What do you think of this transplant? Please give feedback

[rpachigo]

If worried about less than optimal growth in scarred area, why not consider small test patch.

[Dr. Alan Feller]

Significant variations in the skin's ability to support a graft can vary by as little as 3 mm in even healthy skin. In scarred skin the variations from area to area are even greater.

 

So test patches really don't provide any useful information. They are also impractical as far as the real world goes because the test patch itself will lead to scar formation thus making the situation in that part of the skin even worse. This is why I am not a fan of multiple small surgeries of FUE when one strip surgery will get the job done with the least amount of scarring.

 

The best way to handle an already scarred area is simply to avoid a dense pack so as not to overwhelm it. In GIR 's case, he only has about a max of 1,500 grafts availalbe so avoiding dense packing will not be a challenge.

[GettingItRight]

Here are the photos I promised. They are all dry and product free.

Except for one which I put up for the benefit of those who think I'm using wet photos.

They were all taken yesterday.

 

 

 

Close up - Dry & product free

 

 

 

 

Close up - Dry & product free

 

 

 

 

Dry & product free

 

I believe someone requested I place a newspaper in the photo.

I assume to date it ? I didn't have a newspaper handy so...

 

 

 

 

Wet & product free

[GettingItRight]

Originally posted by TC17:

gettingitright,

 

Can you provide us a little bit of background on you, please? I'd like to know how old you are, when you started losing your hair, family history of hair loss, how many surgeries you've had and any other information that could help shed better light on your case.

 

 

Hi TC17,

 

I'm 52, started losing at around 30. Father has near full head of hair (bast***). I've had 3 previous surgeries.

 

Hope that helps

[rpachigo]

I don't see that much improvement but can you style it better now than before?

[M1A1]

GIR,

 

I am amazed at how the pictures contrast with those of Dr Feller. To give a more life like comparison, can you post more pictures with your hair styled. You know the way you wear it in public.

 

Styling your HT hair can and will often make a huge improvement in the illusion of density-most of the time...

 

Although I am sorry to hear that you are not happy. What are your future plans with Dr Feller?

 

Thank you,

[John Malloy]

Hey GIR,

 

I feel for you bro. Trust me I know exactly what your going through. I'm glad that I ran into your post because I'm experiencing a very similiar situation. I had a Ht in June of 08 which turned out horrific. After doing my research, I was pointed in Dr. Feller's direction. After all the accolades that I read about Feller, and the fact he himself told me that I'm an easy fix had me very confident about my repair with him. Unfortunately, 7 months later I'm very unsatisfied with the result. While my balding was not quite extensive as yours--I was an early 3, the hair line looks extremely stalky: however, it does not look bad in pics. Unfortunately, people don't conversate with me through camera lenses. While I'm still early and don't want to judge the HT prematurely, I honestly can't imagine such a significant amount of growth that I'll look natural on a sunny day---but who knows--. Anyway, I wish you luck in your journey to have a natural looking head of air. Just so you know that your not the only one on this journey. Man, I wish I could have my "natural" receding hairline back.

[the B spot]

This is NOT pointed at GIR whatsoever...but I want to point out that a hair transplant is an ILLUSION for most of us.

 

There are always variant degrees of density/coverage that can be achieved...but we do not want to "look" bald.

 

For some that is an absolute full restoration of their loss...they represent a certain smaller percentage of us balding fellows. (the lucky bastard contingent =)

 

For others, it is the illusion of density, coupled with product, artful styling, and a proper hair cut to achieve this, but water and mussing out hair is the enemy.

 

Yet, for others, it is simply the appearance of hair, lower see through density, but not bald.

 

To the point at hand,

 

In this instance, GIR is being shown with optimal hair combed to achieve the illusion I spoke about vs the harsh reality of having thinning hair.

 

I believe it is hard to truly quantify this situation via photos. My personal opinion is that Dr. Feller achieved the disguise of the previous poor work, but GIR is unhappy with the density behind the hairline. It may be that growth was compromised due to the scarring in the recipient area...an all to unpleasant reminder of why repair work is exceedingly difficult.

 

At this point, I would just like to see GIR and Dr. Feller sit down and figure out how to go forward, perhaps meeting in the middle and reach a satisfactory conclusion that properly uses GIR's remaining donor to achieve his realistic expectations. We all know Dr. Feller cares for his patients and I expect nothing less than a satisfactory ending here.

 

My opinions, of course.

 

Take Care,

Jason

[lost my swagger]

hilarious to me the differences from our little community when results like this come from "top" docs as oppose to if this guy went to a percieved hack, or bad clinic.....

 

since its feller, we can all point out RIGHTFULLY SO that a transplant is an illusion for most of us... Bspot said exactly this in his post above.he is right.. Dr feller said that HE is "proud" of the result and the photos speak for themselves... he then makes note of how styling is PARAMOUNT just to create a simple ILLUSION...he is also correct...

 

hair transplants ARE FACTUALLY one thing, yet marketed to us as another, yes even on this site.... this is crap ive been saying for a long time, things that got me my lable from alot of you as a 'negative' poster.

 

there are a MILLION exuses and variables that can be used to explain EVERY failed hair transplant case.. and these reasons somtimes but not always act as a crutch to fall back on for the dr... 'errr, scarring in the recip'... 'errrr, bad phisiology'..... these excuses are only validated by you guys when its a Dr you all care about and love.....i see this SAME reaction from the posters on another forum where GIR has posted his pics.....

 

its sad because GIR want unbias feedback from real guys but mostly all he gets its how its HIS fault for showing us his situation when styled LIKE FELLERS PRE OP.... its HIS fault and he MUST have put product in his hair right??? no spex, he has now said NO PRODUCT...

 

its HIS fault that he had previous procedures right?? WELL LET ME ASK YOU ALL SOMETHING!! DID DR. FELLER STILL WORK ON HIM?? YES, SO OBVIOUSLY THE DR FELT THE SCARRING WASNT BAD ENOUGH THAT HE COULDNT TAKE GIRs MONEY... YET WHEN THINGS END UP "NOT SO STELLAR", YOU BETTER BELIEVE THAT DR FELLER WILL ABSOLUTELY BRING UP THAT GIR HAS RECIP SCARRING...its convenient..

 

what i dislike worse is how so many of you allow yourselves to be spoon fed these same excuses EVERY TIME a case like this pops up from docs were all supposed to love just so you can keep on believing whole heartedly in your "top" guys and the illusional 'miracles' they show you they can produce.... all you guys would be telling GIR how sorry you feel for his situation and trying to pick him up emotionally had he posted these results saying he went to a crappy clinic... then you would point him in the direction of H@W, Feller, or SMG so that they could "FIX" his situation................

 

ok guys, your plan B didnt work for GIR so whats next huh?????

 

I GOT IT!!!! lets blame GIRs phisiology or something, OR lets get mad at him because he exposes his ACTUAL WORKED ON AREAS, instead of combing over his hair pretty for us all, even though we always ask for thorough documentation.....

 

believe it or not this post of mine is much more of a slam on how we as posters ALLOW, this forum, our place of gathering to find TRUTH to be manipulated, and LESS about the actual dr in question...

 

i feel for GIR here, after all, while his dr will be sleeping quite well its GIR who is not as happy with his decision as he had hoped going in......

 

in time this case will sink and fade, just as they all do and be replaced with several, WELL COMBED, results illutrating the ILLUSIONAL importance that both dr feller, and Bspot are speaking about, and all of you guys can go back to feeling more comfotable about the life changing decision your wrestling with.

[RajToor]

Mohawk style will do u good illusion, I guess

[RajToor]

sorry, from the other pictures you look good, just a bit density on the top will be nice.

[the B spot]

LMS, I hope people are not getting angry with GIR---he is presenting his results that he is unhappy with. Dr. Feller is presenting the results based on the cosmetic illusion we seek to achieve.

 

We need to remember he is a repair patient as well..not as an excuse, but a fact.

 

I think your right about how if this was a different doctor, we would be reacting differently....but I think that IS the point...Dr. Feller posted this thread asking opinions and we know Dr. Feller takes care of his patients. Plus he has a history of being transparent with his work, not just showing A+ results, but more realistic work as well.

 

If it was some no-name clinic or a clinic with a poor track record, we would know that poor physician skills and a poor approach in general all led toward this result...but because we know Dr. Feller (or any other doctor that is regularly represented online) we can take his word on the matter, give an opinion positive or negative, still support GIR if he is unhappy and still believe Dr. Feller will 100% take care of the situation.

 

In that vein, we as the educated can look at the work, offer feedback and know that the situation will be amicably, and properly resolved. I believe if this was poor work, we would say it was poor work, no problems. I believe several posters chimed in on another thread where a guy got 2500 grafts and was displeased with his results to date, and justifiably so...the difference is the clinic in question will 100% take care of the patient and do the best to clear up the issue.

 

I'm not asking for a "soft-soak"--in fact, I tend to be quite hard on those clinics or others seeking to use the internet, but dislike being put on the spot..which is why I try to talk about topics that are not as sexy and more realistic in nature.

 

But I think a clinic has right to build up some credit and be taken at face value...we as patients want explanations and in this instance we're getting it.

 

Until then, we need to be supportive of GIR and supportive of Dr. Feller and lets help get GIR to the result he is looking for.

 

Take Care,

Jason

[lost my swagger]

bspot--"mad" prob was an elementary word for me to use but there is NO doubt a different reaction from alot of posters depending on the dr being discussed.. its annoying to me..

 

this "credit" you believe certain clinics should be allowed does GIR absolutely ZERO good and he is who we are discussing here.. he is the patient at hand..looking at the big picture lessens GIRs value in some ways IMO.

 

also you make note that feller was kind enough to post this for us, as if we should thank him.. i dis agree... dr feller posted this AT THE PATIENTS request.. over on HLH GIR simply did it himself...i really dont see how credit should be given to the dr for simply posting something that he VERY LIKELY KNEW was going to 'hit the net' anyways...

 

yes GIR is a repair patient, but so would i be apparently because i went to bosley and recieved a pluggy, thin hairline and front third... if a dr elects to take my money and tell me that the area can be thickened he has a responsibility IMO to hold up his end of the bargin.. you can talk about further NATIVE hairloss all you want but the TRANSPLANTED AREA to me shows little improvement if you ask me... how about all this "transplants should stand on their own talk" we always hear from your side of the pond?... so the rules change if you have had previous work apparently.. is this what your saying? dr feller is not responsible for this outcome because it was another dr who first worked on GIR??? if this is the case why do we, as a site, keep sending all these "repair" guys over to YOU at SMG or to feller.... if things dont turn out the patient has no valid complaints it seems.. all while the DR is defended and let off the hook thanks to his reputation alone??

 

bspot-- you also make note that Dr feller will "100% take care of the situation" and "do the best to clear up the issue".........

 

are you suggesting that you believe that Dr feller will compensate GIR in some way?? if so how?? discount on a future procedure? or flat cash back.. i HIGHLY doubt feller would consider the second, so really all were looking at Bspot is THIS: 'well GIR, i know things did not work out like we had hoped, so if you want to TRY ANOTHER RISKY PROCEDURE WITH ZERO GUARANTEES, ill do it a little cheaper than i usually do'.....hmmm ...thanks?.......

 

is this what you mean when you say that GIR will be taken care of?.... dr feller has shown in previous threads and now this one that he is MORE than comfortable with this OUTCOME for GIR, and he does so with stubborness that is unmatched from any other dr ive even seen post here.. so why would a doc who who time and time again comes off as someone who never fails his patients throw a bone GIRs way... and honestly if he did id still be cautious as to what bone he was throwing anyway..

[thanatopsis_awry]

Swagger, why create such a victim-mentality when GIR is no victim? He has an improved head of hair which he can now style in a natural, pleasing way. He hasn't been butchered; he has been improved. And he is being told how he can improve himself even further. These are the central facts at play. And these facts would be taken into account and recognized by me if any clinic posted this precise case in this exact way.

 

Why harp on the obvious negatives of a (most any...) HT when we should all be doing what we can to help one another out and actually *improve* our hair. GIR clearly has attained a more natural head of hair that he can style with excellent perceived density -- why belabor the fact that he has an illusion of density? So what, it is obvious to most anyone who understands hair restoration that that is what is at play.

 

I could post pics while assuming the same understanding of HTs that you yearn to see, and that GIR unfortunately has. Guess what, my hair would look equally as bad and you could gripe about how futile HTs are and how they rarely they truly restore someones hair and life.

 

That would be inane, since it isn't how my hair has to look and it isn't how my hair looks 99.999999% of the time. Why bemoan the fact that this reality *can* exist instead of celebrating that it doesn't *have* to exist. This is the gift that HTs give.

[TC17]

Ouch, the pictures do look a lot worse than I initially thought. Again, not to beat the dead horse, but THIS is why I want to go the FUE route. Worst case scenario, I buzz down to a #1 or #2 and say to hell with all of this "artful styling." I don't have the time or patience to do that now, and I have way more hair now than I'll ever have if I follow my family history and have a transplant. After all, hair does look more dense when it is cut short anyway.

 

GIR, make no mistake, there is an improvement upon where you were before your surgery, but I completely understand your disappointment. I'm nobody to give you unsolicited advice, but if I were in your shoes, I would definitely go for another pass. It's by no means the worst we have ever seen on here, and fortunately for you, you can get away with it if you style it properly.

 

(if anyone feels that I'm popping in too many times with my pro FUE statements please let me know. I don't want to be "that guy")

[lost my swagger]

THANATOPSIS--ask GIR about his "more natural" head of hair.. i read a post from him on another forum where he talks about how unnatural NOT JUST HE feels about his look but the feedback his friends/familiy gave him about his situation....

 

im harping on HIS SITUATION ONLY, as i see it... i guess i could ask you why your trying to create such a lopsided view point yourself, as you are trying pretty hard to point out that its the POSSIBLE loss of native hair, and the sloppy styled pics that are making his result look less than stellar..maybe the underlining point here IS THAT YOU YOURSELF COULD TAKE PICTURES OF YOUR OWN TRANSPLANT THAT SHOW HOW FLAWED IT IS TOO.

 

it pisses me off that people dont want to understand that this procedure under ANYONES skilled hand OBV has fundamental flaws that are to seldom talked about... then we ACTUALLY GET photographic evidence that all that can be done is illusion, and everyone makes excuses for what they are seeing, and alot of these excuses lean in the direction of the beloved DR???? these excuse clear the dr?? what?? GIR is the one who has to live with his situation, he is the one who must make the tough decisions for himself not.. NOT feller....this is NOT about being a victim bro. this is REALLY what GIR is facing... what dimension do i live in? cause i dont like it and i want out....

[John Malloy]

Lost my swagger,

I just want to thank you for being so clear in your writing. Your basically saying what I've been trying to say for numerous posts, but your so much more concise and clear than I am.

I, like you, get extremely "pissed off" when statements such as "Dr feller will '100% take care of the situation" are made by posters. Is Dr. Feller going to give him the year of his life back that GIR lost by hiding under a hat. Because if GIR's procedure went as it should have, there is no reason he should have not looked natural at 12 months post op. I guess that's just the lingo though. When the B-spot makes such posts that gives me the "illusion" that Feller is going to return 100% of the cost of the HT, and repair GIR at no cost for the trauma of the surgery with low yield.

Think about it. What risks do the docs, and I'm not pinpointing Feller- I'm referring to all docs-- really take?

" I'll "TRY" to repair you, but keep in mind that there are no guarentees:however, because you had to deal with the physical trauma of 50 staples in the back of your head for 2 weeks, and the emotinal pain of looking like a freak for 2 months. And you did all of this so you look pretty much the same as the day you walked in my office except the scar on the back of your head is a little bigger. For going through all of this for the last year and out of the kindness of my heart, we can do this all over-- same terms and conditions for a discount" What risk takers. I'm not trying to be a prick, but honestly feel that the Doc's recommened on this site should bear a little more of the risk, if they want to be perceived as ethical, and not strictly as oppertunists.

The fact that anyone would even think that GIR's procedure is even somewhat acceptable not only makes me lose faith in the whole HT industry, but it also makes it obvious why I too am considered a negative poster. Maybe my expectations are too high, or maybe alot more people agree with me, but can't take the heckling when they post their honest opinion.

[John Malloy]

Originally posted by lost my swagger:

THANATOPSIS--ask GIR about his "more natural" head of hair.. i read a post from him on another forum where he talks about how unnatural NOT JUST HE feels about his look but the feedback his friends/familiy gave him about his situation....

 

Thanatopsis,

I also thought maybe I was being hard on myself, but as LMS points out--it's not just me that thinks my HT looks unnatural as I mentioned in a different post. I do have a few friends that will say that it does not look "that bad". However, I did not pay $8,500 dollars for "not that bad" I was hoping for no comment because they did not notice--My bad.

[thanatopsis_awry]

Swagger, if GIR said that he said it -- I am not trying to debate GIR's feelings. If he feels his HT isn't "natural" it is new news to me -- and I am truly sorry he feels that way, as no man should.

 

You are saying I am making "excuses" for his HT; all I am trying to do is point out the facts of it, and tell him what he could likely do to make it better (maybe much better).

 

I'm not hiding from the flaws of HTs; I myself am telling you that *I* could make my hair looks just as bad as GIR's. Not to sound like a douche, but I also get consistent, various, and unsolicited compliments on my hair, on top of my HT giving me the ability to live my life a lot better. I can't help but think that the same could be said for GIR -- this is my point, and it is what I am trying to explore.

 

I spend maybe 3 minutes out of the shower styling my hair and I can then set it and forget it till I shower next -- not unlike most any guy who styles their hair. I don't consider this some terrible woe. But it is a fundamental point that radically alters the perceid "success" or "failure" of my HT, not unlike GIR's situation.

 

You seem like you are the only one taking a real stance; as if the notion -- read: FACT -- that HTs are by and large an illusion is some grand cloak being taken down finally. This point gets talked about frequently, and I think it should be talked about more -- because GIR is fundamentally having to deal with this unfortunate fact. But it's a fact that he *can* deal with -- he likely doesn't *have* to have some lame, unnatural-seeming head of hair.

 

All I want is for every patient to get the best HT they can get and to then have the best head of hair they can have. I'm simply not sold that GIR is forced and relegated to have some gimp head of hair and that his HT was a failure. He *has* options, and some of them are as immediate as spending a minute with some quality product and accentuating his hair like so many other men do.

 

It's just paramount if not essential for a HT patient to be understanding and experienced in how to best style their hair.

 

Again, I'm not denying that his hair looks horrible in some of the pics; but if he isn't even close to being chained to that look, and I myself and so many other "successful" HTs could do the precise same thing in making our hair look bad, what exactly is going on?

 

Is this the issue of a failed HT or is it a failure of communication to understand the +s and -s of a HT and now not being suddenly forced to confront them?

 

I think it is the latter, and *all* I am essentially trying to get across to GIR is that he likely ISNT'T forced to live in this exact state if he readily confronts and *defeats* the negatives to his benefit.

[thanatopsis_awry]

There are many realities to a single HT. IMHO, most good HTs open up the easy potential to access positive ones that you otherwise would never have.

 

The key is to be aware of this and best figure how you can most easily access the best one. And this should be communicated prior with the doctor for him to best design the HT.

 

John, I know you feel your HT will be a failure, but 7months is early and *most* HTs won't look "OMGamazing"....the hairs are likely kinky, immature, wiry, etc., in addition to density not being close to fully reached. If some people are saying your hair now looks "alright" that's not bad. I havent' seen a single pic so I won't give my opinion on how your HT *actually* looks, but all the aforesaid things hold true regardless.

 

Dr. Feller posted many pics where GIR looked *quite* good and *incredibly* improved, and they show that he *does* have options that he can continue to improve on.

 

Unless the pics Dr. Feller took are the result of smoke and mirrirors and trickery *this* is the reality that GIR should live in with his HT.

 

The question is how does GIR feel about how his hair looks in those pics and when he styles his hair like that. And, again, he could likely style his hair much better if he put in a little bit of time with a decent product.

[lost my swagger]

john malloy, you are not the only person who comes to share their not so good experience, and trust me you are not the first poster to be labeled 'negative'.....

 

it seems its common practice on here to label guys like you negative, or my personal "favorite" is when the posters really turn on you and start labeling you a "victim"... RonJ is a great example of a poster who uses the victim card when one is doing nothing more than RIGHTFULLY sharing their concern about their situation. either way i dont really care.. alot of posters are afraid to mix it up, or dis agree with guys like thanatopsis or RonJ because they are SOOOO good with words, seriously the vocab with those guys is enviable. and as alot of you know RonJ is never wrong in his mind and NEVER stops beating posters down with his articulate opinions.... ever..... ever.....

 

aint nobody throwing pitty parties here thana, all im trying to do is my best to make sure cases like this happen less and less...and if they DO happen, which as you, GIR, john Malloy, aaron1234, the emperor, and and many others know to well that they DO happen, that changes be made..that PEOPLE PAY ATTENTION. i dont care if the changes come from the indusrty itself, the DR. himself or the posters here.. WHATEVER!! as long as some change or progress is taking place so that a SHIFT is made where the people who come to sites like this seeking TRUTH and answers about this indusrty and this procedure ACTUALLY GET IT.... in all of its forms.

 

simply saying that the procedure is risky and to do research is not enough...

[Ron J]

Originally posted by lost my swagger:

RonJ is a great example of a poster who uses the victim card

Can you provide one quote where I have ever played the "victim card"? It's funny, it was I who said *you* do this, now your saying I do it? It's like some child w/the "I'm rubber your glue" phrase lol.

 

What have I *ever* said/intimated I was a victim of? Do you even know what it means to victimize oneself? I'm extremely happy w/my ht results so far and I've even shared my progress w/you Lost. If you'd like to see my latest progress PM me and I'll ship it to you.

 

You always make radical statements, then when get asked for evidence you deflect. I won't expect you to back any of this up.

[thanatopsis_awry]

LMS, I never said GIR was acting like a victim; I said he *isn't* a victim, and it is *you* and you alone who are hyping up the negative of his HT and making him out to be a victim.

 

All *I* have done is give GIR the best possible information and means with which to improve his situation and come away with a logical, well-rounded understanding of HTs and how he can best use this information for his benefit.

 

Give all of this, it's laughable that you then insinuate I am somehow doing GIR a disservice because I am jerking myself off while trying to pump up the Dr. who did my HT. This isn't the first time you've pulled this sht, but I thought you had the decency and insight to not pull it on me.

 

The people you just picked for the posterchilds of your position doesn't really work for you, either --

 

Emperor hasn't shown a *single* pic, yet you want to use him as an example? John is 7months out...and has he even shown a single pic...?

 

And it is ironic that you mention Aaron while trying to smear my intentions when I expressly cautioned Aaron about the HT he ended up getting...If he went to Shapiro to begin with he wouldn't have gotten a mediocre HT and it is as simple as that. Aaron can speak for himself, but I think he would agree with this, as well -- he didn't get a state of the art HT the first time.

[lost my swagger]

Can you provide one quote where I have ever played the "victim card"?

 

 

you dont play the victim card, you accuse others of such... sorry for the confusion ronny...

 

 

 

thana, i wrote a long reply to your last couple posts then because my comp cord was not connected it did not go through and i lost the whole thing

 

 

you are right, you accused ME of trying to paint GIR as a victim, which i think is is silly but hey....

 

you say you are just stating the facts of the case as you see it... thats fine, i actually feel im doing the same...your right for being pissed at the comment i made about feller being your doc, i got rid of it BEFORE i read your last post believe it or not... i should really proof read my posts whan im running on only emotions...but i seems in past situations we have been involved in you post with a less dr driven tone, i dont know how else to say it. i very well could be exaggerating the differences im talking about.. i know your a giant help to PATIENTS on this site, we all do

 

i understand that the concept of the ILLUSION of density is discussed on this forum, but here we have a photographic evidence and instead of posters seeing it for what it is the act as if GIRs picures are meaningless since its POSSIBLE to style his hair better... not it changes ther FACT that density in the transplanted area IS lacking......

 

 

for refrence THANA and ron, AS IM POSTING THIS the last post i read from this thread was thanas that he posted at 7:39 so i dunno what else has been said and because i work graves and type slow i cant go back and forth more tonight, but if need be ill reply to whatever tomorrow.....

 

ron-- glad your happy, if you want to provide me a link to your pics or whatever sure id love to see them and again i was not saying that YOU play a victim, but rather that you accuse others of doing such for merely expressing their displeasure over their own situation, as if you feel they are not allowed or that YOU in their shoes, would handle the situation "right", but hey were all different.... and your right. im not gonna go back and find you 3 examples of you doing this... but that does not take away from the fact that my eyes have seen it..... congrats on your HT progress... GO!!! H@W!!!!!!whos with me?

[Ron J]

Originally posted by lost my swagger:

ron-- if you want to provide me a link to your pics or whatever sure id love to see them and again

sure, check your pm