Jump to content
dust78

MY EXPERIENCE WITH DR.KORAY. HAVE I BEEN OVER HARVESTED?

Recommended Posts

Hello everyone,

I would like to explain my transplant with the Asmed clinic and some details on the operation:

I got operated with Dr. Koray in 2013 and 4000 grafts were extracted. My operation was satisfactory then, apart from the design of the hairline not very natural to me, but otherwise there was a good regrowth.
In August 2019 I decided to go back to Koray for a little touch-up in the crown, which in my opinion was still empty. After sending some pictures to the clinic, we decided by email for 2000 max 2500 grafts.
When the doctor saw me in person he immediately decided that he wanted to put 4000 grafts and not 2000 as we had established. I honestly remained a little puzzled by this choice, it seemed to me too much for my donor. At last during the vist we found an agreement of 3000 grafts. Immediately after the visit was over with the Doctor, Alessio the italian consultant privately told me that Koray wanted to propose me a discount if i agreed to extract 4000 grafts. But still i wasn’t sure about it because anyway i would had to pay more then what was established and i repeat i was worried about a heavy post-surgery and for my donor. The doctor came to me after this new proposal and told me to not worry that it would have been perfect!

At last the discount offered to me and the insistent reassurances of the doctor that my donor could handle another 4000 grafts without any problem were very convincing, they also told me that in short time I would be all right. In my head there could be no margins of errors if the Doctor was so convinced to insist on this amount!
So I decided to trust the doctor and go for 4000 grafts.

We arrive at the day of the operation, which took place in two days, the first day I was taken 2000 grafts for the front and the second day another 2000 for the crown. Extractions and grafts were performed by two young assistants with the help of other auxiliaries. After the extractions I took a half hour break and then they took me to the surgery room to make the incisions and then the grafts. Once placed on the couch they gave me a dose of intravenous anesthesia and I do not remember if even with a syringe directly on the head. Then they put me some kind of blinkers on my forehead, I honestly don’t know what it was for, then, someone who, I suppose was the doctor, came in to make the incisions. I can’t tell precisely because he didn’t speak to me and I couldn’t see because of the blinders, but since the incisions should be made esclusevely by doctor, I guess it was him. Talking with others patients they told me they had the same treatment. The incisions lasted more or less 10-15 minutes if I remember correctly. I have to say that apart the incisions that i want to trust that he did it, i never saw Koray once during all the the two days surgery, neither to say, hello, only once the surgery was over and we were in the room where they cut and wash hair he came to compliment with me and with the two young assistant, stop.

 

Already after two weeks after the surgery when the hairs had grown back a little, I realized that something was not right, my donor was really empty behind, too much! I began to worry seriously, I sent photos to the clinic, which told me to don’t worry and that in 2/3 months everything would be back and would be homogenized.

But the more weeks went by and the more the worry increased due to the very evident gaps and in addition I noticed that in some areas more grafts had been extracted than others (you can see it in the pictures), so to my opinion they did not maintain a proper homogeneity in the extraction.

Arrived at 4 months i realized that my donor was doomed, in my opinion overharvesting was done in all the donor area. The clinic repeats me to wait 7/8 or more months, when at the beginning of this story in 2 or 3 months everything had to return to normal.

And now I don’t know how it will end, i really have the impression that a wrong value of my donor was done and that the doctor extracted too much hair. If it were like this then it would be an unforgivable mistake.
This is my experience with the clinic Asmed until now, i let you make your own opinion, for me absolutely negative for how my donor is reduced after more then 3 months.

  

3821_Ust.JPG

3921_Sol.JPG

3922_Arka.JPG

3922_Ust.JPG

Edited by dust78

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Your donor looks rough for the 3 months mark, hoping you will see improvement in the next 2-3 months otherwise your donor is harvested, stay strong there is always a way to fix things, good luck!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

asmed is actually known for very good donor management. I've seen a lot of Asmed reports, but this is the first time I've seen it. I hope it's just a temporary shockloss.


 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is insane!!!! looking at these pictures how can you extract another 4000 grafts?? the donor already looked depleted, this is unreal, if your donor doesn't recover, demand a full refund, they should be sued honestly. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

this is how i was before the second surgery, wasn't enough 2000/2500? and today we would be all happy?

Well now you are going to laugh, they want to sue me because i made a blog where i just testify exactly what i put in this report, with pictures and an exact descripcion of what has happened. Can you imagine? Not only they there is a possibility that my donor is damaged but i can't even express myself and tell the truth!! unebelievable!

Photo on 22-06-19 at 21.56 #4.jpg

Photo on 22-06-19 at 21.57 #2.jpg

Photo on 22-06-19 at 21.58.jpg

Edited by dust78
  • Sad 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

THIS IS INSANE!!!! they want to sue you????? you did not need 4000 grafts, especially after having 4000 done in the first place, they ruined your head, make a video on youtube explain what happened to you, this is crazy!! what a shame

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

all this is taking me a lot of energy stress and dark moment. That's all i have to say. I ll try to stay strong and focus on what i have to do, but is very difficult!

  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, dust78 said:

all this is taking me a lot of energy stress and dark moment. That's all i have to say. I ll try to stay strong and focus on what i have to do, but is very difficult!

I know how you feel, I have been in this situation before, it will get better with time, perhaps a miracle will happen and your donor will get better, try to get your mind of of it and live a normal life, if things don't get better contact other doctors to get an idea of how things can be fixed, good luck!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hey man, try not to stress now. Might as well wait it out and see how the result turns out. I think you should look into smp. You can smp the donor area and keep it buzzed at a 1 or 2 and have an undercut look. I am actually planning on doing that too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I know i can do a smp i can do a donor exchange. The point is not what i can do but how is my aspect after almost 4 months. Why? After have spent so much money why  do i have to be in this condition? And either with long hair now im at almost 4cm , the voids are evident.

Edited by dust78

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can see your concerns, especially in the 3 month post procedure pictures. Fingers crossed there is just some shock loss involved and there is some improvement in the coming months. Personally, if someone has had a fairly large 4000-5000 grafts FUE as their first procedure, think one needs to tread fairly carefully in any subsequent procedures and smaller procedures are better imo. 

Regardless, looking at your pre-op pictures, totally understandable why you only wanted the crown worked on and that's it. Certainly do not like the sound of the clinic almost cajoling you into an extra 2000 grafts. That is poor form imo and very disappointing to read. If you were happy with the frontal area and only the crown was discussed in the online consultation, it should have been left at that......simple. End of the day, it's about meeting the patients expectation.

 

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes and  i apreciate it,thank you very much! I already checked all the solutions :) but i will make a decision next year, to do a repair i have to wait.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
57 minutes ago, Fozzie said:

Can see your concerns, especially in the 3 month post procedure pictures. Fingers crossed there is just some shock loss involved and there is some improvement in the coming months. Personally, if someone has had a fairly large 4000-5000 grafts FUE as their first procedure, think one needs to tread fairly carefully in any subsequent procedures and smaller procedures are better imo. 

Regardless, looking at your pre-op pictures, totally understandable why you only wanted the crown worked on and that's it. Certainly do not like the sound of the clinic almost cajoling you into an extra 2000 grafts. That is poor form imo and very disappointing to read. If you were happy with the frontal area and only the crown was discussed in the online consultation, it should have been left at that......simple. End of the day, it's about meeting the patients expectation.

 

 

Absolutely agree, the doctor knew exaclty what i wanted and saw my perplexity when he proposed me 4000. And finally we decided for 3000 that were already a lot, but maybe now i wouldnt be in this condition. Then all this story about the discount that was  offered to me after the visit, and the insistence that it would have been better and i would not have any problem, made me agree to accept it. But the discount meant that anyway i would had have to pay more then the 3000 that were granted!

Edited by dust78

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, dust78 said:

Absolutely agree, the doctor knew exaclty what i wanted and saw my perplexity when he proposed me 4000. And finally we decided for 3000 that were already a lot, but maybe now i wouldnt be in this condition. Then all this story about the discount that was  offered to me after the visit, and the insistence that it would have been better and i would not have any problem, made me agree to accept it. But the discount meant that anyway i would had have to pay more then the 3000 that were grant.

Disgusting tactics by the clinic

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@Abi28 Why are you making this member feel even more anxious when he still has a lot of time left for his donor to improve. 

Ok so here are the facts:

1.Patient went to Dr. Erdogan back in 2013 and had 4,000 grafts with decent results, good enough that he returned to the clinic. 

2.The patient had moderate crown loss, which the clinic agreed to transplant 4,000 grafts ( I agree this number seems high) 

3. The patient is at 3 months, and is yet to see any growth, as expected at 3 months

4. The patient is unhappy with how his donor looks at this present moment. 

Ok, so here are my thoughts.

I don't think 4,000 grafts is too much for the crown in general, the crown takes nearly double as many grafts to be visually dense, as the hairline would. However, 4,000 grafts in one sitting is risky. I will say this, that out of all the cases I have seen of Dr. Erdogan, this is the first time anyone has ever complained about how their donor appears. There is a guy on here @Derek7 whose had 5,000 grafts and his donor looks pristine even at a zero guard.

Unfortunately, no two people are the same and everyone heals differently. That said, these are some valid concerns. I will reach out to the clinic, so they can address these concerns. That said, we should not as a community be jumping to conclusions so quickly. I

I would like to remind everyone, that I too had donor shock loss, which resolved around the sixth month. Donor shock loss does occur, especially if you're extracting that many grafts at once. It's my understanding that Dr. Erdogan, has donor management down to a science and knows the exact donor capacity, and the amount of grafts that could be extracted without causing donor depletion. I will wait to see what they have to say about this case. 

In the future, please write any review or concerns directly on the forum. We do not host third-party links, and when new members begin linking their websites/blogs on our forum, we will assume it is spam.


I do not provide medical advice, recommendations, all responses are my opinion.

My Hair Transplant Journey

Melvin- Associate Publisher and Forum Moderator for the Hair Transplant Network, the Coalition Hair Loss Learning Center, and the Hair Loss Q&A Blog.

Follow our Social Media Instagram @thehairtransplantnetwork FacebookPintrest, Linkedin and YouTube.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@Melvin-Moderator I am not trying to make him feel anxious, I am just being honest, this guy had a total of 8000 grafts done. He wanted to fix the crown, they told him he needs 2000-2500 graft via email, he showed up and the doctor pressured him into doing 4000 grafts. The 4000 grafts were split between 2000 at the front and 2000 at the back, the patient was hesitant, he was vulnerable, they agreed on 3000, the assistant came back to him offered him a discount to do 4000 grafts instead so he agreed. This is not okay by any means, they told him his donor will look better in 2-3 months post op, it hasn't and now they are telling him to wait 7-8 months. How many patients have done 8000 grafts? I haven't seen anyone with that kinda hair loss get an extra 4000 grafts, no doctor in their mind would tell him you need 4000 grafts after seeing his photos. I give 2 shits about ASMED but this is crazy to me..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And yes @Melvin-Moderator you are correct, shock loss happens more often than what people think, usually the donor will recover in a few months and can take up to 6 months, I also agree that ASMED is one of the better clinics at donor management but they are too aggressive and they always push for more grafts, sorry but what they did to this man is unethical.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I thought I made a comment earlier on this thread?  
 

I do feel only time will tell what happens.  I face similar krap in donor.  If it doesn’t heal by month 8 then the halo will remain in donor.  The extractions should always be spread out and not follow a compressed extraction pattern.   This is how donor decimation can occur.  Again, only time will tell.  I am still struggling with issues caused by doctors.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The clinic in my opinion has an upward trend in the extractions. And im not saying that only for my case.  To all the patients that were there with me , in those days, the doctor proposed them more grafts then what was established previously, that’s what they told me, some accepted others not. There is a guy in particular with whom im in contact with who had a previous transplant of 4000 grafts with a  very good result, and he wanted only to fill the crown( same as me), well the doctor wanted to extract him 4500 grafts, and he accepted and today he has the same problem as mine.

in my case  there is a good possibility that the doctor didn’t understand the capacity of my donor and made a wrong evaluation of it  plus the two young assistant i think didn’t make a very good job, because not only my donor area seem depleted all over , but also i have parts were there are even less hair then others, almost empty so there wasn’t homogeneity in the extraction.

what i came to know after the surgery, that i didn’t know before, is that dr. Koray has invented a theory called coverage value, that is like a formula that prevent from overharvesting and also he is developing a robot called ke bot  that actually was tested on me when i was there, i didn’t know it was the ke bot, they just used it on me without telling me exactly what it was for.Well I have to say that  if my situation will not improve in the future his theory didn’t work so well on me!

 In my humble opinion what is most important in a doctor is a realistic and ethical vision that prevent any possibility of problem for the patient, good hands, and a lot of professionality that of course koray has. But we are not cars that can be fixed so easily if a problem occur, so i don’t see the point in pushing the limit so much to have a good result, ok it can go well  most of the time but  it can happen that something go wrong. I still hope that koray didn’t make a wrong decision, but as time go  by  im more demoralized about my aspect.

For me going to koray had to be a guarantee, there are a lot of clinic in istambul even much cheaper, but didn’t want to risk, pay less and have a bad result in the regrowth was not my plan. But now the problem seems much bigger then a bad regrowth, here there is the possibility that my donor is depleted forever.

 

Edited by dust78
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×