Verteporfin HAIR REGENERATION HUMAN TRIAL Dr. Barghouthi *OFFICIAL THREAD

[Rolandas]

3 hours ago, alopeciaphobia said:

Even if the donor would partially regenerate, and you would therefore technically create extra hairs, we don't know if that hair will grow back in a more and more miniaturized way after every extraction, and therefore would may not be infinitely repeatable.

 

Though there are many exciting ideas to explore, e.g., perhaps if one extracts from one half of the donor area into another half of the donor area, and vice versa in a next surgery a year later, maybe that would effectively cultivating more donor hairs? Or perhaps, in patients who are already on a 5AR inhibitor, if one fully extracts miniaturized follicles in balded areas, then inject those sites with a certain dose of verteporfin, maybe more healthy hairs grow back from scratch due to being in a low-DHT environment from day 1?

This is the type of questions I've been asking myself since seeing this study.

How else we can use it (it it works) besides typical fue.

Also I wonder whether the newly regrown hair (if it works) will be also dht resistant.

[alopeciaphobia]

3 hours ago, Rolandas said:

Also I wonder whether the newly regrown hair (if it works) will be also dht resistant.

In case it turns out an FUE extracted follicle is able to regrow, I would assume its androgen sensitivity would follow the natural androgen sensitivity of that area of the scalp. I can't imagine there being any biological reason why it wouldn't, since it seems that some scalp regions are just genetically programmed to grow follicles that are more androgen sensitive than others.

I think a more interesting question would be whether or not that hair can get a fresh start from a blank slate. In case a miniaturized hair in the frontal, midscalp or crown region can regrow after being extracted by FUE, maybe it can stay healthy despite still being androgen sensitive, if it's never damaged by excessive androgen receptor excitation after growing completely from scratch. After all, all of us have thousands of miniaturized follicles that wouldn't have been miniaturized (as much) if through 5AR inhibitor use, they never came into contact with excess androgens since their creation. If verteporfin-induced regrowth would allow us to reset the state of a follicle to that moment right after creation, maybe, just maybe, those hairs can get a second chance at enjoying a full lifetime of low DHT levels.

 

Obviously this is pure speculation on top of speculation, resting on lots of big ifs that are still unclear. But it's extremely interesting and fun to think about what future experiments could look for IF things work .

Edited August 19, 2022 by alopeciaphobia

[MrFox]

46 minutes ago, alopeciaphobia said:

In case it turns out an FUE extracted follicle is able to regrow, I would assume its androgen sensitivity would follow the natural androgen sensitivity of that area of the scalp. I can't imagine there being any biological reason why it wouldn't, since it seems that some scalp regions are just genetically programmed to grow follicles that are more androgen sensitive than others.

I think a more interesting question would be whether or not that hair can get a fresh start from a blank slate. In case a miniaturized hair in the frontal, midscalp or crown region can regrow after FUE extraction, maybe it can stay healthy despite still being androgen sensitive, if it's never damaged by excessive androgen receptor excitation after growing completely from scratch. After all, all of us have thousands of miniaturized follicles that wouldn't have been miniaturized (as much) if they never came into contact with excess androgens since their creation. If verteporfin-induced regrowth would allow us to reset the state of a follicle to that moment right after creation, maybe, just maybe, those hairs can get a second chance at enjoying a full lifetime of low DHT levels.

 

Obviously this is pure speculation on top of speculation, resting on lots of big ifs that are still unclear. But it's extremely interesting and fun to think about what future experiments could look for IF things work .

I would agree, I have seen no evidence that this would only grow hair in one region of the scalp as opposed to another. The research indicates that if it works, it's going to work on any part of the skin, and that the hair that is produced in that specific area is going to follow your genetics.  I would think that as long as someone was to remain on a 5alpha-reductase inhibitors (oral or topical) it would inhibit miniaturization of a new hair follicle that was produced via extraction and treated with Verteporfin. 

[WhereIsMyMind]

Yeah in fact the mouse/pig trials are body hair type hairs and worked with almost 100% regeneration accuracy. It should work for any hair and any new scar in the body pretty much.

Edited August 20, 2022 by WhereIsMyMind

[NAVI]

What if we wound all the bald heads and inject verteporfin? Will we get new hair there? No need for hair transplant in that case. 

[Melvin- Admin]

Just now, NAVI said:

What if we wound all the bald heads and inject verteporfin? Will we get new hair there? No need for hair transplant in that case. 

There are a lot of unanswered questions. But I don't believe Verteporfin regenerates old dead hair, it prevents the formation of scarring and thus, keeps healthy hairs from growing back. I don't believe Verteporfin will regenerate hair on the top of the scalp. That hair is lost by a different mechanism (DHT). Even if the hair would theoretically regenerate, the DHT would eventually attack it and make it bald again.

[alopeciaphobia]

6 hours ago, Melvin- Moderator said:

Even if the hair would theoretically regenerate, the DHT would eventually attack it and make it bald again.

What if the patient in question is on a 5AR inhibitor during that potential regeneration, and stays on it indefinitely afterwards?

 

I agree that this idea can be considered a long shot, but it's still definitely worth testing imo. Even if it does eventually miniaturize again, that might take many years, and in case of 5AR inhibitor usage often more than a decade.

Edited August 20, 2022 by alopeciaphobia

[LandWhale]

Of course it's still too early to be certain yet, but I'm very intrigued by the idea of combining some type of wounding to the balding scalp with Verteporfin. There have been at least one documented case of a bald man regrowing hair after a burn.

Source: https://www.hairlosscure2020.com/so-it-seems-like-totally-balding-areas-of-the-scalp-can-regenerate-long-lost-hair/

[Square1]

On 8/20/2022 at 6:08 PM, Melvin- Moderator said:

There are a lot of unanswered questions. But I don't believe Verteporfin regenerates old dead hair, it prevents the formation of scarring and thus, keeps healthy hairs from growing back. I don't believe Verteporfin will regenerate hair on the top of the scalp. That hair is lost by a different mechanism (DHT). Even if the hair would theoretically regenerate, the DHT would eventually attack it and make it bald again.

Depends on the spot I guess. If it is hair that started miniturizing after 30, that means it withstood 15 years of peak DHT. If you would be able to revive that hair after 35, with lower DHT in the bloodstream, it might take a very long time to go bald again. If it ever happens. 

Like somebody else has said, verteporfin in combination with some kind of wounding protocol sounds very interesting. Microneedling 2.0

 

[WhereIsMyMind]

You can stil extract follicles in a bald spot. They are just under the skin. It is known that what we call "dead follicles" are still under the skin but very minituarized. So yeah, in theory you could remove every follicle in a bald spot and treat with Verteporfin.

The possibilities are endless!

[alopeciaphobia]

On 8/21/2022 at 8:13 PM, Square1 said:

If it is hair that started miniturizing after 30, that means it withstood 15 years of peak DHT. If you would be able to revive that hair after 35, with lower DHT in the bloodstream, it might take a very long time to go bald again. If it ever happens.

This is a really interesting point. DHT is already high since the mid to late teenage years, but in most men it takes longer than that to see the first signs of hair loss. But I don't think there's any data that shows whether DHT just takes a very long time to damage the follicle, or whether follicles become more and more vulnerable to the destructive effects of DHT as part of aging.

Though in any case, perhaps people can achieve maintenance with something like ~0.1mg of finasteride per day if a newly formed hair is never exposed to DHT in the first place, and there is no prior damage to undo. After all, we all know prevention generally requires less medication than regrowth.

Edited August 22, 2022 by alopeciaphobia

[Yossy]

On 8/20/2022 at 5:36 PM, Mark Wolfer said:

I had my FUE surgery 5 weeks ago. Is there any expected benefit in using verteporfin now? And if so, how can I get my hands on it?

+1

[JohnnyBravo]

I don't want to speak for the doctor, however i recall him saying in the interviews posted in the forum that verteporfin had to be used immediately after extracting the graft to work properly.  That was the protocol being tested.

 

[Melvin- Admin]

 

[Fue3361]

Hey Melvin, do you think this can also be used to treat something like acne scars?  Cut the scar out, treat, then allow fresh skin to regrow without scar tissue?

[Melvin- Admin]

33 minutes ago, Fue3361 said:

Hey Melvin, do you think this can also be used to treat something like acne scars?  Cut the scar out, treat, then allow fresh skin to regrow without scar tissue?

Yes, I believe there will be many dermatological uses. 

[Rasputin]

So this could be also used to treat BHT extractions?

[Square1]

2 hours ago, Melvin- Moderator said:

 

Is it absolutely sure that this is a new follicle and not a dorment follicle or anything?

If so, this is true neogenesis and a really big deal that it works. The best protocol still has to be decided upon then, but that it works opens so many doors.

Thanks for you reporting on this!

 

 

[Square1]

35 minutes ago, Rasputin said:

So this could be also used to treat BHT extractions?

Why would you want that if you could regenerate normal hair follicles?

[Rasputin]

15 minutes ago, Square1 said:

Why would you want that if you could regenerate normal hair follicles?

To fill in the previous fue scars that can't be regenerated. If I understand correctly, Verteporfin has to be used rightaway to (possibly) regenerate hair.

Edited August 24, 2022 by Rasputin

[Square1]

2 minutes ago, Rasputin said:

To fill in the previous fue scars that can't be regenerated. If I understand correctly, Verteporfin has to be used rightaway to (possibly) regenerate hair.

If you would apply a protocol that creates a new wound on that same spot, would that regenerate the earlier transplanted hair?

[Rasputin]

6 minutes ago, Square1 said:

If you would apply a protocol that creates a new wound on that same spot, would that regenerate the earlier transplanted hair?

I think that's quite early to tell... But even if it could only regenerate new extractions, that would be a huge game changer. Maybe, as well, you could also extract the newly growing hair and do it all over...

Edited August 24, 2022 by Rasputin

[parody]

There's still the chance that the hairs that are regrowing are transected hairs. The jury's still out on whether this works. But it looks very promising.

[DrTBarghouthi]

Very promising we hope. I agree it is still early to make any conclusions. As for transections, the extracted grafts were checked for that to outrule it. Could still be a telogen hair ofcourse at time of extraction. In all cases, we keep following up and the coming weeks will hopefully give a better indication. 
I have another case lined up end of this month/ early September it is a full transplant though. I am looking at exact dosage to give in that case. 

[SimpleLife]

Not all heroes wear capes✊