3038 Grafts FUE / ASMED - Koray Erdogan / 30th April

[Payam]

I never reached out to Rahal but I was considering his clinic initially. Ultimately I was set on FUE and preferred Erdogan for this on both price and results.

 

Im curious about this, how are you planning for the future? Even with finasteride there will be hair loss, what happens down the line if you need another transplant? I am considering body hair for the crown and top, and saving every last donor hair for the front hairline, what do you think?

[JayLDD]

Im curious about this, how are you planning for the future? Even with finasteride there will be hair loss, what happens down the line if you need another transplant? I am considering body hair for the crown and top, and saving every last donor hair for the front hairline, what do you think?

 

For the moment my hair doesn't seem to have got worse since I started finasteride, I probably have another 1500 grafts left via FUE, the option of BHT for the midscalp and crown or FUT if absolutely necessary. The majority of the balding area has been covered at this point, the frontal third almost entirely transplanted. Concealer always an option in the case that the untouched midscalp began to go. As long as the current transplant goes well I have very little worries about the future, the current situation even before the new one has grown is quite good.

 

You can't use entirely body hair for the midscalp and crown as it won't look natural, typically a ratio of 1/3rd is the maximum I'd allow if you were to do so.

 

Also the "even with finasteride there will be hairloss" isn't all that true, the vast majority will maintain on it for up to a decade (probably more but the studies don't go beyond this) and is likely to give more than enough time to opt for the trasnplant route and have acceptable hair in your youth. If I had some more visible thinning in the crown by the time I was 35 it wouldn't be half the issue as it is at 23.

[Payam]

For the moment my hair doesn't seem to have got worse since I started finasteride, I probably have another 1500 grafts left via FUE, the option of BHT for the midscalp and crown or FUT if absolutely necessary. The majority of the balding area has been covered at this point, the frontal third almost entirely transplanted. Concealer always an option in the case that the untouched midscalp began to go. As long as the current transplant goes well I have very little worries about the future, the current situation even before the new one has grown is quite good.

 

You can't use entirely body hair for the midscalp and crown as it won't look natural, typically a ratio of 1/3rd is the maximum I'd allow if you were to do so.

 

Also the "even with finasteride there will be hairloss" isn't all that true, the vast majority will maintain on it for up to a decade (probably more but the studies don't go beyond this) and is likely to give more than enough time to opt for the trasnplant route and have acceptable hair in your youth. If I had some more visible thinning in the crown by the time I was 35 it wouldn't be half the issue as it is at 23.

 

I hope you are right about finasteride, just worried about my 40's because im positive i will care as much as i do now, if not more. I know this because when i was in my 20's i thought i wouldnt give a shit about my hair in my thirities, boy was i wrong. Wish i had gotten on fin 10 years ago but i didnt know of it back then. I have not seen any cases where they mixed body hair + donor, do you know of any?

[JayLDD]

I hope you are right about finasteride, just worried about my 40's because im positive i will care as much as i do now, if not more. I know this because when i was in my 20's i thought i wouldnt give a shit about my hair in my thirities, boy was i wrong. Wish i had gotten on fin 10 years ago but i didnt know of it back then. I have not seen any cases where they mixed body hair + donor, do you know of any?

 

Bhatti, Lorenzo and Umar have all opted for this approach on occasion. Understand the point of caring into your 30s, but the reality is that some hair is better than no hair. Running out of donor with a strong frontal third and thin coverage in the crown and midscalp is better than living a decade slick bald. Just dealing the best with a shit hand. Not that I expect to lose all my natives for a long while based on the data on fin and my current experience anyway.

[JayLDD]

1 month

[bman3082]

Was turned down by HnW but wasn't on medication at the time. A few points on FUT, first and foremost the reality and you can see it on these forums on a daily basis is that at least 1/10 even with top surgeons if not more have an unnaceptable level of scarring via FUT or issues such as shock loss around the scar that renders more damage to the donor than FUE would have. The option of SMP into the scar for a bad FUT scar is far less effective in general from what I've seen than FUE scars from what I've seen. Also issues with distortion in the donor of growth angles and differing hair textures at the meeting point of the scar.

 

Also strongly disagree that you are going to get measurably more grafts via an FUT and then FUE approach. First of all FUE post FUT typically avoids a large area around the scar so total donor utilisation is drastically reduced anyway, I also haven't seen a good argument for why FUT could not successfully be performed after an FUE that doesn't edge into conjecture or pseudo-science. There's no reason I couldn't opt for FUT in my current situation if necessary down the track, although I'd be unlikely to due to potential risks I see with FUT.

 

Most importantly I didn't feel any surgeon (at a reasonable price) was getting yields at the level or above in regards to consistency above Erdogan or Lorenzo whether it be FUE or FUT. Consistently I also see Erdogan and Lorenzo reach the 6-7000 level in graft numbers without any visible damage to the donor beyond a few weeks growth, I cannot say the same for FUT in which conversely I consistently see ruined donors due to shock loss or bad scarring in single procedures at the 3000 graft level or below. When FUE is regularly reaching 5000-7000 grafts with no issues in Erdogan and Lorenzo procedures I question why you'd opt for FUT to maximise graft numbers; how many patients out there are hitting the 6-7000 graft point to begin with across their entire lifetime? How many go through their entire donor via FUE and FUT? Virtually none, FUE can typically achieve as many grafts as most patients will realistically ever want.

 

Over time I do feel that in regards to risk FUE is simply the better procedure for most people, and that various surgeons are overcoming the physical limitations and drawbacks of the procedure to achieve yields and aesthetic results at the level of any who perform FUT. Helps that I have a stronger than average donor but I feel that the vast majority can have their long term needs met via FUE.

 

For my case needing what I thought originally to be around 5500-6000 grafts to cover a more aggressive hairline like I have after the second procedure and the also the crown the price also was a consideration. Unless you're living with %$#@ you money I think it's hard to justify prices of any US or Canadian FUE clinics over Erdogan for those graft numbers. There are fantastic FUE hairline surgeons like Baubac and Konior in the States but I don't see those prices as remotely sensible when you're looking over the 1500-2000 graft mark and likely to need more than one surgery. Price aside for the graft numbers I was looking at I'm not confident there would have been better choice than Erdogan, Lorenzo and a few others would have been good options too. Freitas, Couto, Baubac and Konior are the only surgeons I would have maybe considered over Erdogan if waiting lists and cost weren't an issue.

 

If you're keen on FUT and in Ottawa Rahal would definitely be at the top of my list.

 

My email is jeanlucbergman1@yahoo.com

 

Hey okay so I'm going to have to disagree with you about FUE yielding the same as FUT. I agree that Couto is literally the HT GOD but the waiting list is crazy. I am on it now so once that opens up I will most definitely be getting an FUE with him on top of an initial FUT. Having said that, even on his website literally called FUEexpert, he states that for the most advanced cases and to attain the most amount of grafts then FUT will be used, but only for those situations. Since I am most definitely trying to maximize my grafts, it seems like a no brainer for me. Yield rates are consistently higher time and time again for FUT save for Erdogan and Couto so of course you will be fine either way. In terms of hairs growing weird around the scar for FUT, if you go to an amazing doc the scar will be pencil thin and hairs will grow normal. FUE has been cited to cause far more trauma to the scalp and thus far more chance of damage to adjacent follicles. That is not to say FUE cannot yield good results, but for total graft maximization, FUT is the way to go hands down. Emailed you

[bman3082]

1 month

 

Looks real nice so far!

[manwithaplan]

Hey man, had to see your results so far after your comment on my recent post.

 

Looks great, looking forward to seeing your progress.

[LonelyGraft]

I know u may be a bit biased bc ur surgeon was erdogan and ur results r quite good but if u just needed hairline work, lived in the US, and money did not matter would u go with erdogan or Nadimi?

[JayLDD]

I know u may be a bit biased bc ur surgeon was erdogan and ur results r quite good but if u just needed hairline work, lived in the US, and money did not matter would u go with erdogan or Nadimi?

 

In that case I'd probably go to Baubac or just wait the 12 months for Konior. From my starting situation Konior or Naidimi I suspect wouldn't have performed an FUE especially at my age anyway. They tend to work on much smaller FUE cases. I'd prefer Erdogan over Nadimi price aside, one can assume she is of a high standard because she works with and was trained by Konior but the reality is there are none of her results to look at online, I wouldn't go to a surgeon that doesn't have at least a hundred to look at and plenty of patient posted. Just from her few post-ops they look quite conservative in terms of density also.

 

For me personally (and everyone's in a different situation) the extra cost of surgery for Konior or Baubac compared to Erdogan is a waste of money unless you have good reason to expect you're not going to lose more hair and only need 1500 - 2000 grafts.

 

Also we will see how I feel after the result of my second surgery, very happy up to now but obviously can't be completely conclusive at this point.

[LonelyGraft]

In that case I'd probably go to Baubac or just wait the 12 months for Konior. From my starting situation Konior or Naidimi I suspect wouldn't have performed an FUE especially at my age anyway. They tend to work on much smaller FUE cases. I'd prefer Erdogan over Nadimi price aside, one can assume she is of a high standard because she works with and was trained by Konior but the reality is there are none of her results to look at online, I wouldn't go to a surgeon that doesn't have at least a hundred to look at and plenty of patient posted. Just from her few post-ops they look quite conservative in terms of density also.

 

For me personally (and everyone's in a different situation) the extra cost of surgery for Konior or Baubac compared to Erdogan is a waste of money unless you have good reason to expect you're not going to lose more hair and only need 1500 - 2000 grafts.

 

Also we will see how I feel after the result of my second surgery, very happy up to now but obviously can't be completely conclusive at this point.

 

Good input. I've seen some good results from baubac but I feel like he barely has any published results? What makes u think so highly of baubac? Hairline design?

[JayLDD]

Good input. I've seen some good results from baubac but I feel like he barely has any published results? What makes u think so highly of baubac? Hairline design?

 

Hairline design, density, naturalness, also seems very consistent in the sense I haven't seen any results with poor growth.

 

None of his work on this site but quite a few on some of the others and those posted by patients look excellent.

[kramer79]

Do you find finasteride helped grown any hair back in your crown? or it has just maintained what you had?

 

If it just maintained it, did you ever consider upping the dose in order to potentially strenghten the crown?

[JayLDD]

Do you find finasteride helped grown any hair back in your crown? or it has just maintained what you had?

 

If it just maintained it, did you ever consider upping the dose in order to potentially strenghten the crown?

 

Definite improvement in the crown in the first 4 months mainly. Beyond that just maintenance. At this stage I don't see myself ever upping the doseage. Even if I started to slip back I'd probably just let it happen and go down the transplant route at the point where length couldn't give the illusion of density any more.

[JayLDD]

At about 3.5 months now, sprouts just starting to appear and in a similar fashion to last time. A couple of gappy bits in the original hairline caused by accidental buzzing it when trying to get the recipient area even and remove a few of the lengthy strays that didn't fall out originally.  Crown looks quite good, I can't notice any growth but somehow maybe it looks better than it did 6 months ago even. 

 

 

 

 

The photos in brighter sunlight are from the first runthrough at roughly 7 months, I've added them because it really shows how the texture changes beyond that point even when most of the growth is done, the initial plugginess gone in the ones from today and the redness directly where the follicle protrudes through the skin too.

 

[Melvin- Admin]

You got some early growth already, should be a really good result. Please keep us updated on your progress. 

[Gasthoerer]

It is supposed to be the best time now (cause it will get better from here on), but I am also at 3.5 month and actually it is the worst time. You know it should happen right now and you look in the mirror like "where is the f....ing growth". I wish you the best.  

By the way: Your donor pic looks like you want to hide a strip scar ;-)

[razzy]

Excellent pictures Jean! This second HT will have you set for a very long time.. if not forever. Looking forward to seeing your final result.

[JayLDD]

Week after 4 months

I've been buzzing it down as of yet just because it looked odd with the uneven growth. Going to let it grow from now. Areas closer to the temples seem to be growing much faster than the middle. Some of the hairs I can see in the mirror seem to be too fine to come up on the camera yet.

 

 

 

[JayLDD]

4.5 months. Still new sprouts every day 

[Gasthoerer]

Looks like nice progress in the last two weeks!

[VicTNYC]

Very nice! ?

[JayLDD]

Baby hairs growin

[LonelyGraft]

Does asmed have specific post op instructions for when and how u can cut ur hair? I know Lorenzo recommends not using electric clippers on the recipient hair for the first 5 months

[bman3082]

4 hours ago, jj51702 said:

Does asmed have specific post op instructions for when and how u can cut ur hair? I know Lorenzo recommends not using electric clippers on the recipient hair for the first 5 months

What’s the reason for that? My doc says ur fine after a few weeks