Wanting to pick best FUE surgeons for limited grafts

[JavierMarc]

Hello, i read on the forums from time to time over the past few years and this site has been a tremendous value of resource.   I am hoping to get some guidence on picking the best FUE surgeon.  I know "best" is a bit subjective and there is likely no one best, but a teir of top surgeons. either way I'd hoping to get some guidence and hopfully this thread can be of good resource for someone else in the future as well.   

I've had consultations with Dr Lindsay in VA, and Dr Vogel in MD, and an online consult with Hassan & Wong. 

I was told I have limited donor since my density is not very high so I think its especially important for me to pick wisely in terms of someone who can efficiently extract and implant with high survivability, and someone who is good at creating natural look.

 

Dr Lindsay says he is hesitant to do my hair, even just 500-800 grafts.  Its possible he airs on the side of extreme caution, or he just may not be the best FUE guy.  It seems like he typically does FUT.

Dr Vogel says he is confident in doing 1200-1400 FUE as that is all thats needed right now.  He says if i need additional in the future, we'd figure out where to get grafts then. (a little unsure of what that means)

Hassan and Wong also said 1200-1400 (virtual consult)

 

Two surgeons I'm considering right now is Dr Vogel in Maryland, and Hassen & Wong in Vancouver.  I know both of them have had recognition in the past but curious if they are considered the top tier in North America?  Canada actually has travel restrictions at the moment so thats a bit of a challenege. 

I know some people on here are really passionate about the industry and keep up with who is doing what. Let me know if you have any other opinions worth sharing?  

 

 

 

[TorontoMan]

“Figure our where to get grafts then” ?? Whattt

[JavierMarc]

Yeah not sure what that means either..  I don't recall if those were the exact words but the general context of what he was saying is we can do 1200-1400 grafts now, and it should look pretty good.  If you continue to loose hair, we'll figure it out then when we cross that bridge. 

[Wicky]

I know 'the best' is subjective but I think most people on this forum would give that crown to Dr.Konior in Chicago. If money isnt an issue I would look into him. 

[Melvin- Admin]

Dr. Konior said there are bests for situations. For repairs, he’s certainly one of the best. Can you share some pics?

[JavierMarc]

Let me know if these pics work.

front https://photos.app.goo.gl/Ata642TwCA9aiAEd8

Back https://photos.app.goo.gl/ZrXPhY5mS7FH4kVW9

Sorry if top/front hair was a bit long and not showing true thin-ness of my hair.

  

 

Edited January 14, 2021 by JavierMarc

[JavierMarc]

As an update- I also had a consultation with Dr John Diep.   Diep said to pay no attention to the other doctors that say my harvest is limited. He justifies by saying he is just better than the other doctors.  He also said something about Asian hair being thick and dark being advantageous.  Diep says we can do thousands without running out of harvest throughout my lifetime. 

 

What i find so confusing is such a difference in opinions.

Dr Linday (VA) says he is hesitant to do more than 500-800 (and warned me about other drs claiming they can do more just to get business).

Dr Vogel (MD) says 1300-1500 without a problem

Hassan and Wong (BC Vancouver) says 1300-1500.

Dr Diep (CA) says 2000+ and not to worry about limited harvest.

 

I know Dr Diep is highly respected and I value his opinion, but how are their opinions so different from everybody elses? Diep's explaination is he is just better than every body else, which is why he chargest the most (he said it in a modest way).

Any thoughts/opinions?

Edited January 14, 2021 by JavierMarc

[Sean]

Javier,

i am unable to see the pics.  Please approach this with caution.  This is a high risk surgery.  Please look at all reviews.  I think Asian hair is sensitive to FUE vs other ethnicities.  BUT Depends on many factors.  How extractions are done, what size punches, the entire surgical protocol.  I remember when a doc told me his FUE was the same as his FUT yield.  There are always hopeful gaurantees.  But when something goes wrong,  you will need tons more money to fix and it will be a puzzle.  It happened to me and I am Still suffering.  Do not believe any hype or gaurantee.  Take it with grain of salt.  Ask hardcore questions to surgeons in writing and get responses in writing.  Ask for consent forms to review before paying any deposit.  
If I can see your pics, I can give you some feedback on what to look out for.

best of luck!

[Britanium]

Pics are not showing. Please see if you can fix this. Thanks 🙏

Edited January 14, 2021 by JohnAC71

[JavierMarc]

Thanks. updated pic thread.

To summarize, I know Dr Diep is respected in the community, but how is his opinion so different from other doctors I've visted?  Other have expressed some harvest limitations at varying degree (800 and 1300), but Dr John Diep says don't even worry about it and we can do 2000 without issue and not to worry about not having enough for my life span.  

Any thoughts / opinions?

[aaron1234]

Dr. Konior, no question, in my opinion.  Especially if you are planning on doing a smaller session.  He'll make every graft count.

[Sean]

Javier,

i just saw your pics.  You must approach really carefully.  I do not agree with some assessments you are given.  Your hair is definitely on the finer side/silky caliber texture.  Your donor has a degree of density variation that is noticeable even with a short fade style cut.
 

first things first,  you have like a norwood 3 formation.  Those hairs in front seem they will shed over time.  likely, some of those native hairs will be shocked when new hair is planted.   I would not have a procedure greater than 1500 grafts to see how hairs will yield considering your hair type.  A manual punch used for extraction may be a safer bet due to your donor area and smaller size punches at that, also considering your hair texture and hair fragility.  Since you lack dense density in donor, you will be more prone to dot scarring from larger punches.  If they are to extract, they may need to have extractions spread out widely in donor.  They should also make sure to screen your donor for diffuse hairloss.  
 

second, it may be safer to do 2 smaller procedures to maximize graft survival during extractions and when your extracted hairs are in a petri dish.  The longer your hair is out of body, the longer the air and etc can diminish its survival (especially if it is not really thick) .  
 

are you on any medication currently?  Have you tried any?  
 

 

[Sean]

Also, it may be wise  list your goal, full expectations, from this surgery here on this thread.  This is so the surgeons know you publicly stated what your desire is and was  prior to any surgery.  They can give guarantee and assurances now, but should own up later.  
 

example lines of what goals and expectations can be:  i want a dense front , in order to stick up my hair up for for easy styling.  I want to be able to style my hair without having a see through front that doesnt visibly match my native hair density in terms of illusion.   Id like to have lateral slit to have a more natural hairline illusion.  I do not want patchy donor and defined extraction shapes in square or rectangular patterns.  You can keep going on exactly what you desire as an expectation.   This is just a small random sample/example etc.  

[JavierMarc]

You're right.  My expectation wouldn't be same hair as I did at 18 at all. I'm in my mid 30s.  Just going by logic, I'm disbursing hair from one area onto another. Density would be low for both areas. 

I'm not so concerned about whether I can do 1500 or 2000 on this session, I'm thinking long term in the next decade in how much harvest there is potentially throughout my lifetime.

I just find it a bit odd that Dr Diep would tell me not to worry about limited harvest. I raised that concern to him and he justifies it by saying hes just simply better than the other doctors.  It may or may not be true.

I told Dr Diep I would be okay with a higher hair line for the sake of having higher density in a smaller area due to limited harvest, but Dr Diep says to not worry about that as its not a concern. 

[JavierMarc]

2 hours ago, aaron1234 said:

Dr. Konior, no question, in my opinion.  Especially if you are planning on doing a smaller session.  He'll make every graft count.

I see Dr Konior was brought up a few times. I will do some research on Konior.  But whats the quick cliff notes on why he is the guy for this?

I see many of the Doctors I've spoken to has had a period of "top doctor" accolade at some point.  I know its more of a PR business thing and after achieving after a few years may put less effort into this type of PR as they continue to get referral business.    Any thoughts or feedback?

[Sean]

38 minutes ago, JavierMarc said:

You're right.  My expectation wouldn't be same hair as I did at 18 at all. I'm in my mid 30s.  Just going by logic, I'm disbursing hair from one area onto another. Density would be low for both areas. 

I'm not so concerned about whether I can do 1500 or 2000 on this session, I'm thinking long term in the next decade in how much harvest there is potentially throughout my lifetime.

I just find it a bit odd that Dr Diep would tell me not to worry about limited harvest. I raised that concern to him and he justifies it by saying hes just simply better than the other doctors.  It may or may not be true.

I told Dr Diep I would be okay with a higher hair line for the sake of having higher density in a smaller area due to limited harvest, but Dr Diep says to not worry about that as its not a concern. 

You are in your mid 30s which is good.

 

You’d be ok with higher hairline for sake of having higher density in smaller area due to limited harvest— this is good.  
your existing hairs in that front zone are weak.  If you experience shockloss, your native existing hairs may not grow back if they are weak.  If that is the case and you lose existing native hair due to surgical trauma, long term you may need close to 3000 grafts for that entire frontal zone when time progresses.  It will also depends on the grafts they extract, whether they are 1 hair, 2 hair, 3 hair, 4 hair in size.  The higher the hairs in a graft, the better the coverage.  

 

yes, you should worry about limited harvest.  No one can say not to worry or its because they are better than others.  That is a misleading gaurantee or assurance to persuade.  What happens if things dont go as planned after that?  How is it rectified?

 

i would get multiple consults and see what other doctors tell you as well. Here are some more names-  Dr Cooley, Konior, Lupanzula, Feriduni, Mwamba, Col, Ferreira, Baubac, Keser, 

[JavierMarc]

I know in our society's political creativeness climate, its not PC to talk about race, but is this something that should be considered when picking a Doctor?  What draws me to Deip is he is Asian and my natural assumption would be other Asian clients would gravitate towards another Asian doctor (especially international clients), giving that doctor more experience with hair properties attributed with Asian people.   Plus he is in the SF Bay area where it is already heavily populated with Asians.

Someone like say, Konior, my assumption would be about 5% of his clients are Asian (based on general demographic of US).

Thoughts?

[BDK081522]

Any surgeon just claiming to be able to get more grafts simply because they are better than every other top surgeon should raise some questions. Your donor is tenuous at best so donor management is vital to a successful restoration. Use the search function of this site. All of the surgeons mentioned in this thread have many results posted here. Both by the clinics themselves and patient posted journeys. Look for patients in a similar situation as yours and how each surgeon tackled those cases. Please don't take the word of any surgeon claiming superior results. You need to put in the research to get it right. Noone here is going to do the work for you, so your result will only be as good as what you put into it. In addition, you're putting too much credence into a surgeon's ethnicity contributing to success with same ethnicity patients. A truly elite surgeon can handle every patient physiology with skill and achieve optimal results regardless of hair type. You've made a wise decision to be part of the his wonderful forum so you're already on the right track. Good luck and keep us posted!

Edited January 14, 2021 by BDK081522

[Sean]

Race should not be a factor in choosing surgeon.  Asian hair/Southeast Asian hair can be complex.  A good surgeon can handle it.  Certain surgical tools Or approaches may be different.  Someone with thick curly hair may survive high speed extractions but in others the extraction may need to be manual and slow and steady.  It is different for various ethnicities based on skin characteristics/elasticity and hair textures to hair caliber to existing or no preexisting scarring.  Any good surgeon should be able to overcome such obstacles with ease.

if 5-8 doctors give you similar advice then, youd rather go for majority opinion.  Definitely get more consults to get different views and approaches.  
 

 

[giegnosiganoe]

3 hours ago, JavierMarc said:

You're right.  My expectation wouldn't be same hair as I did at 18 at all. I'm in my mid 30s.  Just going by logic, I'm disbursing hair from one area onto another. Density would be low for both areas. 

I'm not so concerned about whether I can do 1500 or 2000 on this session, I'm thinking long term in the next decade in how much harvest there is potentially throughout my lifetime.

I just find it a bit odd that Dr Diep would tell me not to worry about limited harvest. I raised that concern to him and he justifies it by saying hes just simply better than the other doctors.  It may or may not be true.

I told Dr Diep I would be okay with a higher hair line for the sake of having higher density in a smaller area due to limited harvest, but Dr Diep says to not worry about that as its not a concern. 

Forget about Diep, he told me I have 12,000+ available grafts when my donor density is clearly below average. I mean, he didn't even take a good look at my donor, so how would he know?

[UnbaldEagle]

On 1/14/2021 at 8:27 PM, giegnosiganoe said:

Forget about Diep, he told me I have 12,000+ available grafts when my donor density is clearly below average. I mean, he didn't even take a good look at my donor, so how would he know?

Maras told me I have about 10K left after 3K taken out already. He didn't like my response. No idea why some top docs would exaggerate something so important. 

[UnbaldEagle]

On 12/15/2020 at 3:55 AM, JavierMarc said:

Dr Vogel says he is confident in doing 1200-1400 FUE as that is all thats needed right now.  He says if i need additional in the future, we'd figure out where to get grafts then.

* Doc retreats to his ivory tower study. After 3 days of intensive chaos math and advanced formulas, he figures out where to get the grafts from. *

Learn This 1 Trick to Figure it Out. Other HT Docs are Outraged by his Succe$$!!!

(Sorry bud, I just read your post and I found this bit hilarious. )

[Curious25]

On 1/14/2021 at 11:52 PM, Sean said:

Race should not be a factor in choosing surgeon.  Asian hair/Southeast Asian hair can be complex.  A good surgeon can handle it.  Certain surgical tools Or approaches may be different.  Someone with thick curly hair may survive high speed extractions but in others the extraction may need to be manual and slow and steady.  It is different for various ethnicities based on skin characteristics/elasticity and hair textures to hair caliber to existing or no preexisting scarring.  Any good surgeon should be able to overcome such obstacles with ease.

if 5-8 doctors give you similar advice then, youd rather go for majority opinion.  Definitely get more consults to get different views and approaches.  
 

 

I disagree.
 

It makes absolute sense IMO to go to a doctor who is accustomed and experienced with working with your certain type of ethnicity’s hair type, than not to. 
 

This isn’t to discredit doctors in saying they are unable to perform good surgeries on a variety of hair types - however it’s another mitigation of a risk factor in terms of the success of your procedure that you can control. 
 

It’s no different to selecting doctors who have built reputations for hairline work, or mega sessions, or who perform more FUE than FUT etc. 

[deeznuts]

On 1/14/2021 at 1:13 PM, JavierMarc said:

I know in our society's political creativeness climate, its not PC to talk about race, but is this something that should be considered when picking a Doctor?  What draws me to Deip is he is Asian and my natural assumption would be other Asian clients would gravitate towards another Asian doctor (especially international clients), giving that doctor more experience with hair properties attributed with Asian people.   Plus he is in the SF Bay area where it is already heavily populated with Asians.

Someone like say, Konior, my assumption would be about 5% of his clients are Asian (based on general demographic of US).

Thoughts?

Hasson & Wong are Asian too... Or at least the Wong in H & W is Asian. From Vancouver which is literally 90% Asian. Though from what I gather, they get their clients from everywhere. 

Idk if it's just the lighting but I can see your scalp pretty easily. I'm not all that sure your donor has the grafts Dr. Diep is claiming. If I had to guess... I'd say your density is below average there... Though I'm sure someone with more experience can say better

 

Also Dr. Diep saying he's better than H&W? Bold claim to say the least

[aaron1234]

On 1/14/2021 at 11:13 AM, JavierMarc said:

Someone like say, Konior, my assumption would be about 5% of his clients are Asian (based on general demographic of US).

Elite docs work on patients from all over the globe.  Local demographics don't mirror their cliental.