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Body Hair Usage, Some Things You Should Know!

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Posted (edited)

Interesting video! Probably the most comprehensive I've seen on the topic. I have some questions on the long-term outlook of this type of transplant:

1. Doesn't the hair color progression between head/beard/chest hair differ? For example, your head hair is turning gray, but your chest/beard hair isn't. Seems like a risk that may have your transplanted area looking a bit odd.

2. I've heard that body hair (say chest hair) thins out as you age. Does this mean that the transplanted hair isn't necessarily permanent?

Edited by giegnosiganoe
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Thank you for the kind comment and the question also. 

Greyness for example usually even on the scalp initiates not uniformly but more evident in some areas and then can gradually diffuse as the patient ages. There are differences in men/women with regards to this and also to ethnicity,  some more prone to it than others.  

I started to turn grey on my scalp before my chest, but now in my 50s, my chest also has a spattering of grey on it, yet still in the minority, while friends are totally grey now on the scalp and chest and beard also. So it is a mixed bag and only time will tell to the degree that a person changes colour, if they ever do.

Body hair,  as per the video, is firstly ideal as a filler, so if it is mixed with scalp hair also, then you lessen the chance of any colour change issues being evident. For those who have no option due to an exhausted donor, then it is about improving their situation, and if at the time of surgery it is compatible with regards to the above checks, it is probably a better option than doing nothing and thereby having scars or bare skin contrasting with the haired areas. We have not had this issue present itself as of yet and have done some fairly large cases to date. The worst case scenario if one has a very distinct colour change then is to dye the hair, but as said personally it has not been an issue that has been raised.

We for body hair, and chest more so, need to make sure the quality is good, not only quantity but the quality of it and educate in terms of hormonal changes, DHT blockers,  and the effect on body hair. This issue is especially so on leg hairs that have a significant change as men age and can be attributed to friction as well as hormonal, and we avoid touching those areas.

Even traditional scalp donor hair will thin as one ages, not a massive percentage, but still a reality over time, so the transplanted hair is as permanent as the donor source essentially. What makes a hair transplant work is that this is usually a small percentage. 

 

 

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Dr. Christian Bisanga is recommended on the Hair Transplant Network

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Posted (edited)
15 hours ago, giegnosiganoe said:

1. Doesn't the hair color progression between head/beard/chest hair differ? For example, your head hair is turning gray, but your chest/beard hair isn't. Seems like a risk that may have your transplanted area looking a bit odd.

2. I've heard that body hair (say chest hair) thins out as you age. Does this mean that the transplanted hair isn't necessarily permanent?

 

1. Nobody turns gray all at once. It starts with a few gray hairs mixed in and over time more of the hair turns gray, so it usually isn't going to matter if you use some gray hair mixed in with darker hair. It will just look like that area is graying. If you really don't like it you can dye your hair.

2. If your scalp hair wasn't thinning out then you wouldn't be needing body hair, so I would say anyone using body hair has the opposite problem that you describe in that their scalp hair is thinning much earlier than the body hair. For me personally at 53 years old my scalp hair has been thinning since I was in my teens, yet my body hair is still lengthening and increasing in count and density.

Remember that most of the time the use of body hair will be because there isn't enough scalp hair, so any issues with body hair not matching perfectly with scalp hair is usually a lesser problem than not using it at all.

EDIT: I will also add that my body hair that has been transplanted to my scalp grows longer and faster than the native scalp hair.

Edited by BeHappy
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Here is one of the guys from the video, as of today sent these beard photos after 3,800 taken...Got some salt and pepper in there and now 52.

IMG-20200420-WA0059.jpg

IMG-20200420-WA0060.jpg

IMG-20200420-WA0061.jpg


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Dr. Christian Bisanga is recommended on the Hair Transplant Network

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Excellent presentation. Very valuable information!


Patient Advisor for BHR Clinic Athens - Greece

ian@drchristianbisanga.com  -  WhatsApp - + 34 642 37 03 83 

I am not a medical professional and my words should not be taken as medical advice. All opinions and views shared are my own.

My Hair Loss Website

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thank you for the video,

can you please post various photo results using different body hairs so we can get an idea of how effective it is. thanks so much

 

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Posted (edited)

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Posted (edited)

Nice video, SL. A few thoughts:

Why are chest hairs better than stomach hairs? You say on the video that you use chest hairs but not stomach because the stomach hairs and leg hairs are vellus hairs. Not true in my case. My stomach hairs are exactly the same as my chest hairs. They are good calibre robust hairs and they grow pretty long, I would guess at least 3 inches and I have to clip them all the time.

Dr. Bhatti said in another video that stomach hairs have a much shorter anagen phase than chest hairs. If that is true, why do my stomach hairs seem to grow just as long as my chest hairs?

I am interested in using my beard, chest and stomach hairs to add density to an old transplant, because I have a depleted scalp donor area and also strip scars I would like to fix. I have denser hair on my stomach than on my chest, though plenty of hair in both places.

I'm also concerned about the higher transection rates and lower survival rates of these hairs. But why the distinction between chest and stomach when they appear, at least in my case, to be identical?

Edited by Pangloss
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Thanks pengloss, I am also wondering about this and also the difference between cheek hair and under the chin beard hairs

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, Pangloss said:

Why are chest hairs better than stomach hairs? You say on the video that you use chest hairs but not stomach because the stomach hairs and leg hairs are vellus hairs. Not true in my case. My stomach hairs are exactly the same as my chest hairs. They are good calibre robust hairs and they grow pretty long, I would guess at least 3 inches and I have to clip them all the time.

 

I have some lengthy growing stomach hair as well and I've used some in my last transplant about 5 months ago. I seem to be getting a decent result but it's hard to tell as I also used beard grafts as well. I think in general most men don't have much stomach hair and if they do it's very fine and thin and doesn't grow much at all, but there are always going to be some men who have much better quality chest and stomach hair.

 

chest and stomach fue.jpg

Edited by BeHappy
EDIT: Adding a picture in here.
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Posted (edited)

Thanks for the comments and questions and for the photo also. Be good to see how that came in for you.

Chest and abdomen hair for many is vellus, it can in time mature to terminal hair and even when it does for the most part, the richer area is usually the chest. Of course there are some that will be extremely hairy all over but playing to the norms, and my case also, I had chest hair prior to stomach coming in and this became thicker in time but huge parts remained vellus and usually above the belly button zone there is the richer area usually in a vertical line. 

I have met many who had chest hair but no stomach hair but not ones who had loads of stomach hair but not chest.

Here are some photos of regular guys to show this. As said some may buck the trend of course and there is not a one size fits all but playing to the norms, we prefer beard, then parts of chest where the patient has good quality terminal hair. Cautions are DHT blockers and how they effect the body hair also that then can be more prone to falling. I lost body hair on DHT blockers but my beard remained the same.

Also aside from angles, there is more body fat around the abdomen and therefore less taut also for punching and as said parts of the abdomen will have less of an active growth phase resulting in vellus hair type. A man can have a lot of stomach or indeed chest hair but much of it still vellus.

 

Beard throughout the zones change in quality and the peripheral areas are usually weaker and the moustache stronger. Most will ask for under chin to limit any visible impact should they have scars from the surgery. 

 

The below photos show some patterns of growth, density and hair quality changes in chest and abdomen areas for three individuals. All have a fair amount of chest but abdomen is weaker in all three in density and quality, so we keep these factors in mind and it is important to utilise the best body hair for the patient to obtain the best result and educating in terms of the video the coarseness, count, cycle etc are different and transection or growth rates can vary. 

 

Once we get to body hair it usually means the patient has exhausted the scalp, so we need to give them the best chance of success and take the best quality hair then usually presents itself and generally there is a demise as you go down from chest to abdomen.

 

 

chest abdomen comp.jpg

Edited by sl

I represent Dr. Bisanga.

 

Dr. Christian Bisanga is recommended on the Hair Transplant Network

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, BeHappy said:

 

I have some lengthy growing stomach hair as well and I've used some in my last transplant about 5 months ago. I seem to be getting a decent result but it's hard to tell as I also used beard grafts as well. I think in general most men don't have much stomach hair and if they do it's very fine and thin and doesn't grow much at all, but there are always going to be some men who have much better quality chest and stomach hair.

 

4 hours ago, BeHappy said:

 

chest and stomach fue.jpg

Thanks for posting this, BeHappy. My stomach hair looks very similar to yours. And there is the strip north of the navel that SL referred to where the hairs are very straight, hence might look better to blend with straight scalp hair. On my chest, the greatest density is around the nipples where the hair is robust, grows long, but is curlier than my stomach hair.

It would be great if you could maybe study the transplanted stomach hair closely, differentiate it from the beard hair, and estimate what percentage of the stomach hair actually grew. I know that's not easy to do...

Edited by Pangloss

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Thanks for your reply, sl. Since the stomach is jelly-like, does that mean transection rates are always going to be higher compared to the chest?

Another question: Dr. Bhatti, in one of his videos, said that the anagen phase of the stomach hair is considerably shorter than the chest hair. I'm having a hard time accepting that, since the hairs on both my chest and stomach are pretty identical and grow to the same length. Is it possible that anagen/telogen ratios might be very different in individual cases, and some men have a much longer anagen phase than average in their body hair?

I also remember he said that anagen phase for cheek hair was very short, like  2.5 months, and that does not agree with my experience. I'm sure my cheek hair grows much longer than that.

A good percentage of my stomach hairs seem to be double hairs, which is also a plus.

Various studies I've read give success rates for chest hair at 60 to 70 percent, and for stomach hair at less than 50%. Can that all be attributed to greater transection in the stomach hairs since they are harder to extract successfully?

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Then there is the issue of back hairs. I also have lots of those, with similar quality to the chest/stomach hairs. But some doctors have told me that they don't like to use back hairs because the back scars badly. Yet I have seen, on some HT doctors' websites, before/after pics of guys who used exclusively back hair and got great results.

What are your thoughts about back hair?

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Thank you for the comments Pangloss.

In the photos you see men with even good chest have longer and darker hairs and even though the first person has a lot of abdomen, you see them also finer and therefore a longer resting phase is evident and a shorter growth phase than the chest has that is more abundant and darker and better quality. As said this is the norm,  but I have seen some patients,  and ethnic groups also play a part and I recall some southern Europeans who have very strong abdomen hair that is very good but always they have had good chest hairs as a consequence and a carpet of hair that is all terminal.

 

Some will in essence have more "terminal" hairs grow, some will remain vellus and this is genetics that is individual to them. Also medication plays a part, as DHT blockers can weaken body hair, so Minoxidil has a positive effect. I would agree with Dr.Bhatti for the norm of the anagen phases for most, but you may be one who has little difference in the anagen phases of abdomen to chest, an exception more than the norm, so for your case it could be different.

 

Dr.Bisanga has many years of experience in Strip/FUE and body hair, and unlike many he is not a recent convert to FUE, but has been doing it since inception of his career  that now spans 20 years, and also has seen a lot of and performed a lot of body hair cases and in his experience he says scalp is king, beard is prince and then you need to evaluate the rest, but usually will, unless exceptional circumstance, limit himself to beard and chest and even then cherry pick the good and stronger ones from the pattern that the patient has.

Beard also has variations throughout it and usually the peripheral areas are finer so have less of an anagen phase. If you are on Minoxidil you may notice this increases also.

The rate of growth you quote for stomach is not usually transection as if transection is clear then they would not be transplanted unless in good condition still and in the hope something would grow, so it is more survival of them from the operation. Of course they can take longer to grow than scalp hair due to the phases being different to scalp and  I have known some even get growth at two years on body hair.

Back in 2007 I had a training doctor punch 300 grafts on my chest, I got small dots and could see where they were punched from and got hairs come back in these same spots, so the follicle was transected and the part left behind re-grew from my chest, so it had not been fully captured and chest is harder due to angles splaying around and it was interesting to see the re-growth in the original area.

Back hair can be very coarse, but normally those who have back hair and on shoulders also, have an abundance of chest that is also tapped into firstly.

Like anything, there are the rules and then the exceptions who may genetically have different characteristics and be able to exploit that.

If you would like to post photos or even send me photos of your case then I will pass to Dr.B to assess for you an give you his opinion on what he would harvest from for you.

 


I represent Dr. Bisanga.

 

Dr. Christian Bisanga is recommended on the Hair Transplant Network

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On 4/20/2020 at 10:52 AM, sl said:

Here is one of the guys from the video, as of today sent these beard photos after 3,800 taken...Got some salt and pepper in there and now 52.

IMG-20200420-WA0059.jpg

IMG-20200420-WA0060.jpg

IMG-20200420-WA0061.jpg

hI, 

thank you for posting. have you noticed a difference between the hairs that grew under the chin vs the ones from the face? thanks so much

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8 hours ago, sl said:

I have met many who had chest hair but no stomach hair but not ones who had loads of stomach hair but not chest.

 

I had lots of thick chest hair, but most of that has already been used in prior body hair FUEs. You can see they shaved my entire chest for this session, but it turned out that there wasn't really much good grafts left to take, so we decided to try going down lower where we hadn't touched yet. The grafts came out easy, so we plan to do another session on the rest of the stomach area in the future.

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6 hours ago, Pangloss said:

t would be great if you could maybe study the transplanted stomach hair closely, differentiate it from the beard hair, and estimate what percentage of the stomach hair actually grew. I know that's not easy to do.

 

Definitely not easy to do. If you look at the top of my picture you can see I also had beard grafts taken out as well, so between the mix of areas and grafts we did I really can't tell which ones grow and which don't. In a previous session I had only chest hair done and they grew ok, but not great. What I mean by that is the ones that grew are good and grow long and faster than my head hair, but I think there was definitely a higher rate of non growth than if I used head hair, but not bad enough to stop me from doing more. I also had another session where we used both beard hair and chest hair and separated them using the beard hair in the crown and the chest hair towards the front and I think the beard hair did a little better in growth, but again I have no problem using more chest hair or stomach hair as I feel it does grow well enough to make a difference.

 

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Posted (edited)

@lovinitl9, I am on contact very regularly with this patient and he has not reported any differences. Also the grafts would have then been mixed so not all in one area transplanted, so it does make any difference less likely to see also.

 

@BeHappy, Yes, having lots of hair even on the chest does not mean all are good, there is a pattern also usually to the finer vellus and the thicker usable. You have a lot of abdomen hair but some areas evidently the quality is less and finer, so it will be a case of cherry picking and taking the best quality. Be great to see some photos of how it came out if possible also. I am sure you got a pretty decent outcome to want to do more, so that is a real plus. Did you notice any change in quality on the scalp over the years? Assuming it was years ago you had initial work done. Thanks.

Edited by sl

I represent Dr. Bisanga.

 

Dr. Christian Bisanga is recommended on the Hair Transplant Network

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6 hours ago, Pangloss said:

Then there is the issue of back hairs. I also have lots of those, with similar quality to the chest/stomach hairs. But some doctors have told me that they don't like to use back hairs because the back scars badly. Yet I have seen, on some HT doctors' websites, before/after pics of guys who used exclusively back hair and got great results.

What are your thoughts about back hair?

 

I have a lot of back hair too and we tried a small test session of back hair to see if we could use that area, but the grafts were just not coming out intact and it was tearing apart the area, so it wasn't worth continuing. I may or may not try to convince them to have another try at it in the future if I think extraction methods have improved over time and if I run out of other hair to use before getting to the point I'm trying to get to. We'll see.

 

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