POLL: For users who are taking or have taken Finasteride...

[hair4tomo]

I'm soon about to begin taking Finasteride, and would like some more reassurance before I start, so I created this poll.

Edited June 27, 2019 by hair4tomo

[hair4tomo]

For the person who voted "Minor negative side effects which are still persisting for months or even years despite not taking the drug any more", can you describe in more detail please?

[Mr S]

7 hours ago, hair4tomo said:

I'm soon about to begin taking Finasteride, and would like some more reassurance before I start, so I created this poll.

The more you read into it the more likely you will gets side effects imo. Your mind is the most powerful drug there is and you can easily create sides in your head if you suffer from anxiety. Take it with a positive outlook it wouldn’t be an approved drug if it was all true. Sure the sides are real but i belive that they are mainly from people worrying about the sides rather than the drug itself.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited June 27, 2019 by Mr S

[hair4tomo]

That's a good point, but I don't feel as if I'm someone that's vulnerable to the placebo effect.

I know I won't get an unbiased population sample in this poll, but it's just something to take into consideration.

Edited June 27, 2019 by hair4tomo

[HLPToronto]

• Its been 3 months on fin astride,  I don't see any side effects    I will have to monitor long term

[Mr S]

21 minutes ago, hair4tomo said:

That's a good point, but I don't feel as if I'm someone that vulnerable to the placebo effect.

I know I won't get an unbiased population sample in this poll, but it's just something to take into consideration.

My personal experience - i took it for around 8-9 months no sides really other than maybe after 7 months i noticed frequent urination & less semen when ejaculating (apprently theres some corrilation with this as it effects your prostate) got a HT the its seems as if the sides came literally after that. inconsistant erections, maybe 70%, some were still good but it was hit and miss ( i was really researching it at this point panicing alittle that i had had a HT and couldnt take it) still had a high libido so maybe it was in my head.  i stopped taking it anyway and all returned to normal although i have noticed climaxes are ALOT better without taking it. Will give my body the  summer off it and clear my head and will try again 👍🏼

Edited June 27, 2019 by Mr S

[Lennney]

1 hour ago, Mr S said:

The more you read into it the more likely you will gets side effects imo. Your mind is the most powerful drug there is and you can easily create sides in your head if you suffer from anxiety. Take it with a positive outlook it wouldn’t be an approved drug if it was all true. Sure the sides are real but i belive that they are mainly from people worrying about the sides rather than the drug itself.

Speaking of placebo, I take fenugreek and tribulus as a precaution. My understanding is: yes it's a placebo potentially, but I am more confident due to:

1. Some action on my part to do as much as I can to address any side effects.

2. I ignore thoughts of doubt and quickly place my mind on anything else. I make an enormous effort to not think about it.

 

Having said that. Here is some anecdotal feedback:

I was shook this last week or so. My so wanted to do stuff, but my mind wasn't really in it, and then I panicked and ONLY thought bad thoughts about the ED. A minute later, even with a mind full of panic, everything worked, maybe 80% of maximum, but 80% of max is only noticable to myself. I'd say by this logic it would become noticable for others at 60% where there would be some loss in rigidity.

My point again is, do what you can, but try, as hard as it is, to not think about your dick working. You used to never think about it, don't start now. If you're still somewhat paranoid, take libido supplements AND don't think about it. Just consider it part of your HT/ your hair care routine. Don't think of it as a dick treatment.

[hairman22]

i had no sides or worries about the drug until 2 years when the the sides struck.

 

Got PFS & the first few months were a living hell. Total ED. You feel lifeless.

 

Improving now after 2 years though & mentally in a good place despite not fully recovered but you have to live a monk like lifestyle which is ok for me as I never drank alcohol.

[hair4tomo]

Good to hear hairnma22 that you're improving. What made you discontinue Finasteride in the first place?

The brain fog/depression stuff concerns me even more than the libido stuff to be honest.

 

Has a poll like this before conducted before on these forums?

Edited June 27, 2019 by hair4tomo

[bonkling]

Been on it about about 2.5-3 years.

Had sides for like, the first two days, but I put this down almost 100% due to my mental preparation.

I read about the sides, thought I might get them, then as soon as I popped the pill my brain was like, "welp, you got em".

After I convinced myself how ludicrous I was being, I was back to normal.

I take natural supplements (fenugreek) to boost any libido issues I have. Admittedly, this is mostly peace of mind as I never actually had any issues. 

The trouble with ED, is that there is such a huge mental aspect. I.e. if something triggers a minor episode, our mind can cause this to unravel and go beyond a physiological stressor.

Hard to say if I've got brain fog, or not. Im one of those perpetually tired people that is always half asleep, and have always been. So my natural mode is foggy 😂

You can always try it at a low dosage: 0.25mg, then 0.5, and so on. Incremental changes are the best way to avoid long term effects, or so I am told.

[Recedinggenes]

Stuff is poison to me.  I wouldn’t and couldn’t recommend it to anyone to save them the chance of getting the sides I got/have.

Finasteride completely killed my sex drive and erections in a time where I was just starting a new relationship.  I gave it a little more time thinking it was in my head or going to go away and then started feeling a dull ache in my testicle.  Here I am 4 and a half years later with that same pain.

Will never touch it or recommend it, almost ruined my manhood.

[hair4tomo]

On 6/28/2019 at 2:20 PM, Recedinggenes said:

Finasteride completely killed my sex drive and erections in a time where I was just starting a new relationship.  I gave it a little more time thinking it was in my head or going to go away and then started feeling a dull ache in my testicle.  Here I am 4 and a half years later with that same pain.

Sorry to hear. Is the pain permanently there, or just sometimes?

I know we've only had 13 poll entries, but I'm surprised at the results to be honest. The information leaflets by the chemist showed studies that indicated only around 1-5% of people would suffer side effects (However, they also gave "unknown" for a couple of things like depression). Looking at this thread however, you'd think it was just a coin toss in terms of Finasteride side effects!

Really disappointed - I think I'll skip Finasteride for now, at least until I see more studies. Is there something safer than Finasteride to pause hair loss? I've heard Minoxidil can add around 20% of hair density, but the hair loss slide still happens (and if you come off it, it's as if you never took it at all).

Edited June 29, 2019 by hair4tomo

[Recedinggenes]

48 minutes ago, hair4tomo said:

Sorry to hear. Is the pain permanently there, or just sometimes?

I know we've only had 13 poll entries, but I'm surprised at the results to be honest. The information leaflets by the chemist showed studies that indicated only around 1-5% of people would suffer side effects (However, they also gave "unknown" for a couple of things like depression). Looking at this thread however, you'd think it was just a coin toss in terms of Finasteride side effects!

Really disappointed - I think I'll skip Finasteride for now, at least until I see more studies. Is there something safer than Finasteride to pause hair loss? I've heard Minoxidil can add around 20% of hair density, but the hair loss slide still happens (and if you come off it, it's as if you never took it at all).

It’s there everyday.  Can’t sleep in some positions, they are extra sore after a hard workout or after a hard you know what lol.

It sucks, I know it isn’t giving everybody bad sides but for me it did and I’ll regret it for the rest of my life.  

 

[Lennney]

47 minutes ago, hair4tomo said:

Sorry to hear. Is the pain permanently there, or just sometimes?

I know we've only had 13 poll entries, but I'm surprised at the results to be honest. The information leaflets by the chemist showed studies that indicated only around 1-5% of people would suffer side effects (However, they also gave "unknown" for a couple of things like depression). Looking at this thread however, you'd think it was just a coin toss in terms of Finasteride side effects!

Really disappointed - I think I'll skip Finasteride for now, at least until I see more studies. Is there something safer than Finasteride to pause hair loss? I've heard Minoxidil can add around 20% of hair density, but the hair loss slide still happens (and if you come off it, it's as if you never took it at all).

Alternatives which have less symptoms, not really right now. You can try what other symptom sufferers do, and go on saw palmetto.

As far as results go, you're in a bubble. The bubble is people who

A. Are available on this forum

B. Have accounts

C. Took time to visit thread

D. Have heard symptom warnings repeatedly on this forum.

 

Again, these results don't see my former co-workers who have been on fin for 7 and 10 years, they don't get a vote.

A+B is simple removal from the at-large population. This may skew results either way, but...

C. Is the interest in this thread. This will invite the strongest opinions (same as reviews for a restaurant, only the really impressed or disappointed people review [and habitual reviewers]). This would be my guess at the bias. Logically there are more than (at the time of writing) 13 fin users on this entire forum. You're likely getting the negative reviewers who take time out to vote where other members and by extension, A. visitors do not.

D. Many of the side effects are in the mind. I'm not arguing that there are not real side effects, only that there is a statistically small chance that a new user will experience them. Placing a placebo in the mind is actually very powerful.

Please at least look at this article...

https://www.painscience.com/biblio/fascinating-landmark-study-of-placebo-surgery-for-knee-osteoarthritis.html

 

Long story short is, people with knee arthritis had same (favorable!!) results with a placebo as they did with the surgeries.

It completely changed knee surgeries for osteoarthritis.

When you're in an echo chamber which pushes a "lookout for symptoms", it becomes very possible to manufacture these symptoms, especially since the symptoms are largely mental and not physical.

My guess for D. Is that docs warn the patients, but don't go on to tell horror stories. These patients don't hear the bad, and don't think about it. These patients would therefore not have a reason to look for the symptoms. These patients would then be less likely to make accounts A+B, and less likely to post in the poll C.

Anyway, good poll to have. Like all polls and surveys, a lot of thought has to be placed into the application and potential bias.

[bonkling]

3 hours ago, Lennney said:

Alternatives which have less symptoms, not really right now. You can try what other symptom sufferers do, and go on saw palmetto.

As far as results go, you're in a bubble. The bubble is people who

A. Are available on this forum

B. Have accounts

C. Took time to visit thread

D. Have heard symptom warnings repeatedly on this forum.

 

Again, these results don't see my former co-workers who have been on fin for 7 and 10 years, they don't get a vote.

A+B is simple removal from the at-large population. This may skew results either way, but...

C. Is the interest in this thread. This will invite the strongest opinions (same as reviews for a restaurant, only the really impressed or disappointed people review [and habitual reviewers]). This would be my guess at the bias. Logically there are more than (at the time of writing) 13 fin users on this entire forum. You're likely getting the negative reviewers who take time out to vote where other members and by extension, A. visitors do not.

D. Many of the side effects are in the mind. I'm not arguing that there are not real side effects, only that there is a statistically small chance that a new user will experience them. Placing a placebo in the mind is actually very powerful.

Please at least look at this article...

https://www.painscience.com/biblio/fascinating-landmark-study-of-placebo-surgery-for-knee-osteoarthritis.html

 

Long story short is, people with knee arthritis had same (favorable!!) results with a placebo as they did with the surgeries.

It completely changed knee surgeries for osteoarthritis.

When you're in an echo chamber which pushes a "lookout for symptoms", it becomes very possible to manufacture these symptoms, especially since the symptoms are largely mental and not physical.

My guess for D. Is that docs warn the patients, but don't go on to tell horror stories. These patients don't hear the bad, and don't think about it. These patients would therefore not have a reason to look for the symptoms. These patients would then be less likely to make accounts A+B, and less likely to post in the poll C.

Anyway, good poll to have. Like all polls and surveys, a lot of thought has to be placed into the application and potential bias.

This is very true. This is a tiny subset of what would constitute a representative sample of a population. 

Also, you've got to consider that a lot of people on this website have hair loss that either: A) needs to be remedied with an actual transplant, or B) have had bad reactions to medication which has left a transplant as the only option.

I know of quite a few people that got on fin, it kept their hair, and they never thought about hair loss again - or at least not as we do.

I.e. the people who had a positive result on fin are most likely not on forums such as these.

Lenney had some good natural options, that might be a good start. Either that, or start at a very low dosage. 

[hair4tomo]

21 hours ago, Recedinggenes said:

It’s there everyday.  Can’t sleep in some positions, they are extra sore after a hard workout or after a hard you know what lol.

It sucks, I know it isn’t giving everybody bad sides but for me it did and I’ll regret it for the rest of my life.  

 

You did the best with the information you had at the time. I just created the same poll on another forum (Reddit), and the results (so far, been about 12 hours) look a lot more optimistic than in this forum: 

So to be honest, I've even had second thoughts about taking the medication after all. Like Lenney and Bonkling say, the type of people who visit this forum may be more likely to have had problems with Fin.

21 hours ago, Lennney said:

C. Is the interest in this thread. This will invite the strongest opinions (same as reviews for a restaurant, only the really impressed or disappointed people review [and habitual reviewers]). This would be my guess at the bias. Logically there are more than (at the time of writing) 13 fin users on this entire forum. You're likely getting the negative reviewers who take time out to vote where other members and by extension, A. visitors do not.

Whilst your point is theoretically sound, I might disagree because the poll results I collected from the other forum (see image above) are much less pessimistic. They each took the time to vote too, yet the vast majority have no perceivable side effects.

21 hours ago, Lennney said:

When you're in an echo chamber which pushes a "lookout for symptoms", it becomes very possible to manufacture these symptoms, especially since the symptoms are largely mental and not physical.

Very good point. Thanks also for linking that knee study! The placebo effect is a powerful thing. I think more research is needed to use only the power of the mind to help heal certain conditions, especially those involving pain.

17 hours ago, bonkling said:

I know of quite a few people that got on fin

People you know in real life, or on the internet? Did you know these people before they were even considering Fin?

[pkipling]

Option that isn't included: "Some minor side effects that lead me to discontinue the medication. Sides did not persist." 😎

[hair4tomo]

1 minute ago, pkipling said:

Option that isn't included: "Some minor side effects that lead me to discontinue the medication. Sides did not persist."

You're absolutely right. And if you have a look at the image in my previous reply, you'll see that's the fourth option (only added for the Reddit poll). I regret not adding that option for the main poll here.

[bonkling]

8 hours ago, hair4tomo said:

You did the best with the information you had at the time. I just created the same poll on another forum (Reddit), and the results (so far, been about 12 hours) look a lot more optimistic than in this forum: 

So to be honest, I've even had second thoughts about taking the medication after all. Like Lenney and Bonkling say, the type of people who visit this forum may be more likely to have had problems with Fin.

Whilst your point is theoretically sound, I might disagree because the poll results I collected from the other forum (see image above) are much less pessimistic. They each took the time to vote too, yet the vast majority have no perceivable side effects.

Very good point. Thanks also for linking that knee study! The placebo effect is a powerful thing. I think more research is needed to use only the power of the mind to help heal certain conditions, especially those involving pain.

People you know in real life, or on the internet? Did you know these people before they were even considering Fin?

Both. Some in person, some over the net, and I knew the ones in person prior. 

[Since21]

I've been taking it since it came onto the market in 1997. I used to take 1mg daily. Now I only take .5mg daily/5x week and 1mg/2x week (Mondays and Fridays). Its gotten too expensive (Propecia) and from all the research I've done, .5mg is supposedly as effective as 1mg. I don't know if that's true but I haven't noticed any difference. As for side effects, I haven't noticed any, although my libido has decreased slightly in recent years, but that could be age and my GP has said that is most likely the case. 

[Lennney]

3 hours ago, Since21 said:

I've been taking it since it came onto the market in 1997. I used to take 1mg daily. Now I only take .5mg daily/5x week and 1mg/2x week (Mondays and Fridays). Its gotten too expensive (Propecia) and from all the research I've done, .5mg is supposedly as effective as 1mg. I don't know if that's true but I haven't noticed any difference. As for side effects, I haven't noticed any, although my libido has decreased slightly in recent years, but that could be age and my GP has said that is most likely the case. 

Thanks for the input. As far as expensive goes, have you given any thought to generics (?), Online stores [possibly India](?), Or going across border to Canada or Mexico or picking it up from travels abroad? 

Even if it was less expensive, it doesn't sound like you're looking to up dosage from your current regiment. But have you thought of less expensive means? Did you not like generics?

[Since21]

1 minute ago, Lennney said:

Thanks for the input. As far as expensive goes, have you given any thought to generics (?), Online stores [possibly India](?), Or going across border to Canada or Mexico or picking it up from travels abroad? 

Even if it was less expensive, it doesn't sound like you're looking to up dosage from your current regiment. But have you thought of less expensive means? Did you not like generics?

I tried Proscar many years ago and noticed considerable shedding so I went back to Propecia. Might have been psychological of course. At this point, I wouldn't up the dosage. In fact, I might try .5mg/6x week and see how that works. 

[1978matt]

I take 1/4 Proscar usually Friday and Monday, with no real hair loss for multiple years.  Of course it could be purely coincidental and my hair fall decided to plateau at age 33/34 (now age 40).  I get minor brain fog type issues, so I take it at night and the majority of the sides are gone by the morning.

I think ideally you should try to take 3mg over the space of a week, e.g. 1mg Mon, Wed, Fri or take 0.5mg over 6 days.  I think that would be enough to have a positive effect. 

[LeftHook]

I've been on fin (1mg daily) and minoxidil foam (applied twice daily) for a month now. No side effects whatsoever, in my case. If I was to draw an anecdotal conclusion from my experience thus far, I'd say it's all down to mindset. I was always convinced from day one itself that I wasn't going to suffer any side effects from this.

The only change, is hardly a side effect: just the initial phase of shedding that is associated with both fin and minoxidil.

[yesplease]

To the OP,  a few thoughts:

IMO, the incidence of side effects from finasteride is likely higher than what is reported by the existing studies that are used to endorse the drug. A similar poll was put up here in the recent past with similar results to your current poll (ie much higher incidence of reported sides than literature suggests) and a similar discussion ensued. 

Also, IMO, it is inaccurate to assume that this forum will bias the results substantially towards over-reporting the occurrence of side effects. Of course there will be some individuals who suffered side effects who will be more assertive in sharing their experiences, but there are just as many if not more people here who have tolerated fin and are on this forum to gather info regarding hair transplants and other hair loss information. This is not an anti-fin forum, it's a hair loss and HT forum. Also, even though you state that the reddit poll you posted is "less pessimistic", in the screen shot you provided it still appeared that 40+% of posters stated they had sides to varying degrees. This should also tell us something. 

In regards to my experience, I thoroughly reviewed the available data on fin and did my due diligence. I am medically savvy. I was reassured by the literature and the very low reported incidence of SEs that it supported. I started taking fin fully expecting to not suffer any adverse effects and feel as though I had no worries about ED, etc at that time. Unfortunately, the side effects did occur and recovering from them has been an ongoing process. Additionally, the sides were certainly not just "in my head" as, similar to another poster on this thread, I suffered from genital pain in addition to sexual side effects. Fortunately, the pain has greatly subsided at this point, but it was definitely real. 

Ultimately, while many people suffer no discernible adverse effects from fin, a significant portion of people will experience varying degrees of side effects. My suspicion is that while it is likely a minority of individuals, but it is certainly higher than the nominal percentages quoted in the existing studies. Overall, people should realize that there is real risk involved in taking fin, and it's something you should give some thought to in terms of balancing the risks and rewards for your particular circumstance.