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Advice on Turkey HT Surgeons needed

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5 hours ago, Melvin-Moderator said:

Now munich was not the individual, the person I’m talking about is @ATM110. You seem to completely dismiss the happy patients like @Craig2412, so it’s clear you only take in to account unhappy patients, and those who have good results are “lucky” that’s ludicrous. 
 

@DEB1982 lucky, so is @nb98 @MrBolo @LordBaldwin @CosmoKramer @Gofi 

I’ve never seen anyone mention these happy patients, not even once, and when they come on threads, you say “luck” that’s just not true. 

@Melvin-Moderator you were the one that said that a good doctor is measured by the way he handles a bad result and it seems obvious that ASMED was negligent towards several patients with bad results.

Why do you only want us to focus on the patient that weren’t threatened with layers or handled negligently? Are you saying we just always focus on happy patients when researching clinics? I ask this because it’s a 180 degrees change on your own advice...

@dust78 has now stated that ASMED is doing surgery on 8 patients per day so how can you assure that all of the 8 patients operated every day at ASMED will have a good chance of getting good results?
You don’t know these 8 tech teams because you said earlier today that the member who stated ASMED was doing 8 patients per day was lying!

I’m really concerned that pretty soon you will also be recommending Cinik all inclusive packages for tech run surgeries...

These hairmills get a lot of revenue from having 8 or more patients per day and if they can now buy HRN it’s really a concern for me because this is supposed to be the most honest and unbiased forum!

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Posted (edited)
On 5/1/2020 at 9:41 PM, HTHope said:

Personally...the only clinic I’d consider In Turkey would be hlc. Only doctors do the work, stick and place technique, modern tools and facilities, manual fue, emphasis on donor management, they hold training workshops themselves, smp and bht performed there as well. They have their own condo for patients to stay at nearby. But their costs are likely more than anyone on your list at 2.7 euros per graft.

This. The other doctors the OP mentioned are absolute pants and/or hair transplant factories. 

Edited by jonnyalex

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Portugal25 said:

@Melvin-Moderator you were the one that said that a good doctor is measured by the way he handles a bad result and it seems obvious that ASMED was negligent towards several patients with bad results.

Why do you only want us to focus on the patient that weren’t threatened with layers or handled negligently? Are you saying we just always focus on happy patients when researching clinics? I ask this because it’s a 180 degrees change on your own advice...

@dust78 has now stated that ASMED is doing surgery on 8 patients per day so how can you assure that all of the 8 patients operated every day at ASMED will have a good chance of getting good results?
You don’t know these 8 tech teams because you said earlier today that the member who stated ASMED was doing 8 patients per day was lying!

I’m really concerned that pretty soon you will also be recommending Cinik all inclusive packages for tech run surgeries...

These hairmills get a lot of revenue from having 8 or more patients per day and if they can now buy HRN it’s really a concern for me because this is supposed to be the most honest and unbiased forum!

I wouldn't stress too much and just accept it. ASMED are bulletproof here and always will be. They could scalp a guy and they would be defended here. 

They were on the verge of recommending Dr Cinik, true, which is absolutely disgusting to be honest. A couple of good results posted on here should not be enough to propose a doctor recommendation. I absolutely guarantee you that he is known as a joke among his peers in the industry. The fact that it took a recommendation thread for the owners to even realise that his clinic perform surgery without the doctors involvement is just....Well all I can say is that shows the research that goes into a recommendation. 

You have to understand that here should be solely used to view photos of hair transplants, nothing more. The more doctors that are recommended here, the more money the owners earn. This system can never be truly unbiased. It means the very best doctors are not recommended unless they 'cough' up.

This website is a 'for profit' operation. 

A big plus however is that this site allows patients to post results from doctors who aren't recommended. It also promotes free speech which is good.

Edited by jonnyalex
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14 minutes ago, jonnyalex said:

This website is a 'for profit' operation. 

if you talk like that, it means that you don't know other forums, especially the european ones, those not only don't give you the opportunity to speak as you are talking now because they ban you, but in agreement with the clinics, delete patient reports  not happy.

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Posted (edited)
19 minutes ago, Egy said:

if you talk like that, it means that you don't know other forums, especially the european ones, those not only don't give you the opportunity to speak as you are talking now because they ban you, but in agreement with the clinics, delete patient reports  not happy.

But I do know them and I know they are the same if not worse. I'm simply stating that once money changes hands, its impossible to remain unbiased. My post wasn't a comparison to other forums.

Edited by jonnyalex

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11 hours ago, dust78 said:

They were the first who involved a lawyer when i told them that they ruin my donor

I confirm, I personally read the letter of formal notice that the lawyer of the Asmed clinic sent to the member @dust78 to intimidate him.

8 hours ago, Melvin-Moderator said:

Now munich was not the individual, the person I’m talking about is @ATM110. You seem to completely dismiss the happy patients like @Craig2412, so it’s clear you only take in to account unhappy patients, and those who have good results are “lucky” that’s ludicrous. 
 

@DEB1982 lucky, so is @nb98 @MrBolo @LordBaldwin @CosmoKramer @Gofi 

I’ve never seen anyone mention these happy patients, not even once, and when they come on threads, you say “luck” that’s just not true. 

@Melvin-Moderator, let's not talk about the positive results, which certainly are there, but how the clinic handles those that went wrong, denies the evidence and is not what an Asmed-level clinic should do, indeed, as it claims to be.

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12 hours ago, dust78 said:

 

I insist on what I wrote. After my article on this forum Melvin contacted me about my name and date of HT and he wrote to the Asmed about my case. After that Asmed contacted me that Dr. Erdogan will analyze my photos once again and let me know. It was on 12th of March 2020. Since this date nobody from Asmed contacted me as usually... This has been going on for 2 years. This is ethical and professional? If Asmed claims that they deal with all bad cases and solve them, then this is not true...

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, jonnyalex said:

I wouldn't stress too much and just accept it. ASMED are bulletproof here and always will be. They could scalp a guy and they would be defended here. 

This website is a 'for profit' operation. 

A big plus however is that this site allows patients to post results from doctors who aren't recommended. It also promotes free speech which is good.

@jonnyalex you are incorrect about “Free Spech” allowed at HRN because I have been warned by @Melvin-Moderator that I can’t talk about the Turkish doctor I chose for my second surgery because this doctor asked HRN to remove the thread with the one and only bad result he has online (which it obviously wasn’t removed and it’s still here for people to see he behaved ethically towards the patient), for giving discounts to use patients photos and for asking them to post their results on the forums if they have the time.
These reasons were enough for my doctor to be banned from HRN and for his patients to be deprived of free speach at HRN.
New patients can’t even post their results if they want to.

It pains me to witness such discrimination at HRN! 

ASMED can threaten patients with lawyers and refuse to take any responsibility for botched hair transplants but instead of also being banned due to much serious negligent and unethical behavior they are actually being defended and promoted at HRN.

Edited by Portugal25

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Alex 

HLC, Demirsoy, Pekkiner are all very good.

Dr cinic is also good even thought he does 10 patients a day he gets very good results. I actually have not seen a bad result from him so I don’t known why people are out to criticise him on this. If you are going with him do the most expensive package I think It’s like 3000 and you get the DHI method done.

Asmed is like playing Russian roulette you either get the best hair transplant ever or you get butchered. So prob best to say away if you don’t want to take a gamble with your head.

 

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5 hours ago, Egy said:

I confirm, I personally read the letter of formal notice that the lawyer of the Asmed clinic sent to the member @dust78 to intimidate him.

@Melvin-Moderator, let's not talk about the positive results, which certainly are there, but how the clinic handles those that went wrong, denies the evidence and is not what an Asmed-level clinic should do, indeed, as it claims to be.

As far as I’m aware, every single patient is offered a touch-up. From what I was told they offered dust78 smp for the donor if it doesn’t improve. To me that’s standing by the patient. Not standing by the patient would be ignoring them, and refusing to help in anyway. 

Sure there are people like @jonnyalex who constantly denigrate this forum, because he doesn’t like this doctor. Never once have I censored him or told him not to voice his opinion. If he wants to believe were all about money, not sure why he returns, guess we must be of some value for him to come back. 

Anyways, I’m tired of this being the asmed show. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and I’m sharing my own opinion, with proof that recent results have been good and some even outstanding. I don’t think its fair to only validate unhappy patients, and ignore happy patients. We should take everything into account, the good, bad, and ugly. That’s all I’m saying. 


I do not provide medical advice, recommendations, all responses are my opinion.

My Hair Transplant Journey

Melvin- Associate Publisher and Forum Moderator for the Hair Transplant Network, the Coalition Hair Loss Learning Center, and the Hair Loss Q&A Blog.

Follow our Social Media Instagram @thehairtransplantnetwork FacebookPintrest, Linkedin and YouTube.

 

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My advice - avoid Turkey. Save up longer if you need to. Stay in the First World too - you are in Europe and have access to some of the best clinics in the world. Turkey is the Wild West as there is no legal framework to protect you - @Portugal25 has made the point well and I don't see the point in repeating it. Look at all the botched jobs that are mentioned on here - the overwhelming majority are all from people cutting corners going to Turkey and India etc. to save a few quid. The UK clinics are shite and overpriced too. 

Save up longer and go to a decent clinic with a solid reputation. If this goes wrong, your 5 grand is going to then have to be another 10 grand when you go to one of the clinics that you are avoiding because of cost this time round. So you will end up paying over the odds anyway and have a depleted donor. Have you thought about FUT? It is cheaper.

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Posted (edited)
41 minutes ago, Melvin-Moderator said:

As far as I’m aware, every single patient is offered a touch-up. From what I was told they offered dust78 smp for the donor if it doesn’t improve. To me that’s standing by the patient. Not standing by the patient would be ignoring them, and refusing to help in anyway. 

@Melvin-Moderator
@miko has repeatedly informed you that ASMED has been ignoring him for over a year, is Miko lying?

@dust78 said he was told to speak with ASMED layers, is he lying and was in fact approached by the clinic to resolve his botched HT like you said above?

The ASMED show will surely continue because we all watched @Melvin-Moderator videos warning us members to avoid Turkish hairmills so obviously we will call Melvin out when he recommends and defends those same unethical hairmills he warned us about!

@Coady Demirsoy is not in the same league as HLC and Pekiner because these two operate using stick&place. This technique is more demanding because it requires the doctor to make one slit/hole at a time and immediately implant the graft. This limits the maximum number of grafts per day of surgery to 1500. 

Demirsoy can do up to 4000 grafts in one day of surgery because he does 4000 pre-made slits and then has the techs do the implanting.

These are two totally different techniques  and obviously stick&place is a much more skilled approach that demands more from to the surgeon.
if you look here at HRN you will find that many of the best HT results are from Doctors using this technique (ex: Dr. Konior), it also offers a quicker recovery time.

Cinik is a hairmill where your results depend on tech team you get when you arrive at the clinic (Russian Roulette).

Edited by Portugal25

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Posted (edited)
59 minutes ago, Melvin-Moderator said:

As far as I’m aware, every single patient is offered a touch-up. From what I was told they offered dust78 smp for the donor if it doesn’t improve. To me that’s standing by the patient. Not standing by the patient would be ignoring them, and refusing to help in anyway. 

Sure there are people like @jonnyalex who constantly denigrate this forum, because he doesn’t like this doctor. Never once have I censored him or told him not to voice his opinion. If he wants to believe were all about money, not sure why he returns, guess we must be of some value for him to come back. 

Anyways, I’m tired of this being the asmed show. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and I’m sharing my own opinion, with proof that recent results have been good and some even outstanding. I don’t think its fair to only validate unhappy patients, and ignore happy patients. We should take everything into account, the good, bad, and ugly. That’s all I’m saying. 

Not really Melvin - there are a few posts from people like @miko but you always conveniently ignore them. I have also never seen you address the point about the law suits. Going with ASMED is Russian Roulette and I would extend that to Turkey overall but as they pay the site 1k a month for recommendation, they will be protected. 

Edited by TrixGlendevon

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Posted (edited)
42 minutes ago, Melvin-Moderator said:

As far as I’m aware, every single patient is offered a touch-up. From what I was told they offered dust78 smp for the donor if it doesn’t improve. To me that’s standing by the patient. Not standing by the patient would be ignoring them, and refusing to help in anyway. 

Sure there are people like @jonnyalex who constantly denigrate this forum, because he doesn’t like this doctor. Never once have I censored him or told him not to voice his opinion. If he wants to believe were all about money, not sure why he returns, guess we must be of some value for him to come back. 

Anyways, I’m tired of this being the asmed show. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and I’m sharing my own opinion, with proof that recent results have been good and some even outstanding. I don’t think its fair to only validate unhappy patients, and ignore happy patients. We should take everything into account, the good, bad, and ugly. That’s all I’m saying. 

Honestly that's a pretty childish thing to say Melvin. I don't have anything against the Doctor. He is actually one of the best in the world. It's the way in which he operates that ensures patients don't receive his expertise. Instead it is about maximising profits above all. I went to ASMED because of this forum years ago. I am dealing now with incorrect hair direction various other issues caused by techs barely out of their teens operating on me and Koray Erdoğan having barely any involvement. It was a year after my surgery I begin seeing complaints not just here but all over the Internet. 

According to you however, I simply don't like the doctor which is why I speak negatively towards him.

It is not just ASMED but all of Turkey's hair transplant industry which has pretty much contaminated the industry worldwide. The fact that your even mentioned banning me in the same sentence is very telling however. Go ahead if that's how you want to be.

I literally mention in what you are responding to, why I use this forum. 

Also, offering SMP which can sometimes last barely a year does not recompense a destroyed donor area. I don't know how you could think that.

 

 

Edited by jonnyalex

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20 minutes ago, TrixGlendevon said:

Not really Melvin - there are a few posts from people like @miko but you always conveniently ignore them. I have also never seen you address the point about the law suits. Going with ASMED is Russian Roulette and I would extend that to Turkey overall but as they pay the site 10k a month for recommendation, they will be protected. 

10,000 per month? Is this true?

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Posted (edited)
11 minutes ago, jonnyalex said:

10,000 per month? Is this true?

Oops no! That is a typo. Correcting now. It is about 1000 net. It is 1600 minus a discount for putting the forum logo on the clinic's website minus a discount for posting results regularly.

Corrected!

Edited by TrixGlendevon

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20 minutes ago, jonnyalex said:

Honestly that's a pretty childish thing to say Melvin. I don't have anything against the Doctor. He is actually one of the best in the world. It's the way in which he operates that ensures patients don't receive his expertise. Instead it is about maximising profits above all. I went to ASMED because of this forum years ago. I am dealing now with incorrect hair direction various other issues caused by techs barely out of their teens operating on me and Koray Erdoğan having barely any involvement. It was a year after my surgery I begin seeing complaints not just here but all over the Internet. 

According to you however, I simply don't like the doctor which is why I speak negatively towards him.

It is not just ASMED but all of Turkey's hair transplant industry which has pretty much contaminated the industry worldwide. The fact that your even mentioned banning me in the same sentence is very telling however. Go ahead if that's how you want to be.

I literally mention in what you are responding to, why I use this forum. 

Also, offering SMP which can sometimes last barely a year does not recompense a destroyed donor area. I don't know how you could think that.

 

 

Whilst I agree with your general point, I don't think he ever mentioned banning you - either explicitly or implicitly.

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6 minutes ago, TrixGlendevon said:

Whilst I agree with your general point, I don't think he ever mentioned banning you - either explicitly or implicitly.

Maybe, but that fact that it's even being mentioned around the subject just seems odd quite frankly. 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Melvin-Moderator said:

As far as I’m aware, every single patient is offered a touch-up. From what I was told they offered dust78 smp for the donor if it doesn’t improve. To me that’s standing by the patient. Not standing by the patient would be ignoring them, and refusing to help in anyway. 

Sure there are people like @jonnyalex who constantly denigrate this forum, because he doesn’t like this doctor. Never once have I censored him or told him not to voice his opinion. If he wants to believe were all about money, not sure why he returns, guess we must be of some value for him to come back. 

Anyways, I’m tired of this being the asmed show. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and I’m sharing my own opinion, with proof that recent results have been good and some even outstanding. I don’t think its fair to only validate unhappy patients, and ignore happy patients. We should take everything into account, the good, bad, and ugly. That’s all I’m saying. 

Sorry Melvin, but how can you think that offering a smp is standing by the patient? I spent 17500 euros between two surgery, and with the second one they made a stupid and childish mistake, because the doctor think he is god and can extract as many grafts as he wants, they  f** up my donor, and the solution is a smp??? Do you know how much money dr. Koray he is doing, do you know how rich this man is?and he can’t refund a person who had a problem not because he had a bad regrowth,but because the doctor went completely crazy and didn’t understand anything about what he was doing. Is simply a miserable attitude , a man without a minimum of heart and empathy. Apart the fact that in general every clinic should refund a patient that didn’t  have a decent regrowth, for the simply reason that if a clinic has in general good results refunding a bad result wouldn’t be an economical problem and it would be ethically correct as the patient didn’t have what he paid for. In my case it should be a rule, you doctor mess up with my donor is your fault, next time pay more attention in your work and do it the right way. Smp?? Crazy and absurd really!

Edited by dust78
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38 minutes ago, dust78 said:

Sorry Melvin, but how can you think that offering a smp is standing by the patient? I spent 17500 euros between two surgery, and with the second one they made a stupid and childish mistake, because the doctor think he is god and can extract as many grafts as he wants, they  f** up my donor, and the solution is a smp??? Do you know how much money dr. Koray he is doing, do you know how rich this man is?and he can’t refund a person who had a problem not because he had a bad regrowth,but because the doctor went completely crazy and didn’t understand anything about what he was doing. Is simply a miserable attitude , a man without a minimum of heart and empathy. Apart the fact that in general every clinic should refund a patient that didn’t  have a decent regrowth, for the simply reason that if a clinic has in general good results refunding a bad result wouldn’t be an economical problem and it would be ethically correct as the patient didn’t have what he paid for. In my case it should be a rule, you doctor mess up with my donor is your fault, next time pay more attention in your work and do it the right way. Smp?? Crazy and absurd really!

Rich enough to have ASMED plastered around the entire last El Clasico game. That's serious money for sure.

Screenshot_20200509-182743_Chrome.jpg

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1 hour ago, jonnyalex said:

Rich enough to have ASMED plastered around the entire last El Clasico game. That's serious money for sure.

 

I saw a Cinik advertisement at Goodison Park (Everton) just like this, earlier in the season.

 


4,312 FUT grafts (7,676 hairs) with Ray Konior, MD - August 2013

1,145 FUE grafts (3,152 hairs) with Ray Konior, MD - August 2018

763 FUE grafts (2,094 hairs) with Ray Konior, MD - January 2020

My results thread from 1st procedure.

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1 hour ago, 1978matt said:

I saw a Cinik advertisement at Goodison Park (Everton) just like this, earlier in the season

not discussing the advertisement, which is legitimate, but the fact that Asmed has so much money to afford an advertisement in a football stadium and then retires to compensate a patient who has created damage for his negligence.

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@Melvin-Moderator

whats the formal process for getting a doctor/clinic removed from the recommended list? Is there some type of community voting? I heard in the past this happened with a Turkish doctor here and I’m curious regarding the process. Thanks

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4 hours ago, jonnyalex said:

Maybe, but that fact that it's even being mentioned around the subject just seems odd quite frankly. 

But I don't think it was mentioned. That's my point!

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3 hours ago, jonnyalex said:

Rich enough to have ASMED plastered around the entire last El Clasico game. That's serious money for sure.

Screenshot_20200509-182743_Chrome.jpg

Completely agree

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