FUE Experience w/Dr. Diep MHTA Clinic

[jimcraig152]

47 minutes ago, Montreal said:

I would try coconut oil for healing the donor area it has good properties.., what do you think ?

I think the discomfort is from the scabbing not ready to peel off but dislodging against the wound. Anything that would soften them would alleviate the discomfort. Healing will just happen over time.

[Melvin- Admin]

36 minutes ago, jimcraig152 said:

It does help soothe the discomfort though.

Use aloe vera, it is 100x better. 

[jimcraig152]

Putting aside the facets of the procedure for a moment.............

I mentioned MHTA gave me a check-up call on Monday 7/27/2020. But it was mostly about the finalizing payment for the extra 87 grafts taken during the procedure. I have no problem with those extra grafts or paying for it. But I want to be sure I protect myself. Having had bad dealings within the dental industry before, I want everything I need to pay for in paper and finalized. Once paid, a final disposition provided. We agreed on a payment date, but I stated i will not be making payment until I receive an invoice. I was told I would be sent one right away. It is now 5 days since that conversation, no follow-up or invoice from MHTA. I sent an email just now. There are areas that MHTA has to improve upon.

Also, before the weekend is over, I will see if the onpatient.com invites to consult with Dr. Diep still are active. Better late than never I guess.

[kdlmaj]

I had my procedure done with Diep 4 days after you did.  And I'll confirm that your experience was more or less my experience.  

 

I'll agree customer service was lacking/nonexistent for the most part.  They handed me forms to sign about narcan, and I was told it was something I wanted to say yes to because it was for the pain (it's not).  And I didn't really get any explanation for the other things I was being asked to agree to.  But Diep does go through the paperwork with you afterwards, so you DO get the answers.  I can confirm though that you are asked to sign an arbitration clause after payment has been made in full, while you're sitting in the office waiting for the procedure.

People definitely weren't interested in saying more words to me than was absolutely necessary, but I remember a lot less of the procedure than the OP does.  Given the description, I'm thankful for that.

 

My only big gripe (and I have a thread on this) is that they sent me home with several huge streaks of blood running down my head.  They've since dried, and I'm on day 4 with no idea how I'm going to get that blood out before my flight on Monday.  It would've taken so little for them to have just bothered to wash up the damn blood- they knew I had a flight.  I vaguely recall them wiping my forehead to get the blood off, but geez guys- no one is going to let me on a plane looking like someone sliced my head open with an axe.

 

Otherwise, this is ultimately about the results at the end of the day.  To the OP- I get the anxiety and the "holy sh*t I just paid this guy $20k"- it makes it easy to nitpick and all that.  But we went in for new hair, not a spa treatment.  Try to focus on that part!

 

 

[jimcraig152]

5 hours ago, kdlmaj said:

Otherwise, this is ultimately about the results at the end of the day.  To the OP- I get the anxiety and the "holy sh*t I just paid this guy $20k"- it makes it easy to nitpick and all that.  But we went in for new hair, not a spa treatment.  Try to focus on that part!

No, I am man. I am digging the results early results. I know a big part of what I posted thus far has been about the day of the procedure. But I am past that now.

Honestly, much of what we all worry about is relative. Like that streak of blood running down the side of your head. Had it not been for your need to travel, arrangements surely of which were made well after your procedure date with Dr. Diep was confirmed, you wouldn't be worrying at all. Because, if it weren't for your travel, you should be digging the early results by now too. Like I am.

Since you are on Day 4, you can drip graphcyte shampoo on the reciepient area as of today (as per Dr. Diep's instructions). And since your flight is on Monday, much of that blood should come out with the graphcyte shampoo by then. Just lather it up good. Us a small bowl with the sponge they gave to help with the lathering (lots of pumping and squeezing action). Then apply thick slobs of lather on the site and let it sit for at least 5 mins to break up the dried blood so it does not pull anything out as it is rinsed off. Then squeeze water from the sponge to get it off.

[kdlmaj]

2 hours ago, jimcraig152 said:

No, I am man. I am digging the results early results. I know a big part of what I posted thus far has been about the day of the procedure. But I am past that now.

Honestly, much of what we all worry about is relative. Like that streak of blood running down the side of your head. Had it not been for your need to travel, arrangements surely of which were made well after your procedure date with Dr. Diep was confirmed, you wouldn't be worrying at all. Because, if it weren't for your travel, you should be digging the early results by now too. Like I am.

Since you are on Day 4, you can drip graphcyte shampoo on the reciepient area as of today (as per Dr. Diep's instructions). And since your flight is on Monday, much of that blood should come out with the graphcyte shampoo by then. Just lather it up good. Us a small bowl with the sponge they gave to help with the lathering (lots of pumping and squeezing action). Then apply thick slobs of lather on the site and let it sit for at least 5 mins to break up the dried blood so it does not pull anything out as it is rinsed off. Then squeeze water from the sponge to get it off.

Spent a lot of time doing that today.  Made some progress, but this stuff is caked on hard.  Going to get back to it tomorrow.  And yeah the travel dates just sucked.  It's work, so there wasn't much I could do about it.

[jimcraig152]

Day 8: Getting Ready for Showering

I bought one of these:

I read a peer reviewed study on the negative impacts of hard water on hair health/growth for regular people. So I can't imaging hard water is positive for folks that are going through recovery from hair transplantation. To what degree among indivduals, who knows for sure. Plus, it is like prayer; what could it hurt? I don't have like well water or anything, but just taking steps to allow increased comfort through the process. Will start showering tomorrow (Day 9). Before the procedure, I preferred the shower jets on. But will be sure they are off throughout the 12-month recovery. Gentle streams of water to rinse. More lathering between hands, less lathering between hands and scalp is the mantra.

So these pics were taken right after the wash this morning:

Back donor area:

After Day 7's wash, then sleeping that night, I woke up to find loose scabs felt on my neck and through that area. They are falling off on their own. So healing is underway. Early that morning, before the sun with its UV rays came out, I was comfortable enough to head to a nearby convenience store without a sugical head cap on to grab random nick nacks. The clerk there is the only soul on Earth that knows I had anything done. HHe said things look good and asked me about it because he is thinking about it himself.

And the sides of the donor area. You can see how close some of the donors came to the transplant site.

And the ever so important hairline:

Things are looking good. I do see some crackling, but know I shouldn't worry about that. I was thinking sometime  soon after the first 2 weeks, to shave everything even as I still see some stragglers of long hair, plus my shave job and MHTA's pre-procedure shave job aren't even. But I'll just use scissors for the few stragglers and the difference between my shave job and MHTA's will just camaflouge as the hair grows back.

Lastly, I am not in a rush with removing the scabbing since we are all in quarantine, I am working from home for the foreseeable future, yada yada yada..... Will shower as prescribed, let them heal, and fall out on their own. Won't focus any extra attention on massaging them out. Any unforeseen issues or concerns with that?

[jimcraig152]

Day 9:  Showered Head for the First Time Since Procedure

Just wanted to wait for the hard water filter to come in before I showered for the first time. Did not shampoo hair in the shower. Still did the graftcyte shampoo and sponge scrub on the donor area. Then squeezed/dripped lather on the receipient site. Let both sit for about 5 minutes, then jumped into the shower to rinse off. Ran the shower on near drip/lowest flow setting for quite a few minutes. Did not touch scalp in the shower otherwise. Felt reeeeeeeeeeal gooooooood. Just taking extra precaution so that those grafts have the best chance to survive.

Pics here are right out of the shower while head was still air drying.

Back Donor Site: Looking really good. Many of the scabs came out on their own without additional massaging in the area

Side Donor Sites: Seems bigger punches might have been used here or deeper wounds were created during the extraction. These are taking longer to heal.

Front Side:  And the all important hairline. As far as I can tell, no grafts were lost in the 1st shower

Donor site discomfort is going away as the scabs are starting to peel off. Haven't applied anything to those areas since I ran out of the ointment MHTA gave me.

Alright, what do you guys think so far?

Edited August 2, 2020 by jimcraig152

[kdlmaj]

I love your thread because it let's me know what things are going to look like a few days into my future haha.

 

One interesting thing is- the back of my head has lots of big hard bumps that my hair is definitely not covering.  Yours doesn't seem to.  Did you have them, and they just go away really quickly in a few days?  

[jimcraig152]

48 minutes ago, kdlmaj said:

I love your thread because it let's me know what things are going to look like a few days into my future haha.

Well, let's hope my results a little further down the line turn out well. I don't want to ruin it for you man :).

Quote

One interesting thing is- the back of my head has lots of big hard bumps that my hair is definitely not covering.  Yours doesn't seem to.  Did you have them, and they just go away really quickly in a few days?  

Yeah, I noticed those bumps on your donor site too. I only have scabs. Three things I could think of:

1. Difference in physiology and reaction to the procedure
2. Difference in meds taken and different reactions to them
3. Difference in physical activity

I can tell you for the first 4 days, I only took:

1. Swelling meds as prescribed
2. Infection meds as prescribed

As I was told in the follow-up call, those two meds above are mandatory. The other two are if/as needed (pain meds, sleep meds). I didn't take pain meds until Day 4, not because I was in pain, but it got a little beyond discomfort. And when it comes to pain, best to keep it at bay than to try to make it subside. So I've been taking pain meds as a precaution along with swelling and infection meds. I haven't taken the sleep meds at all. I started taking propecia immediately after the procedure. Also, I took the week off. House is empty and I have barely left it. Using DoorDash mostly when hungry. Been forcing lots of bed rest. Getting 10+ hours a day. Honestly though, its mostly likely our difference in physiology.

Scabs do start coming off by Day 7. So maybe by then you'll see a difference. Drop a line to Dr. Diep and let him know however if you get concerned.

Edited August 2, 2020 by jimcraig152

[kdlmaj]

yeah I'm actually using all of the meds exactly as prescribed.  Those bumps are really annoying- wish I had a better idea of what they were

[Melvin- Admin]

You should let the conditioner soak on the recipient area and gently remove the scabs. You shouldn’t have that many blood scabs by day 9. I think this will be next topic for a video, sometimes guys are too gentle, and they let the scabs linger for way too long.

[jimcraig152]

11 hours ago, Melvin-Moderator said:

You should let the conditioner soak on the recipient area and gently remove the scabs. You shouldn’t have that many blood scabs by day 9. I think this will be next topic for a video, sometimes guys are too gentle, and they let the scabs linger for way too long.

Alright. Will do. I also will gain the ancilary benefit of being more confortable with stepping out.

Day 9 & 10:  Update

Not much has changed aesthetically but the donor area has been at the highest level of discomfort and almost crosses the line into being outright pain. Might swoop up pain meds through prescription written by Dr. Diep if this persists.

[jimcraig152]

Taking @Melvin-Moderator's advice, I showered as normal, lathered up the last of the graftcyte shampoo onto entire scalp. Shut down shower without rinsing off shampoo. Wrapped head in shower cap and set timer for 20 minutes. Got back into shower after 20 minutes and just massaged donor and recepient sites gently under cold water for 5 minutes.

Here is the front before the shower.

And here is the front right out of the shower. Probably another day or two before the scabs are completely gone.

And here it is after it air dried. Lots of crackling. No grafts in those crackled areas. Hopefully those folicles in the crackled areas took root. We shall see.

Back donor site before the shower:

And back donor site immediately after the shower. The bigger more noticeable scabs were towards the top. Now they are mostly gone. Running my hand over the back donor site feels  really smooth.

Side donor sites before the shower:

And sides just after the shower. So as you can see. Donor sites are just about scab-free. Donor sites are looking pretty close to normal.

 

 

[Melvin- Admin]

Looks good 🙌🏼

[jimcraig152]

Day 11:  Scabbing Pretty Much Gone/Lots of Donor Area Discomfort

Showered, lathered up regular shampoo, applied to scalp, did not rinse off shampoo. Put on shower cap. Set timer for 20 minutes on my phone. Hopped back in shower. Massaged receipient and donor area for ~5 minutes never staying in one spot for too long. Put head under shower and rinsed off shampoo. Massaging more under the shower. Upon existing shower, plenty scabs left in receipient site (I don't have a picture of this). Upon touching receipient site, scabs were clearly loose, but not dislodging from folicle.

I found it best at this point to remove the scabs while the hair was still wet and the scabs soften to feather them out with wet finger using the sink and being in front of the mirror. In doing so, the scabs balled up and were either picked up by the finger or were pushed to the forehead so that I could wipe them off. Took about 7 minutes, but just about all of it came out. Now I have the clearest view of the work done yet.

As you can see, most of the scabbing is gone. From this angle, things look generally good.

Here is a closer look at the all important hairline. Again, from this angle, things look generally good. I do still feel the hairline is too much of a line. All I can do is wait for the signature Dr. Diep stairstep hairline to fill out.

So here are side views of the receipeint area. See how within the rows, the grafts are densely packed in relation to each other within the same row? That close packing within the same row is unnatural. The row spacing is wide in relation to each subsequent row? Unnatural as well.

The good news is I can see some growth out of the grafts and natural hair during this now 2nd week. So that is good. Here is a shot from day 5 after I shaved off what was left of my hair just to prove that statement is true (or am I seeing things?).

Also, discomfort in my donor site is killing me right now. And I do feel my donor area pictures aren't showing what I see in the mirror. Will work on better pictures of the donor site in the next update.

 

Edited August 5, 2020 by jimcraig152
To be more objective and specific.

[jimcraig152]

Day 14: End of Critical 2-Week Post Op-Period

From time to time, my donor area feels like I have a worm burrowing its way just beneath my scalp. It sucks. And when that is not happening, it is feels like there is a heater on high radiating inches from the back of my head. Can't wait for that to go away. The 2nd week was wayyyyyyy worse than the 1st week in terms of donor area discomfort for some reason. I even went out and got some aloe vera-based lotion and it didn't help at all. The only thing that provided relief was a shower. Which left me feeling discomfort free for a few hours, then the discomfort set back in again. I definitely lost some sleep this week over the discomfort.

Speaking of which, here is what my donor area looks like. I do feel like these pictures paint a better picture than what I am seeing in the mirror. Seems to me the wounds are more red when looking in the mirror than these pictures show:

My reciepient area looks much better than my donor area. Much of the red inflammation on the skin has went away. Scabbing isn't even a thing anymore. I do see growth out of the grafts which is unexpected, but pleasant. But know to expect the grafts to fall out soon. Then the ugly duckling stage. During my first shower, I saw some splinters of hair being washed away. No idea if they were grafts or if they were shavings that were stuck to the scalp from the dried blood. And while massaging my receipient site during the showers, I would immediately look at my fingertips to see if there was any loose hair. There were none. Those grafts seem to be in there pretty good.

Here is a comparison from Day 4 and Day 14. There is growth out of the grafts, right? Or am I seeing things?

Here are a few more angles of the receipient area:

Another thing I didn't mention is that on the first night after the procedure, I must have fell off the elevated pillows. I woke to find myself sleeping on my side. Thankfully, my cheek rested in the cradle of my arm and none of the grafts rubbed against anything and were pulled out. Probably spent most of the night in that position; got lucky.

Alright. Will take daily pictures still, but probably going to weekly updates at this point. Let me know what you guys think or if you have any questions.

 

[NicoAustralia]

On 8/4/2020 at 12:51 AM, Melvin-Moderator said:

You should let the conditioner soak on the recipient area and gently remove the scabs. You shouldn’t have that many blood scabs by day 9. I think this will be next topic for a video, sometimes guys are too gentle, and they let the scabs linger for way too long.

Yep! I was almost completely scab free by day 9 and there was such a relief getting them off. It's like your head can "breathe"

[jimcraig152]

I just wanted to mention one other thing regarding the sales pitch between FUT vs. FUE with my consultation with Dr. Diep before I head into weekly updates.

Dr. Diep did NOT push me into going with the more profitable FUE procedure. Dr Diep actually nudged me towards going with FUT. I had shoulder length hair going into the consultation and into the procedure. He told me because I wear my hair long, I would be able to conceal the scar right away. But I just knew that my fine straight black hair grows perpendicular from my scalp (as you can see from post-op pics) and ultimately would have liked to have worn my hair short like times when I didn't have long hair. I would never be able to hide the FUT scar given how my hair grows. The decision for FUE was all mine. And I can tell you I was well aware that FUT is the industry gold standard for maximizing donor yield. Here is a pic of such a time when I did have short hair:

Believe it or not, I am actually a NW3 in this photo. But I was really good with a brush, hair dryer, and maximum hold hair spray and hid it well. Never have used concealer in my life either.

Even during the day of the procedure when I filled out the last minute papers. He said there are going to times when it is not possible to extract enough donors via FUE, would I consent to FUT? I said no. No matter the immediate aftermath of my donor site, I don't think the outcome was a result of profit.

[jimcraig152]

End of Week 3 Update

Two major things this week:

1. Donor site discomfort has subsided signficantly. Largely just a feeling of tightness. Itching in areas just below the donor site. The occassional jolt of pain. In other words, very manageable.
2. Recipient area has shedded a bit, particulary within the past two days. I've stuck my head under the shower to get the whole scalp wet. Then applied shampoo over the sink to just the receipient area. Then looked at my hands to see if there were hairs. There were. And from the pics, I can see some thinning spots. Then jumped fully into the shower. Rinsed off the shampoo from the receipient site. Then applied shampoo to the rest of the scalp. No hairs coming from the other areas of the scalp. This is good news and the Finasteride is kicking in. And the equipment still works too. Holla!

Also, I have resumed Rogaine at the start of week 3. Applying mostly to the vertex and to the crown. Started Finasteride the day after the procedure after being told to halt it a week leading up to the procedure. Ok, now for pics:

And another angle of the hairline:

From the below perpendicular angle of the corners of the hairline, the corn rowing is really prevalent. It is more pronounced IRL. I am not aways able to capture these at the best angle. All I can do is wait and see how this turns out.

I feel the pictures don't do show what I am seeing in the mirror regarding the donor sites. The asymmetical harvesting is more pronounced in the mirror than it is in the pictures. As typical with MHTA patients, the right side is always worse than the left side. Also, you can notice at this point of my hair growth, post head shave, the angle that my hair grows from my scalp is almost perpendicular. My hair would not drape down and cover a FUT scar unless it is realatively long. Given that, FUT was never an option for me. It was always FUE for me.

That's it for now. Comments, questions?

Edited August 14, 2020 by jimcraig152

[aaron1234]

Looks like you're right on track with everything.  The only thing you can do about the rows is wait and see.  It might or might not be noticeable once it's all grown out.  If it is noticeable then at least it's an easy fix with another doc who is more meticulous (e.g. Konior, Shapiro, H&W, etc.).  

[jimcraig152]

52 minutes ago, aaron1234 said:

Looks like you're right on track with everything.

I feel the same. Just being thorough and objective in detailing the process so the next person can make informed decisions.

54 minutes ago, aaron1234 said:

The only thing you can do about the rows is wait and see.  It might or might not be noticeable once it's all grown out.  If it is noticeable then at least it's an easy fix with another doc who is more meticulous (e.g. Konior, Shapiro, H&W, etc.).  

So weird that "revise", "fix", "hope", "wait", "see if" are adjectives and adverbs that have to be used to describe a highly regarded surgeon's work. Indeed, wait, hope, and see if is all I can do before I accept, take action to revise or fix. For the next person, educate & explore other options are better alternatives.

[NicoAustralia]

Keep the updates coming mate. Enjoying this thread!

[jimcraig152]

@NicoAustralia, will do mate!

[jimcraig152]

My phone's charging port doesn't work any longer so I can't connect it to my computer as of now to retrieve photos. Will post them and edit this post when I solve this problem.

End of Week 4 Update

I continue to shed transplanted grafts at a rather slow rate (?). I honestly thought they would all fall out all at once at around the 2 week mark but that is not the case. What grafts are still in there continue to grow. The good news is I can see what appear to be hair sprouting out of some of the grafts. Though, it is hard to tell even in the pictures. I am also more aware through sensation of my receipient site than I have been in previous weeks. At times there is an intense itch. At other times it feels like dried eggs on my head. Perhaps that is the sensation from hairs sprouting through the skin. If so, I hope so. I experienced some intense itching in one spot at the back edge of my donor area for several days. That intense itch has now went away. Donor discomfort hasn't increased or lessened in any way since the previous week. I've also noticed just to the right of my vertex what appears to be thinning. I see from the pics just after my procedure that Dr. Diep went really high with extractions on that side. Now that the scabbing is healing, it makes things like some thinning in this area. I'll have to pay attention to it.

I've also adjusted to how my face looks now with my new hairline. I can't even remember what my old hairline and self looked like anymore. Before this procedure, my hair was long and it was long for years. I am sporting a buzz cut for the first time in life which is quite an adjustment. Not needing to come out immediately after a shower and spending 20-30 minutes with a hair dryer, maximum hold hair spray, and using comb over/receding hairline concealing techniques I've perfected over the years is quite a blessing. Also, since my hair was long, everytime I showered and brushed it while wet, I would have to detassle my brush like you would if preparing corn for eating. I haven't had to do that in a while (thank you finasteride!). On the other hand, no one I know has seen me since the procedure except the folks at the stores I frequent for food and supplies. My neighbors might have drove by and noticed I shaved my head, but haven't gotten close enough to say or ask anything. My only regret out of the dramatic change in hairstyle was that there was an opportunity to put my long hair into little pigtails, shave it all off, and donate it it. It was that long. But today, I will go visit a friend to pick something up. I am wondering how he will react. Honestly, I've always been good at hiding my receding hairline. When I was younger, I was known for having nice hair despite being at least a NW2, possibly a 3. Maybe he won't notice anything. We'll see.

Aside from that, still on finasteride once daily. Still on minoxidil twice daily where I am applying to the crown and vertex. Also, I will be posting pics taken from another area of the house where the bathroom does not receive any natural light. Been noticing some inconsistencies with my photos depending upon what time of day I've taken the pictures. So going forward, will be posting pics taken from a second bathroom where there is no natural lighting.

EDIT:

So there are the pics. First the good ol' hairline comparison pics. At about a month in, you can see that I have close to 1/2" natural hair growth. My hair normally grows faster than a typcial person's. That's fhine straight black Asian hair for you. You can also see the progression of shedding, particularly above where the letters D and A are. But if I am not mistaken, I do see what appears to be sprouts of new hair? Too early to tell.

As far as the angle of insertion goes, you can see that my natural hair grows pretty much perpendicular from my scalp. This works for me and my ethnicity. But if you aren't Asian, I can see how this can be a problem.

Couple of shots of the left corners. You can see the corn-rowing in this shot. Although, any MHTA patient will tell you that the left side is always better than the right side..........

So here is the right side. The corn-rowing is more pronounced. As is the shedding at this point in time.

The donor area speaks for itself at this point in time.

New overhead shot; the classic NW scale shot.

 

Edited August 22, 2020 by jimcraig152