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Der3k7

Dr. Koray Erdogan 5000 grafts

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Whoa! You shouldn't! 

Most people here would kill for your hair, and looks. It's not a bad result in that sense - it's just that one would expect 5000 grafts to look more dense.

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12 hours ago, Der3k7 said:

Yeah my hair causes me anxiety and insecurity every day. I think about it every day throughout the day. Every time I'm in the bathroom, see a mirror or reflective surface 

Are you on finasteride?

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Posted (edited)
12 hours ago, Der3k7 said:

Yeah my hair causes me anxiety and insecurity every day. I think about it every day throughout the day. Every time I'm in the bathroom, see a mirror or reflective surface 

 

Edited by adonix

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I went in it for a year and started to experience some sexual sides and my first doctor cautioned me about it too so I stopped and then experienced post finasteride syndrome and my my dick was not functional at all for awhile no matter how hard I tried but eventually it got better. I will never use it again 

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9 hours ago, Der3k7 said:

I went in it for a year and started to experience some sexual sides and my first doctor cautioned me about it too so I stopped and then experienced post finasteride syndrome and my my dick was not functional at all for awhile no matter how hard I tried but eventually it got better. I will never use it again 

How long did it take for you to get better? I was on it for a few months and it took me at least 8 months to resolve.


I do not provide medical advice, recommendations, all responses are my opinion.

My Hair Transplant Journey

Melvin- Associate Publisher and Forum Moderator for the Hair Transplant Network, the Coalition Hair Loss Learning Center, and the Hair Loss Q&A Blog.

Follow our Social Media Instagram @thehairtransplantnetwork FacebookPintrest, Linkedin and YouTube.

 

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2 minutes ago, Melvin-Moderator said:

How long did it take for you to get better? I was on it for a few months and it took me at least 8 months to resolve.

From what I remember I gradually got better every month and I'm guessing it was about 6 months before I felt normal again or so 

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My libido has gone down. But to be honest I think it needed to. It now keeps me out of trouble.

derek: who are you communicating with in the clinic? I don’t really get very good answer except “it will get better” or “yes I agree comb your hair down” or “it will continue to improve” 


 

 

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Posted (edited)

I'm not sure his name actually but they might be more understanding because my result really is pretty crappy considering my starting point and the number of grafts they wasted on me. And look at this bad bald spot in the corner 

AAF0BDA2-29F5-4B33-8F14-A217FF15B402.jpeg

Edited by Der3k7

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On 10/7/2019 at 9:19 AM, Der3k7 said:

No they haven't but by offering the touch up it implies they agree. I told them I am turning the touch up down as I no longer have confidence in asmed also because there are too many poor reviews coming out online lately. I'm showing them before and after photos that make it extremely clear my yield is low and explaining to them that it is not fair to me given the 90% garuntee and that since I am refusing that they can fill my free touch up with a paying customer that will generate revenue for them and that given they have wasted so many of my grafts that I can never ever get back I think a partial refund is reasonable. Imagine going to a barber and getting a bad hair cut. They would offer a refund. Many companies offer refunds for poor service or products especially if they offer a garuntee. This should be no different. This is worse than just a bad haircut because I have permanent wasting of donor hairs that will directly hinder my ability to ever be satisfied by a hair transplant because of donor depletion by asmed with poor yield. They are reviewing my situation now and will get back to me this week 

I've never heard of a case of asmed giving a refund/partial refund to any of their customers. I've only seen them offer free touch ups and in one case offer a patient that had necrosis a free flight to see them and free long hair FUE. I hope you're the first

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11 hours ago, Kraistoff said:

My libido has gone down. But to be honest I think it needed to. It now keeps me out of trouble.

derek: who are you communicating with in the clinic? I don’t really get very good answer except “it will get better” or “yes I agree comb your hair down” or “it will continue to improve” 

How many months are you post op? When did they say your hair will improve until?

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Asmed response:

Hi Derek, 
we have been discussing your case thoroughly your case together with Dr Koray, his work partner Mrs Dilek, the medical team and my colleagues. In fact, we did this several times as we have been following closely the evolution of your transplant since the beginning. 
We analyzed your most recent photos and your file, your characteristics, the grafts distribution and the technical aspects of the surgery. Your operation, in fact, was not easy overall and comparing it to ideal condition is not correct, because every person and every situation is different. 
In your case the factors who made your situation leas than ideal are the following: 1) Your operation is a second surgery. On top of that, a big punch was used by Artas Machine, which extracted all the best, healthiest grafts located on the occipital part of your donor area. 2) Impossibility of using Finasteride, which would have positively affected both the quality and preservation of your native hair, the ones transplanted during your first surgery, those of the operation you had with us, and your donor. The lack of use of Finasteride was the main cause of the shock loss you have been experiencing in the first months after the operation. 3) Your hair diameter is 56 micron, which is thin. For example today we operated one patient who had a hair diameter of 76 microns, roughly 30% thicker than yours. An ideal patient who has such thickness and is using Finasteride would need significantly fewer grafts than yours to achieve an ideal coverage. Given all the factors describes above, and how the result you had differs from your expectations, we understand your dissatisfaction. But at the same time, we came to the conclusion that your result is not bad given all the factors described above. But again you should not compare your case to one of an ideal candidate. This said we are ready to help you anytime and we can arrange a new operation for you anytime completely free of charge in the hope to make you happier and help you achieve your expectations.

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To be fair, those points seem hard to refute, and somewhat makes sense. Especially the first one about the grafts available after artas.

However, these are all points that should have been made prior to surgery, not after. Except for the FIN one, i am guessing, none have been mentioned before?

I also didn't think 56 micron was that thin.. At least not to the extent that it would influence results in any meaningful way. Of course 76 is better than 56. That's a bit odd to mention.

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I don't completely agree with their conclusion that my thin hairs is the main reason for my lack of results. I still think it's because my yield is so low. You an clearly see when looking at the base of the hairs in my hairline that there is a lot of space between hairs where I had grafts transplanted. Meaning many did not survive. If I had a higher and appropriate yield then you would see more hairs per Sq cm exiting my scalp. But you an clearly see bald spots and too many spaces between hairs and my before and after is not consistent with a high yield 5000 graft surgery even with "thin" hairs. 

76480595-AD5C-48E9-8C11-4AED6F21439C.jpeg

D8611037-9A74-4ADE-AFE7-E2715253B66D.png

9E7D883A-55F6-42FE-B21D-7624B8D06612.jpeg

I will be very happy if my next surgeon can help strengthen this area I drew a line in quite a bit 

1877F6B9-2317-4108-8B31-003C761DB7AA.jpeg

00C64E05-7480-4019-90FA-02BD807F242A.png

Edited by Der3k7

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In my opinion, some of those points are valid. However, I think your hair caliber looks pretty good. Look coarse and thick, I believe hair caliber varies depending on the location. At the end of the day, you're not happy and satisfied with the results. So, the clinic has offered to make you happy, it's up to you to accept. That's how I look at it. There is not much that can be done at this point. 

I would warrant against going for a lot of grafts. Your hair looks decent, you don't want to waste most of your donor supply on the front, when you may need them in the future. Also, if it is true that your may have a compromised recipient zone, it would be better to test out a small number of grafts first to see how they grow. 


I do not provide medical advice, recommendations, all responses are my opinion.

My Hair Transplant Journey

Melvin- Associate Publisher and Forum Moderator for the Hair Transplant Network, the Coalition Hair Loss Learning Center, and the Hair Loss Q&A Blog.

Follow our Social Media Instagram @thehairtransplantnetwork FacebookPintrest, Linkedin and YouTube.

 

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Well I'm just gonna go with hasson and his suggestion of 1500-1800 late next year around November or December. I feel like even 1000 to reinforce my current hairline as long as the yield is good will have a good cosmetic improvement for me.

Edited by Der3k7
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Their point about you having thin hair and the lack of a DHT blocker to protect existing hairs is a valid one. This, unfortunately, drastically lowers the chance of a great result. This was a 5000 graft surgery however and the result should be better. You had 2600 grafts in the front alone..

 

strange though, your hair seems coarse, not thin

 

If you shine an intense light on your recipient area, can you see slight scarring with no hairs ? This is how I clearly see the areas that didn't grow 

Edited by jonnyalex

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43 minutes ago, Melvin-Moderator said:

So, the clinic has offered to make you happy, it's up to you to accept. That's how I look at it. There is not much that can be done at this point. 

 

I'm sure they intended to make him happy during the first surgery but failed to do so. The truth is, this forum, as well as others, have many patients who have been left feeling precisely the opposite. Just yesterday I seen yet another thread pop up here of a guy with a totally see through hairline. They didn't even offer to fix it and it's  worse than this guys! They said they want him to pay for 2500 more!!

 

Edited by jonnyalex

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1 hour ago, Der3k7 said:

Well I'm just gonna go with hasson and his suggestion of 1500-1800 late next year around November or December. I feel like even 1000 to reinforce my current hairline as long as the yield is good will have a good cosmetic improvement for me.

Just keep in mind even hasson and Wong can give a bad result. Just look up “Christopher” I think he now works there. 
in my opinion he had a bad result. Who ever that guy had either hasson or Wong , I would go with the one who did not do him!!

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Yeah but as long as I'm going to a clinic that is consistently rated the best then that's all I can do. Their reviews on Google are very impressive as well

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3 hours ago, Der3k7 said:

Asmed response:

Hi Derek, 
we have been discussing your case thoroughly your case together with Dr Koray, his work partner Mrs Dilek, the medical team and my colleagues. In fact, we did this several times as we have been following closely the evolution of your transplant since the beginning. 
We analyzed your most recent photos and your file, your characteristics, the grafts distribution and the technical aspects of the surgery. Your operation, in fact, was not easy overall and comparing it to ideal condition is not correct, because every person and every situation is different. 
In your case the factors who made your situation leas than ideal are the following: 1) Your operation is a second surgery. On top of that, a big punch was used by Artas Machine, which extracted all the best, healthiest grafts located on the occipital part of your donor area. 2) Impossibility of using Finasteride, which would have positively affected both the quality and preservation of your native hair, the ones transplanted during your first surgery, those of the operation you had with us, and your donor. The lack of use of Finasteride was the main cause of the shock loss you have been experiencing in the first months after the operation. 3) Your hair diameter is 56 micron, which is thin. For example today we operated one patient who had a hair diameter of 76 microns, roughly 30% thicker than yours. An ideal patient who has such thickness and is using Finasteride would need significantly fewer grafts than yours to achieve an ideal coverage. Given all the factors describes above, and how the result you had differs from your expectations, we understand your dissatisfaction. But at the same time, we came to the conclusion that your result is not bad given all the factors described above. But again you should not compare your case to one of an ideal candidate. This said we are ready to help you anytime and we can arrange a new operation for you anytime completely free of charge in the hope to make you happier and help you achieve your expectations.

I have to comment on this contribution because I do not support these statements. In my consultation with Dr.Koray he confirmed that my hair thickness of 57 micron is European average. It was not said that it is very thin. Although I have been taking Finasteride for several months he also said that the final result does not depend on it. Despite Finasteride I also suffered a shock lock in the first 3 months. Of course taking Finasteride should have a positive effect, but a good result should not only depend on it.

 


 

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Yeah I agree. Just trying to find whatever he can to cover himself. When I consulted with him as well he said I was an ideal candidate for him 

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Oh here are a few recent tats I got haha. Qtr sleeve coming in November 

32060248-8401-4BFC-AEAB-456E3D2DD219.jpeg

F619A5A5-B434-429D-AA81-8A291CC2D886.jpeg

34521162-7986-49C9-8196-724CAD73CD77.jpeg

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3 hours ago, jonnyalex said:

I'm sure they intended to make him happy during the first surgery but failed to do so. The truth is, this forum, as well as others, have many patients who have been left feeling precisely the opposite. Just yesterday I seen yet another thread pop up here of a guy with a totally see through hairline. They didn't even offer to fix it and it's  worse than this guys! They said they want him to pay for 2500 more!!

 

Are you a patient of ASMED? Do you have a thread? 


I do not provide medical advice, recommendations, all responses are my opinion.

My Hair Transplant Journey

Melvin- Associate Publisher and Forum Moderator for the Hair Transplant Network, the Coalition Hair Loss Learning Center, and the Hair Loss Q&A Blog.

Follow our Social Media Instagram @thehairtransplantnetwork FacebookPintrest, Linkedin and YouTube.

 

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14 hours ago, Melvin-Moderator said:

Are you a patient of ASMED? Do you have a thread? 

I had 4600 grafts in 2015, I can provide you photos if you wish via PM. Even if I wasn't,  I don't see the relevance. This forum was the sole reason I went there, the results being posted at the time were all good. In terms of my result, I was not satisfied with my hairline which shows scarring in the light, of areas which failed to grow (the hairline does not look good). The area behind was ok, but they used a massive amount in the crown which I've since heard was totally unneeded. My theory is they do this knowing some areas wont grow but can take credit for a good result either way (because something is likely to grow with that amount  of grafts  ). Nearly all top surgeons use about half the grafts for the same, if not much better results. 

I've since had another transplant in May inwhich the doctor stated how my donor area had been very aggressively harvested, leaving lower quality grafts for him to work with. This will negatively effect my results I'm sure. 

It is due to my own struggle with this that I feel for the people who went there and got a bad result. There are loads. To deny it is ridiculous at this point. I'm sick of getting attacked for pointing out which is blatantly obvious to see. 

 

I respect your work here alot but I believe your conversation with him regarding this was inadequate. He should be fully explaining what's going on here, offering refunds and not trying to sweet talk you with a visit to his clinic. 

He states he does not give refunds due to this being an admission that another surgeon could do better. This is interesting due to the fact that he is barely involved.

The fact is, I believe I could have avoided years of stress and anxiety had I just gone to a top surgeons who was actually properly involved in the procedure. It is therefore that I say he shouldn't be recommended here at all. 

You say you recommend surgeons not clinics, but this makes zero sense. Koray Erdogan is barely involved in the procedure so you are therefore recommending people go to see a surgeon who is barely there! It is young techs who do nearly everything. They couldn't possibly have much experience due to their age.

 

I was attacked on another thread by a guy who you seemingly allow you call people names. He stated how H&W operate the same way. From what I have read, the techs there, especially the lead techs have huge experience and they are always present, they do not run 9 surgeries a day and the surgeons are often present. The comparison is ludicrous.

 

He doesn't even supervise your surgery at all. Furthermore, they never contacted me even once to see how it was going. Completely uninterested.

Of course, this is my opinion and appreciate being able to say it freely, which is how any fair discussion forum should operate. 

 

Yes all surgeons have bad results but I'm sorry, not to this extent. What I have learnt is it is extremely important to get it right the first time, which is why I don't think a clinic who are constantly offering free touch ups to fix their disastrous work should be recommended here. Your donor cannot be refunded or replaced. 

 

I think its extremely bizarre that people think I'm needlessly slagging off a clinic. The evidence is overwhelming. 

 

Edited by jonnyalex
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