Dr. Arocha - 1800 FUE - 10 Month Results

[ArochaAngel4247]

This patient decided to undergo hair restoration to fill in his hairline. This patient chose not to take Propecia prior to his procedure, but has since begun taking Propecia. He underwent a 1800 FUE procedure with Dr. Arocha and team. The after images were taken 10 months after his procedure!

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[LonelyGraft]

How are these fair comparison shots to show the improvement? The hairline is totally covered in the after shots. I don’t understand these pictures at all

[hairlossPA]

theres no way to see any cosmetic improvement as a result of the surgery. He could easy have this hair style before surgery...

[CosmoKramer]

In all honesty, 1,800 grafts seems a lot just for what looks to be a slim area, and the after pictures are of no help in showing true results due to the hair styled forward. I would have expected better.

[LaserCap]

Great before photos....Need same position photos, post procedure, to admire the work.  

[Mycroft]

10 hours ago, CosmoKramer said:

In all honesty, 1,800 grafts seems a lot just for what looks to be a slim area, and the after pictures are of no help in showing true results due to the hair styled forward. I would have expected better.

I feel the graft count may actually be justified based on the patient's goals and consultations I've had thus far with a few clinics. It's a bit hard to tell what the final outcome is though because as mentioned the hairline itself is not really visible in the after pictures. The only area we can see is part of the corners just above the temple.

[ArochaAngel4247]

Hi everyone, 

Thanks for your comments as always! Dr. Arocha and I talked about this result, and we are going to go ahead and bring the patient back in so doc can replicate the exact "before" photos with the patient's hair pulled back. Look forward to updating you all as soon as possible. 

[HLPToronto]

I honestly think this patient should've been told that he is one of the luckiest ones.... and should be modelling for hair products. He never should've gone for a HT for such a minor change, i mean its not even detectable if you ask me

Before/After should be renamed as same/same  lol  unless there are clearer pics posted to see deeper comparison 

[ArochaAngel4247]

12 minutes ago, HLPToronto said:

I honestly think this patient should've been told that he is one of the luckiest ones.... and should be modelling for hair products. He never should've gone for a HT for such a minor change, i mean its not even detectable if you ask me

Before/After should be renamed as same/same  lol  unless there are clearer pics posted to see deeper comparison 

Hi HLPToronto, 

This patient did have a change. Doc is bringing him back into the office to pull the hair back so you can see the change he underwent. I'll update as soon as I have those photos. 

 

Thanks so much!

[ArochaAngel4247]

Hi all, 

The patient came in for his one year follow-up visit. Wanted to update you with new photos below. Dr. Arocha took these images himself to make sure they were consistent, and that the hair is pulled back with a comb to mimic the before images. 

Thank you!

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[LaserCap]

Beautiful staggered work. 

[Mick50]

First of all this guy has great hair to begin with ,but at the same time his original hair-line was not solid and in my opinion it would have receded  .Now that he is on Fin hopefully he won't lose too much hair behind the new hair-line for a good while and if he does he will have enough grafts for a second or third procedure .I cant see any thinning in the crown, again the Fin hopefully will keep that in tact,I am sure Dr Arocha would have taken any future hair-loss into account.  I think this kind of hair -line work on a guy who has great hair to begin with can be difficult and takes skill to achieve a good result ,as I have seen many cases where   transplanted hair creating a new hair-line just doesn't match the native density, and patient actually looks worse than pre- transplant ,which is certainly not the case here. Great result.   

[Mycroft]

Glad we were able to get clearer images of the hairline work, because that looks great. Truly no indication that he had a procedure at all, and the result blends in perfectly with the native hair.

[Bill - Seemiller]

Guys,

I agree that in this case, the after photos are not ideal and it would certainly be much better if pictures were taken with the hairline combed back so we could genuinely appreciate the results. But we also have to remember that Dr. Arocha has a long history of producing outstanding results and an excellent online reputation for being amongst the best.   Therefore, there is no reason to think that anyone from the clinic Is trying to deceive. 

The truth is, many surgeons are hard pressed for help and try to do everything with only a few people helping them. Sure, they may have a number of technicians doing surgery, but when it  comes to office management, many surgeons lack knowledgeable help to take and present outstanding photos along with other aspects of the business.   Dr. Arocha has always been one of these people. In my opinion,   He is an outstanding surgeon and one of the nicest, most genuine people you’ll ever meet.    But it’s obvious that he needs a little help from someone knowledgeable about taking and presenting optimal photos.   Once he does this, I’m sure we will truly be able to appreciate his outstanding results  which I’m sure includes this one. 

Regarding the number of grafts, 1800 is a relatively small number and even though the area to cover is small, I trust that the patient met the appropriate conditions for a densely packed hairline.     Perhaps Dr. Arocha or one of the staff can explain these conditions to address any concerns  

Best wishes,

Bill

Edited August 21, 2019 by Bill - Seemiller

[LonelyGraft]

2 hours ago, Bill - Seemiller said:

Guys,

I agree that in this case, the after photos are not ideal and it would certainly be much better if pictures were taken with the hairline combed back so we could genuinely appreciate the results. But we also have to remember that Dr. Arocha has a long history of producing outstanding results and an excellent online reputation for being amongst the best.   Therefore, there is no reason to think that anyone from the clinic Is trying to deceive. 

The truth is, many surgeons are hard pressed for help and try to do everything with only a few people helping them. Sure, they may have a number of technicians doing surgery, but when it  comes to office management, many surgeons lack knowledgeable help to take and present outstanding photos along with other aspects of the business.   Dr. Arocha has always been one of these people. In my opinion,   He is an outstanding surgeon and one of the nicest, most genuine people you’ll ever meet.    But it’s obvious that he needs a little help from someone knowledgeable about taking and presenting optimal photos.   Once he does this, I’m sure we will truly be able to appreciate his outstanding results  which I’m sure includes this one. 

Regarding the number of grafts, 1800 is a relatively small number and even though the area to cover is small, I trust that the patient met the appropriate conditions for a densely packed hairline.     Perhaps Dr. Arocha or one of the staff can explain these conditions to address any concerns  

Best wishes,

Bill

They did post updated photos with the hair pushed back.....

[ArochaAngel4247]

On 8/21/2019 at 12:37 PM, Bill - Seemiller said:

Guys,

I agree that in this case, the after photos are not ideal and it would certainly be much better if pictures were taken with the hairline combed back so we could genuinely appreciate the results. But we also have to remember that Dr. Arocha has a long history of producing outstanding results and an excellent online reputation for being amongst the best.   Therefore, there is no reason to think that anyone from the clinic Is trying to deceive. 

The truth is, many surgeons are hard pressed for help and try to do everything with only a few people helping them. Sure, they may have a number of technicians doing surgery, but when it  comes to office management, many surgeons lack knowledgeable help to take and present outstanding photos along with other aspects of the business.   Dr. Arocha has always been one of these people. In my opinion,   He is an outstanding surgeon and one of the nicest, most genuine people you’ll ever meet.    But it’s obvious that he needs a little help from someone knowledgeable about taking and presenting optimal photos.   Once he does this, I’m sure we will truly be able to appreciate his outstanding results  which I’m sure includes this one. 

Regarding the number of grafts, 1800 is a relatively small number and even though the area to cover is small, I trust that the patient met the appropriate conditions for a densely packed hairline.     Perhaps Dr. Arocha or one of the staff can explain these conditions to address any concerns  

Best wishes,

Bill

Bill, 

Please see the updated images that were posted last Thursday, August 15. Dr. Arocha took the updated images with this Network in mind. The hair is pushed back and combed in these new photos. 

[Triple7]

I’m not trying to be a jerk or be disrespectful but this guy did not need a transplant in my opinion and his results look no different than the before pics. (Because he didn’t need one in the 1st place.) If the result makes him happy, then good for him and I am happy for him. 

[ArochaAngel4247]

On 8/22/2019 at 8:57 PM, Triple7 said:

I’m not trying to be a jerk or be disrespectful but this guy did not need a transplant in my opinion and his results look no different than the before pics. (Because he didn’t need one in the 1st place.) If the result makes him happy, then good for him and I am happy for him. 

Triple7,

This patient has significant diffuse thinning and regression of the frontal temple areas and hairline. He has coarse-caliber hair due to his ethnicity, and the hair is very straight - falling forward, so it obscures your visibility. We have provided additional views below so you can see the thinning in the frontal-third. As someone requested, we have also provided post-placement images to further show you the grafts he received. 

[Mycroft]

The temporal recession on the patient's left is pretty noticeable in the top down photo but, but the post op photos really help to confirm how much work was done on those corners/sides which definitely LOOKED thicker in the initial after photos. I just wasn't sure whether some of that had been a change in hair styling.

Is he thinning at the fringes towards the back at all? The top down makes me wonder a little with the hair combed back, but I could be imagining that.

[Anthonyd]

Im sorry,  but have you got the before and afters mixed up? because the before looks so much better!!

In the second picture, he actually does look like he has thinning of the hairline. Like other members have said this guy has hair that most guys would kill for, and the Dr should never of accepted  him as a patient. I am truly gob smacked, “significant diffuse thinning” are you serious? Well he has now. Sorry to be so brutal but what a complete waste of this guys money. As a senior member Bill and a very well respected one at that, I’m very surprised and disappointed in your comments, no matter how nice you think he is. This was a poor decision in my opinion to do this transplant, and wasted 1800 grafts that the guy might genuinely need, further on in life!

Rant over 😤

 

 

[Steeeve]

I have had a procedure performed by Dr Arocha so some of you may see this opinion as biased. It’s not biased, however, (well, maybe a little🙂) as I have made this argument at least twice with  posters about two other doctors with whom I have no association.

Not that it may matter to anyone but I see some very astute observations by some posters on the thread and others that leave me scratching my head wondering what you’re talking about...

I agree that the photos from the very first post should match up from the befores to the afters. They should 100% be more comparable from the get go. That’s the only thing I can agree with, though. I don’t have a problem seeing the difference between the photos...

I can personally see the difference from this,to this,to the final outcome.

That, to me, is a significant change. There was visible diffuse thinning throughout the front that doesn’t seem so visible anymore.

This,to that,is significant.

If you don’t agree or can’t see the difference that’s fine. Photos from any doctor can sometimes make it hard to tell. If the hairline is maybe not your personal taste in aesthetic...okay.

Anyone saying that the doctor should never have agreed to this case, that it was unethical, is making an assumption that the doctor didn’t do his due diligence and discuss family history and so on. He did and they did. It says so in the very first post that the patient decided to start taking propecia post-op.

My last point: Who is anyone here to say that a person shouldn’t try to achieve their goals more than another. The patient is dealing with his hair loss the same as everyone else here. It’s a deeply personal process that we all go through. He sought out a great doctor and decided to go forward with the procedure. It is no one’s place here or anywhere else to say how someone should deal with their own personal journey. What you see as insignificant loss he sees as extremely significant. Otherwise he wouldn’t be seeking the same treatment that everyone else here is seeking.

[Steeeve]

42 minutes ago, transplantedphil said:

Because it was a clinic posting, not a patient posting.

If it were a patient posting I'd be more empathetic and supportive, but as it was a clinic posting where a doctor operated on a patient who was not even taking meds at the time (it's conidered standard to do so for at least a year), and who most guys on this forum would strangle a few kittens just to have his pre-op hair, it is more than fair to question the doctor's approach/ethical stance. 

You speak of being empathetic and supportive as if this result went south. Like I said if you don’t agree with the aesthetic of the result that’s one thing. My opinion is that this is a solid result

Guys not being on fin prior to a transplant happens a lot. Half of the videos that Dr. José Lorenzo posts to YouTube show patients not having been on fin prior to the transplant and getting on it post-op. I don’t know how long you’ve been on the forum but I know you’ve posted your own results which you’re unhappy with so I’m assuming a while. Clinics post results on the forum where the patient wasn’t on fin often prior to and everything turns out fine.

I’m not saying that I disagree with what you’re saying. I think anyone considering a transplant should try fin for at least a year before going under the knife. I, personally, was on it for 7 years prior to my own transplant. I’m saying that the doctor made a judgement call based on his sit down with the patient prior to the procedure and it’s not on any of us laymen to question that. We’re not doctors. None of us are experts. Some have had transplants so are better versed but that doesn’t all of a sudden make us the be-all end-all; able to say a doctor whom we have no association with is unethical for a decision they made with another patient based on their experience with that patient.

I’m not trying to change your mind. You believe what you believe and that’s fine. As I said, I know you’ve had a procedure that you’re unhappy with. I’ve been following your thread and I truly wish you all the best. If I were in your shoes I would feel the same way and I really hope you get it sorted out.

All I’m saying is questioning the doctors ethics without knowing the full story of what they talked about in their sit down, which as far as I’m concerned is nobody’s business except the patient and the doctors, is pointless. 

Edited August 30, 2019 by Steeeve

[Steeeve]

On 8/30/2019 at 12:00 AM, transplantedphil said:

I believe this was an unnecessary procedure, not a "bad" one. Asking for an explanation from the doctor should be considered acceptable given he posted the result

Everyone initially posted on this thread asking for an explanation because nobody could figure out what was going on

My situation has nothing to do with these results, but thanks for your supportive words

I didn’t speak of your situation because I felt it had anything to do with these results. I spoke of it because I wanted you to know that I don’t think of you as nameless faceless internet person who’s opinion I don’t care about. It was also to point out that the longer you’ve been on this forum and the more research someone does the more they’ll come across cases like this.

I respect your opinion but ArochaAngel works for the doctor and has given plenty of explanation and shared all the pics everyone has asked for. Still people are basically calling it a “bad” result. It’s basically to the point where people are pointing and laughing like schoolyard children regardless of them having gotten their answers. 

As far as it being unnecessary, we’ll agree to disagree. I think that if this patient wants to improve his self-image and all the cards line up in his favor then it’s his money to spend and his grafts to use.

Edited August 31, 2019 by Steeeve

[Steeeve]

1 hour ago, transplantedphil said:

If this patient had posted on the forum first asking if he should get a HT you would be hard pressed to find anyone supporting them if they hadnt at least tried fin first. A quick search and I found 3 threads of guys with far worse hairloss and all are given the same advice; try medications first before considering a HT

https://www.hairrestorationnetwork.com/topic/54933-should-i-get-a-hairline-transplant/

https://www.hairrestorationnetwork.com/topic/54877-made-up-my-mind-and-want-ht-budget-friendly-turkey-seems-like-the-solution-but/?tab=comments#comment-516927

https://www.hairrestorationnetwork.com/topic/54669-do-i-need-a-transplant/?tab=comments#comment-514459

If the patient is happy .. awesome. But sadly I disagree with you and still question the doctor's choices here given the patient wears his hair down and has minimal hairloss. As I've spoken enough on the matter I guess it's ultimately up to other forum members to decide/comment upon.

You’re completely missing my point.

It’s okay that you disagree with me.

I agree with you, though. If this guy had come on the forum and asked everybody their thoughts I would’ve been right there beside you saying, “you should be on fin for at least a year. See how it works for you then give the HT a go”.

That being said, Dr Arocha is an excellent doctor and it is up to him and his patients only to decide, during their initial consultation, how to best proceed forward for the patient. As would be the case with any doctor anywhere doing any type of elected/non-elected procedure. Your argument of, “it’s ultimately up to other forum members to decide”, holds absolutely no weight as it is no one else’s place but the patient and the doctor to decide-that is the point I am trying to make.

I’m just saying it over and over again at this point.

No one here should tell me that I should or should not have a transplant. I wouldn’t have listened even if they had. Just as you didn’t listen when everybody told you that you should just move on or go back to the doctor who messed up your hair because he offered you a free touch up. It was your choice to make. No one else’s. I recall someone telling you that your result didn’t look that bad. Did you listen? You more than likely went and paid $10k or more to have it fixed as that was your choice. If anyone here questioned your choice of passing up free work you wouldn’t blink an eye as you very well shouldn’t not wanting to risk another failed transplant. That’s totally normal.

Just as you made your own choice about your own body It is no one’s place but the doctor and ultimately the patient to decide what they should do with theirs. Not you or anybody else on this forum. 

Especially since all is said and done.

Having sat down with this doctor personally and having had several conversations and consultations I can attest to him wanting what is best for his patients. Because every time I say, “I want coverage here”, he looks at me as an eventual Norwood 6 and says, “I think we should hold off on that and think about saving your grafts for another area.”

So you can question his ethics all you want but having no personal experience with him your questions fall flat as would any other member questioning any other doctor they have no personal experience with.

Edited August 30, 2019 by Steeeve

[Steeeve]

4 hours ago, transplantedphil said:

No I believe I understood your point, my argument would be that without a comprehensive explanation given by the doctor himself as to the surgical approach undertaken the rest of us are left scratching our heads. The results only leave the forum in a state of hypothesis and conjecture, and therein lies the problem. 

Here is a case by another doctor I admire who came on the forum and explained his “aggressive’ approach to a hairline restoration, and the forum was all the better for it. Keep in mind he used 1000 more grafts, covered far more ground and the differences are dramatic

https://www.hairrestorationnetwork.com/topic/50562-raymond-konior-md-chicago-hair-institute-2884-graft-hairline-restoration/

My point about letting other forum members continue the discussion was that based on the current photographic evidence nothing has changed my opinion, nor do I even find the case particularly interesting; IMO it was an unnecessary procedure. Given we have started discussing my case on this thread however I do not particularly want to respond here anymore (albeit I truly believe you were trying to offer me empathy). 

 

@transplantedphil, I pm’d you.