."

 

 

 

Keep in mind that Propecia is not a magic bullet. It doesn't work for everyone, its results are variable, and at best it only slows hair loss (it doesn't stop it completely). You can't know how well it's going to work for you long-term after having taken it for just seven months.

Well, I'd argue that I'm not wasting money. Like I said, if worst comes to worst I genuinely do not care having a scar on my head. There's also scar reduction surgeries. Furthermore, I've already acknowledged the fact that I could likely lose more hair post transplant, but I'd like to have a hairline in my 20s while I can. Your idea of waiting out my pattern seems llogical to some extent, but it's almost like pick your poison. Either I continue to rock my receded hairline and feel bad in my 20s and then get a procedure in my 30s, or I get my transplant and feel good about myself and then face whatever challenges that come along as they go.

The bottom-line is that life is short and I'd rather feel good while I can. Having said that, I have stilled prepared in a conservative fashion for future hair loss, and if I have to shave or buzz my hair I honestly don't care about a scar. I already have a large scar higher up on the back of my head and I haven't cared in the slightest about it showing when I've had my hair buzzed previously.

It's kind of like asking why you shouldn't spend all your money right now on stuff you enjoy instead of saving any of it for the future. Your circumstances will likely be very different in the future in ways you can't anticipate, and you'll find yourself regretting that you blew everything chasing ephemeral pleasures to the sacrifice of long-term happiness and stability.

Except I'm not chasing everything, I'm using a conservative portion of my donor supply to

give myself sone form of a hairline... I'm not wasting 'all my money' at all.

Where to start?

 

You're a young guy-- and you're receding.

 

Your friends and family have noticed-- they've even made comments. And man, those comments sting, don't they? You go around looking at other guys great hairlines and think "why me"?

 

You're worried about getting laid-- hey, girls like hair. And if you don't do something about about your receding hairline soon, you're going to end up a monk.

 

Man, you'd give anything if you could just have that hairline you had a few years ago, when you were 17 or 18. In fact, that's what you're hoping for with a hair transplant. You don't need a lot-- just fill in the temples.

 

With this transplant, you're being pro active. You're going to to "stay ahead of your hair loss". And if you need another transplant down the road due to more hair loss, so what? you'll just get another. But that's years away and not much of a concern right now, is it?

 

_______________________________

 

How am I doing? does that about sum it up?

 

If you get a transplant now, you might very well end up chasing your future hair loss for the next 20 years.

 

Maybe Propecia will stop any loss. Maybe it won't. Maybe you'll decide for some reason to stop taking it.

 

And if you lose more hair behind the temple transplants, then what? More surgery?

 

Suppose you have shock loss around your temple area and donor? Are you prepared for that?

 

Getting another procedure down the road seems easy enough right now, but suppose your circumstances or priorities change and its not feasible?

 

I don't know you, but you seem awfully young and blase' about the procedure and potential scarring, etc.

 

Personally, I think a person your age with your degree of loss is crazy to go under the knife. You should be a least a Norwood 5 and have a very clear picture of your balding pattern. But that's me.

 

I see a number of red flags and think you could easily be one of those guys who ends up regretting their procedure and ends up on these boards asking advice on how to "reverse a hair transplant".

 

Ultimately you have to do your research and make your own call.

 

But if you're chasing your teen hairline and concerned about not getting laid because of your receding hairline, then you're making a huge mistake.

 

Hal

Hey, I appreciate the response.

You're pretty much bang on, although I have a girlfriend so I'm not overly worried about getting laid.

I guess I don't understand yours and others rationale. You want me to wait and get balder and more miserable... and then have a hair transplant? I like the notion that I can have a hair transplant now and feel good about myself, perhaps enjoy my 20s instead of being the balding dude. It's not like I won't be able to have another transplant down the road if need be, and like I said, I've taken propecia for a significant amount of time and it's working from what I can tell. I realize how cavalier and almost ignorant the first part of that sentence sounds to many, but I'm financially stable and I don't see any foreseeable obstacles on that front -- although that isn't to suggest I'm not aware of the unpredictability of life and the possibility that I won't be able to get a transplant on the drop of a dime.

All I can say is that I've done countless hours of research and I'm aware of the risks. I know I'm young, I know there's a probably chance I'm in for more hair loss, etc. But I don't get why people want young people to wait and feel ostracized when there's practical solutions to remedy how they feel. It doesn't make sense to me.

Also, I'm not looking for a teenage hairline, as I've discussed with the doctors, I'd like a conservative hairline that conservatively manages the amount of grafts used in preparation for future hair transplants. Hopefully by that time technology has caught up though and I won't have to worry about managing donor hair.

Okay2land, can you go into more details about what happened? The good news is that technology has come a long ways since 12 years ago -- for one, you probably didn't have the aid of propecia to stall hair loss...

No, I prefer my hair long. And I do know the difference. I just buzzed my hair to see if I could handle having that style and I definitely do NOT want short hair. However, if my hair does continue to recede and I have to buzz or shave my head I don't really care about a scar. There's ways of removing scars, and worst comes to worst I'll just make up a cool story or something.

I'm thinking of going for a hair transplant at H&Ws to fill in my receded temples. I'm very young though, almost 23. I guess I feel that with propecia and I can stall any future fair loss for the next little while (Taken in for 7 months with good results).

If I continue to lose hair I'll still have plenty of grafts from my donor hair for extra procedures I may need down the road. The bottomline is I want to have hair when I'm young and in my 20s. I feel awful the way it is.

Also, it's much easier to hide thinning hair in the middle of my scalp then it is to mask hair loss from my hairline. Hair concealers like toppik don't work for hairlines but they'll work for any extra diffuse loss I may have above the hairline.

Here's a pic of my hair situation with my hair buzzed:

Thoughts? I know I'm young and don't know the pattern of my hair loss, but I'm miserable the way my hair is now. And like I said, as long as I stay on propecia, and have a conservative long term plan for future hair procedures, I think I'm making a safe decision.

Hi,

I'm 21 years old and have noticed significant hair loss the last few months. I keep getting fed the line, "don't worry, everyone loses about 100 hairs a day!", but obviously it is worse than that. I constantly see it on my shoulders, in the shower, from the vacuum, etc.

Anyways, I can accept losing my hair begrudgingly, but I'm losing it from everywhere -- not just the crown or front. When I gently tug and the back of my scalp I'm pulling out up to a half a dozen hairs each time. Does this mean I'm going full bald? I plan to see a doctor/dermatologist quite soon, but I thought I might do some research first.

So to tie this all in with the theme of the website, IF I am going fully bald, I assume a HT wouldn't be wise until I lost all my hair?

Thanks

Chris