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Spock

11 months results with DeYarman

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I'm now 11 months post op in my hairline restoration and feel I've got a good feel for how this thing is going to turn out. Pat asked me to let it mature before posting more on my results. I think I'm now ready

 

History: I'm 42 years old and had 1620 grafts placed in the frontal 1/3rd (47 cm2) on November 18 2004 by Dr. DeYarman in San Diego. I was a NW3a before and am now kind of a thin NW2. Also had a small HT of 309 micrografts in 1994 by John Lenhart in FL and by all accounts it was done pretty good. My skin is average caucasian brown and hair is thin, straight, and dark brown. I have tight skin. Not just on my head but over my whole body. I was concerned about donor laxity, but DeYarman checked me over well and felt it was not a problem.

 

So what are my results? Mixed; on a good day I give it a C-. I've had fair general growth of the recipient hair. That is the good news. The bad news has been the donor area, certain aspects of the hairline, and a somewhat thin and weak appearance of the general recipient area.

 

Immediately after surgery I had a lot of pain, swelling, and numbness of the center left of the back of head around and above the suture line. It was a specific area only. As the weeks progressed I had a friend take pictures of the donor area. I had a scar that ranges between 2 and 2.5mm in width along it's length with significant shock loss around the suture line. Most of this shock loss was temporary. But the real problem is the two mysterious 0.7 cm diameter shock loss areas in the numb center left region above the suture line. At 10 months none of this hair has come back. Dr. Deyarman has been concerned about this from the start, but has no definitive explanation for it. I believe they are suture hole areas that caused pain, swelling, and permanent shock loss. Ultimately they will require some grafts to fill in. I keep my hair at least 3/4" long so it can only be seen if my hair is wet. Sorry, no good pics.

 

The other item that I feel is of mixed result is my recipient hair. It was planted at about 30 grafts/cm2 in the front line and 30 to 40 elsewhere. At this point the transplants do not match or blend in well with the surrounding hair of the sides and mid scalp. The entire recipient hair has a weird texture and curliness to it. It starts out straight but as it gets near the ends it abruptly curls toward the back. It just plain looks funny. Because of this I must keep my hair less than 1 inch to minimize the effect. It's noticeable when viewed from the top. I totally avoid situations where I might bend my head down or people might view me from up high. Pics enclosed.

 

Lastly, the grafts on the left side in and near the left temple did not grow. As you come forward along the hairline, about 2 cm out of the apex, that's when the transplants start growing. It creates a asymmetry that really bothers me. Why did it happen? Did the techs damage this group of grafts? Did I sleep on them hard under the influence of heavy pain killers? Another mystery neither of us can explain. Pics enclosed.

 

Over the last 10 months I've been back to Dr. DeYarman several times to discuss my results. He has tried to offer some explanations, but for the most part can't explain any of it. I believe he is an honest, ethical, and caring doctor. However, I believe he gets mixed results with his patients. I know another person who went to him and got similar number of grafts in the same areas. He is very happy with his results.

 

Moving forward I'm scheduled to do refinement work an FUE doctor in Atlanta in December. I'm targeting 1800 FUE. I won't do strip again! Way too painful for me and I believe my donor laxity won't allow it. Will concentrate on the left temple area, hairline in general, and improve density in the front 1/2 (extending about 2cm farther back than last time). May put a few into my two donor shock loss areas too.

 

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I am no expert, but that does not look good after 11 months brother. Did the doc offer any money back or corrective work? Perhaps he will foot the bill for FUE at another facility? Your immediate post op pics look awesome. I cannot believe you are not very dense in front. Please keep us all posted as to how all of this is handled.


Go Cubs!

 

6721 transplanted grafts

13,906 hairs

Performed by Dr. Ron Shapiro

 

Dr. Ron Shapiro and Dr. Paul Shapiro are members of the Coalition of Independent Hair Restoration Physicians.

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hey man, thats too bad about your procedure. Best of luck in your repair. Same thing happened to me with my 1st doc. a lot of success stories, but no doctor is 100% perfect and I was in the minority in the resulting damage the doc inflicted.

 

i went to deyarman and I am hoping I fall in the majority. so far so good.


____________________________

630 FUT - 8/27/03

2200 FUT - 5/20/05

2000 FUT - 12/15/07

 

 

"i haven't been this bald since.... well... since I was born!"

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I feel for you. Even thogh it seems like doc put more than 1600 grafts and you would get decent coverage and density, 11 month post op looks very thin... I would say no more than 500 grafts grew. I would recommend that you go see some really experienced HT surgeons and see if they have seen anything like this before with their patients. Because I think you should be concerned about how your next HT will come out.

 

I had a same problem with my sutures. On the right end where they tie the knot, I had minor shockloss which never grew back! I don't know if staples is better way to close the donor site, but FUE is the way to go if you don't have a huge bald spot to cover. In your case, you only need to recover frontal 1/3, so I think FUE should would best for you. Which doc are you planning on going to for your repair procedure? There are only several quality docs who perform quality FUE, so be careful who you goto.

 

KG

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Still looks a bit thin to me. 1620/47= 34 grafts/cm2 on average. While not a dense number, I did expect a thicker visual appearance. Especially since there is some previous work in there.

 

I agree, very disappointing results - doesn't look close to 34 grafts/cm2... I hope my HT turns out better than that icon_frown.gif After reading all the success stories, this is disturbing.

 

PB

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Originally posted by Spock:

Yeah, the results are not great. To say I'm disappointed would be an understatement.

 

Is there any chance of a refund? Obviously the doctor can't refund your strip of scalp but financially...

 

I agree, your warning about Minoxidil should be taken seriously. Unfortunately I didn't find out that previously good healthy hair can become minoxidil dependant before I started using it. I stopped using Minoxidil about 7 weeks ago, not because I had any scalp irritation, but because it didn't work. I used it for almost a year. I am now terrified that my hair is going to shed. So far I haven't noticed anything dramatic but I'm going to get some new photos done to compare to photos I had taken this summer for the HT doctor.

 

PB

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Spock-

 

I agree with you. I don't encourage anybody to use Minox. I had used it for 2 yrs, eventually got sick of it and stopped. Within just few weeks, my crown looked worse than what I had started with! I regret that desicion. Although, I don't recommend it to anybody to use Minox, I think it is safe to use for 2 months post-op to give boost to new grafts without having your natural hair be depedant on minox. Any opinions on this thought?

 

KG

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I'm pasting this response back, minus the reference to my next doctor in Atlanta...

 

"Yeah, the results are not great. To say I'm disappointed would be an understatement.

 

One other thing I forgot to mention was my withdrawal from minox. I was on it for 6 months post op, but had to stop. I was not tolerating well at all. Lots of redness and itching. I tried a couple times to stop for a week to let it calm down. But every time I restarted, it immediately turned bright red again.

 

6 weeks after stopping minox I took a set of pics and was horrified how much natural hair just behind the transplant line I had lost. I believe I lost more hair by the shock of stopping minox than if I had never used it. Let that be a warning to diffuse thinners who cavalierly think using minox post op to help the grafts is a good idea.

 

Having said that, I still think the yield rate on this HT was low. Maybe ~ 50% in general and zero in the left temple.

 

FYI, post op I used a healthy dose of vitamins, MSM, even graftcyte spray

 

I'm not looking for any refunds. I don't consider it a botch job. Besides, there are no guarantees in life."

 

KG

In reference to your question on 2 months use. I feel if your on it long enough to get any benifit you will be on it long enough to suffer it's withdrawl. Don't get the minox monkey on your back!

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Spock,

 

I appreciate you giving it over ten months to evaluate your procedure with the benefit of time. Based on the description of your hair texture, your transplanted hair has not fully grown in or matured at this time.

 

Some patients on rare occasions do experience delayed growth and not all their new hair growth appears until 12 to even 18 months. The immature hair characteristics "wierd texture" you describe are symtomatic of this.

 

I think your heavy use of Rogaine, which was then halted several months after your hair transplant, may also be a factor in disrupting your new hair growth cycle.

 

While your currrent growth is clearly sub optimal, I believe you will see continued improvement as new hair grows in and the existing transplanted hair matures into healthy terminal hairs.

 

I would like to discuss your case directly with Dr. DeYarman if that is ok with you.

 

Please keep us posted.

 

Thanks, Pat


Never Forget - It's what radiates from within, not from your skin, that really matters!

My Hair Loss Blog

View some of the Leading Hair Transplant Clinics that I have visited.

Sharing is what keeps this community vital. Please join in. To learn how I restored my hair and started this community, click here.

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I don't really know if the use of minox affected the growth of the transplants. Without a control group it's not possible to know.

 

Many people report using minox for a few months post op, so if it did have a strong negative effect on the transplants than I must be unusual. I"ve not heard of others reporting this type of problem.

 

I'm now speculating, but I'm guessing that the transplants are slowly thinning out. I see less hair now than 2 months ago. I hope it's a temporary situation and that they just cycle through it.

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Originally posted by Spock:

I'm now speculating, but I'm guessing that the transplants are slowly thinning out. I see less hair now than 2 months ago. I hope it's a temporary situation and that they just cycle through it.

 

Have you been back to see the doctor? This is a frightening case - I just hope it's something that's going to sort itself out - like the hairs going back into the resting phase for a while. Especially worrying because I'm going for a similar HT in one month from today (well I expect that mine will be a bigger operation with between 2000 ??“ 2500 grafts, but in the same frontal 1/3 area) - a different doctor though. I think this needs to be investigated ??“ perhaps the technicians haven't received adequate training and are damaging the follicular units or something.

 

PB

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I'm not sure who originally brought up the minox issue. But I developed a nasty reaction to it after my last procedure. I started using it a week after my procedure, and had swelling, itching, and some nasty clear fluid oozing. Not fun.

I stopped it immediately and had not lasting effects.

 

Spock, it looks like you had shockloss of your original hair. That may explain what happened. Hard to say if it will be permenant. Only time will tell.

 

I had the same thing with that after my first procedure. Unfortunelty, mine was permenant shockloss. Your photo's remind me a lot of what I experianced, in the same amount of time.

 

Hard to say exactly what is going on... But if you received 1620 in the front 1/3, and that's generally about 32 sq. sm. of all area covered, based on a NW5 (150 sq. cm. total area) for comsmetic coverage. That then may explain the thin look you have if you lost the original hair do to shockloss.

 

Good luck man... I know exactly what you are going through.

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Originally posted by Spock:

Moving forward I'm scheduled to do refinement work an FUE doctor in Atlanta in December. I'm targeting 1800 FUE. I won't do strip again!

If you are scheduled with whom I think you are,I would advise you to get some more consults.

There are some donor area scar issues with the fue doctor of Atlanta.

Have you tried an online consult with Dr. Woods of Australia. He was the actual originator of fue, I think.

Or try Dr. AP, aka Dr. A of India. He too seems to have lots of results and is credited with efforts at eliminating fue scarring.


7500 grafts till now. All by Dr. Arvind/Dr.A, New Delhi.

They include strip FUHT, FUE and body hair grafts.

Hoping to accomplish full hair restoration.

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Spoke,

 

I did speak with Dr. DeYarman yesterday. I was pleased to hear that he did offer to provide you with a complimentary session of either FUE or strip to add density.

 

Apparently you are considering FUE else where. In my opinion, if you are willing to travel, Dr. AP of India offer the best FUE value on the planet at $3.50 per FUE graft. His ethics and work also look very promising.

 

Dr. DeYarman also mentioned that he had photos of your results taken at about 9 months out that he would like to post on this topic. Could you contact him and give him permission to post these photos on this topic?

 

I do think that you should wait at least 3 or 4 more months to really see how much more hair growth you will get before doing more surgery with any one. I do think there is a real chance that you are a "late bloomer".

 

Best wishes, Pat


Never Forget - It's what radiates from within, not from your skin, that really matters!

My Hair Loss Blog

View some of the Leading Hair Transplant Clinics that I have visited.

Sharing is what keeps this community vital. Please join in. To learn how I restored my hair and started this community, click here.

Follow our Community on Twitter.

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I was pleased to hear that he did offer to provide you with a complimentary session of either FUE or strip to add density.

 

Best wishes, Pat

 

 

i would go for this...


____________________________

630 FUT - 8/27/03

2200 FUT - 5/20/05

2000 FUT - 12/15/07

 

 

"i haven't been this bald since.... well... since I was born!"

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Yes, Dr. DeYarman did offer a complimentary strip revision. I appreciate the offer. However I don't think I'll take him up on it. I've continued to do more research in the last 11 months and have made other choices. Plus I need more hair (not just a scar revision) and do NOT want to do another strip. Per Robert's request I will not state my next surgeons name on this forum.

 

I will contact him and give permission to post any pics he has of me, but no full monty. I have nothing to hide about the results and I know neither does he. Let the facts fall where they may.

 

The last set of pics he took were at the 8 month mark. I'm now at 11+ months and feel it's thinner than at 8 months where it appeared to have visually peaked in density. Hopefully the transplants just cycle through this and I'll get the full density.

 

I have taken pictures every month with a 5 megapixel camera at exactly the same angle and lighting, which has been great for comparison. I don't expect his pics to change my opinion. And, like I said before, the left temple problem just does not show up in pics. It must be seen in person.

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