Jump to content
Payam

3600 Grafts - Dr Koray Erdogan 13th March 2018

Recommended Posts

3 hours ago, Gasthoerer said:

I know the waiting game is hard, but isn't it a little early to discuss lawsuits and all?

a) Erdogan has top notch results, foreigners or not, in this very forum and on many other forums

b) Every clinic has bad results (and we do not even know if this is going to be a bad result)

c) If I remember right, there is a Konior case in here with exactly the same crusts and gaps after a couple of days like discussed at page 1

d) Day 0 pics look good in my opinion.

Just wait 2 more month and then start to worry. There is nothing you can do now anyway. And the same for some other users: Please do not make the poor guy crazy when he is the most vulnerable.

Please do not make the poor guy crazy when he is the most vulnerable.

Judging by OPs posts directly after surgery (and consistently) crazy was probably an issue well before this thread was posted...

 

Basic things like OP reporting his 4 month results over a week before his actual 4 month mark clearly show he's happy to be dishonest in the name of complaining too. Taking antibiotics for mild  follicilitis, calling for electrolysis on the hairline a week out from surgery, complaining that the shampoo he was given was garbage, randomly getting off finasteride and then complaining about a shed as if its somehow the surgeons fault. Nightmare patient. 

  • Like 1
  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, JeanLDD said:

Please do not make the poor guy crazy when he is the most vulnerable.

Judging by OPs posts directly after surgery (and consistently) crazy was probably an issue well before this thread was posted...

 

Basic things like OP reporting his 4 month results over a week before his actual 4 month mark clearly show he's happy to be dishonest in the name of complaining too. Taking antibiotics for mild  follicilitis, calling for electrolysis on the hairline a week out from surgery, complaining that the shampoo he was given was garbage, randomly getting off finasteride and then complaining about a shed as if its somehow the surgeons fault. Nightmare patient. 

Really saddening post by you JeanDD. My 4 month was reported 3 days before the mark, I have updated the thread with more pictures since then.

I complained about the post operative cleaning, not the shampoo, I.e the cleaning of the scalp after the incisions + the first wash by the clinic.

I did not complain about shedding nor did I blame the clinic, I merely reported on it. Hope that answers your questions.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Payam ,listen! everyone handles the post op wait for results in  their own way ,,most guys although a difficult time for them are able to deal with it ,unfortunately some patients for whatever reason find it all too much and you are one of them .

 In my opinion no one can advise whether it's a success or failure    at this point because you are just going into the growth phase and you have to be patient for  another  2-3 months ,if then you have subpar growth I for one  will want to hear what the clinic has to say ,just stay calm as other posters have pointed out stress is not doing your overall health any good .

Edited by Mick50

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
52 minutes ago, Payam said:

Really saddening post by you JeanDD. My 4 month was reported 3 days before the mark, I have updated the thread with more pictures since then.

I complained about the post operative cleaning, not the shampoo, I.e the cleaning of the scalp after the incisions + the first wash by the clinic.

I did not complain about shedding nor did I blame the clinic, I merely reported on it. Hope that answers your questions.

Nope, you said you had your procedure on the 13th and reported your 4 month on the 5th.  It's not a big deal but seeing as you double down its clearly dishonest, that's a week not 3 days. 

And another fib 

"I did not complain about shedding nor did I blame the clinic, I merely reported on it."

Yet you said this:

"t looks like its mostly shedding aaround the transplanted areas as erdogan put hairs into my native hairline and not just the balding areas. Could this be some kind of late shock loss? "

If the result looked like this at 6 months you'd have something to be edgy about, at this point you're just coming across as a silly human looking to complain for no reason.

Complaining that they work on multiple procedures at once and techs do extractions again looks bad on you not the clinic, this basic information was available to you everywhere you looked so you can hardly criticise the clinic when you made the choice. It's standard procedure among top surgeons such as Lorenzo and Feriduni also. If you think Konior was a better option, then that's fine but don't pretend they're not 3 times the price or act like you aren't responsible for your decisions.

You don't have to start a fight with every comment. I can promise you that you'll lose those fight when every criticism you make is baseless. People want you to have a good result but acting like a child (seriously, act like an adult) doesn't help anyone.

Edited by JeanLDD

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry for being 

22 minutes ago, JeanLDD said:

Nope, you said you had your procedure on the 13th and reported your 4 month on the 5th.  It's not a big deal but seeing as you double down its clearly dishonest, that's a week not 3 days. 

And another fib 

"I did not complain about shedding nor did I blame the clinic, I merely reported on it."

Yet you said this:

"t looks like its mostly shedding aaround the transplanted areas as erdogan put hairs into my native hairline and not just the balding areas. Could this be some kind of late shock loss? "

If the result looked like this at 6 months you'd have something to be edgy about, at this point you're just coming across as a silly human looking to complain for no reason.

Complaining that they work on multiple procedures at once and techs do extractions again looks bad on you not the clinic, this basic information was available to you everywhere you looked so you can hardly criticise the clinic when you made the choice. It's standard procedure among top surgeons such as Lorenzo and Feriduni also. If you think Konior was a better option, then that's fine but don't pretend they're not 3 times the price or act like you aren't responsible for your decisions.

You don't have to start a fight with every comment. I can promise you that you'll lose those fight when every criticism you make is baseless. People want you to have a good result but acting like a child (seriously, act like an adult) doesn't help anyone.

You are right about the first two points, and I didn't mean for it to come off as me blaming the clinic for the shock loss, just stated what happened. Also I explicitly stated Konoir cost more in my post.

I know I am coming of as neurotic, I am absolutely panicking and have very high anxiety over this, it is starting to impact my personal life. You are all right, I will hold out until the sixth month mark

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

By the way:

Under this link you will find a Konior result (FUT) with similiar (actually worse) cracks. Konior said this is normal too. This was not the case I was looking for, but it seems it is really common. Intermediate result looks great despite much worse crusts then the OP had.

 

Edited by Gasthoerer

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Payam said:

Sorry for being 

You are right about the first two points, and I didn't mean for it to come off as me blaming the clinic for the shock loss, just stated what happened. Also I explicitly stated Konoir cost more in my post.

I know I am coming of as neurotic, I am absolutely panicking and have very high anxiety over this, it is starting to impact my personal life. You are all right, I will hold out until the sixth month mark

At this point there is no reason to worry and you're still at least a month and a half away from making informed judgements about results, but no matter what the clinic is there is nothing anyone can do to help until the 12-18 month mark so the complaints don't help anyone. Most ethical clinics will be help unhappy patients so its very unhelpful to trash them or blame prior to giving them the benefit of the doubt until that point.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Gasthoerer said:

By the way:

Under this link you will find a Konior result (FUT) with similiar (actually worse) cracks. Konior said this is normal too. This was not the case I was looking for, but it seems it is really common. Intermediate result looks great despite much worse crusts then the OP had.

 

Thanks for the link mate, I'm nearing 4.5 months and am nowhere near where he was though, i would be very happy if i was..

Edited by Payam

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, wheretogo said:

Hey Payam,

do you take any kind of meds, pills or minoxi, in your post op regime?

Only biotin and finasteride, otherwise very healthy, don't smoke, drink moderately and only beer at that

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Payam,

You seem to be highly concerned about what’s 100% perfectly normal. I’m not sure if you just don’t understand the process and how it works or if you are just very easily upset and worried but you really need to be calm. Your photos look exactly the way they should. The scabbing and  crusting that you see is perfectly normal. Yes, some of the grafts Will appear to cluster in what appears to be islands but that’s not how your hair will look when it grows. You need to have some faith. You selected an outstanding surgeon and he has been producing superior results for a long time. I encourage you to have faith and trust.

 You need to also understand that  hair transplant growth doesn’t typically start for 3 to 5 months and even then, it’s only the very beginning. It takes up to a year to 18 months for hair transplant to fully mature and grow. 

 Try to hang in there, if you would like to talk, perhaps we can schedule time to chat on the phone.   Send me a private message if you want to set that up. 

Bill


I am the managing publisher of the Hair Transplant Network, the Hair Loss Learning Center, the Hair Loss Q&A Blog and this Hair Loss Forum. I am also a 4 time hair transplant patient. View my patient hair loss website to view my entire hair restoration journey with photos.

Remember, true beauty radiates from within, not from the skin.

I am not a medical professional and my words should not be taken as medical advice. All opinions and views shared are my own.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Payam,

 I received your report however, I genuinely believe that all of our members are trying to help you.   Looking through your posts, I’ll be honest… It makes me scratch my head and wonder why you’re concerned and upset. I’m sure that’s why some of our members are getting impatient because they are trying to tell you that everything is fine and normal and you continue to express more and more concerns that aren’t even issues. 

 Like I said, my advice is to relax. You are only four months postop. Do you understand that a lot of people have not even experienced any signs of growth at that stage? If you’re seeing any signs of growth that for months, then you are ahead of the game. Typically growth starts between three and five months so  i’d say you are right on schedule. 

I just hope you’re not the kind of patient that over scrutinizes every little thing and even when other people see how wonderful your results are, you don’t like it and think it’s a failure. I’m worried that this is what’s going to happen with you based on the fact that you’re so concerned over things that are perfectly normal.

My invitation to speak on the phone still stands if you wish. 

Bill

  • Like 1

I am the managing publisher of the Hair Transplant Network, the Hair Loss Learning Center, the Hair Loss Q&A Blog and this Hair Loss Forum. I am also a 4 time hair transplant patient. View my patient hair loss website to view my entire hair restoration journey with photos.

Remember, true beauty radiates from within, not from the skin.

I am not a medical professional and my words should not be taken as medical advice. All opinions and views shared are my own.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bill,

i read something in some thread that kinda freaked me out about growth, that all the grafts should come out during the first six months.

is this true?. what about slow growers?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Payam,

I have read the thread and honestly you’ve been given good advice. Although, some members can come off harsh, the truth is at 4.5 months it is waaaaaay to early to call a procedure a failure. The hairs are just beginning to sprout and most of them are thin and colorless. Think of this process as reverse balding, when you go bald the hairs miniaturize slowly and become thinner and thinner until they disappear. Well it’s exactly the same but in reverse. Unfortunately, hair restoration is a process of shedding, growth and maturation and some results don’t fully blossom until 18 months. Stay calm and try not and focus on your current state, track your progress by month not by day. 

Warmest regards- Melvin

  • Like 2

I do not provide medical advice, recommendations, all responses are my opinion.

My Hair Transplant Journey

Melvin- Editorial Assistant and Forum Co-Moderator for the Hair Transplant Network, the Coalition Hair Loss Learning Center, and the Hair Loss Q&A Blog.

Follow our Social Media Instagram @thehairtransplantnetwork FacebookPintrest, Linkedin and YouTube.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 7/19/2018 at 4:39 PM, Bill - Managing Publisher said:

Payam,

 I received your report however, I genuinely believe that all of our members are trying to help you.   Looking through your posts, I’ll be honest… It makes me scratch my head and wonder why you’re concerned and upset. I’m sure that’s why some of our members are getting impatient because they are trying to tell you that everything is fine and normal and you continue to express more and more concerns that aren’t even issues. 

 Like I said, my advice is to relax. You are only four months postop. Do you understand that a lot of people have not even experienced any signs of growth at that stage? If you’re seeing any signs of growth that for months, then you are ahead of the game. Typically growth starts between three and five months so  i’d say you are right on schedule. 

I just hope you’re not the kind of patient that over scrutinizes every little thing and even when other people see how wonderful your results are, you don’t like it and think it’s a failure. I’m worried that this is what’s going to happen with you based on the fact that you’re so concerned over things that are perfectly normal.

My invitation to speak on the phone still stands if you wish. 

Bill

I really appreciate the offer, thank you! I am realistic in my expectations however the growth I have seen is not on par with what I had expected based on the multitude of progress reports I have read. I realize everyone is different physiologically and will wait until the sixth month mark like most members have recommended to make an informed assesment, and keep updating my thread with progress every couple of weeks.

Thank you again all for the support and kindness shown here during these stressful times 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 7/19/2018 at 6:34 PM, Melvin-Moderator said:

Payam,

I have read the thread and honestly you’ve been given good advice. Although, some members can come off harsh, the truth is at 4.5 months it is waaaaaay to early to call a procedure a failure. The hairs are just beginning to sprout and most of them are thin and colorless. Think of this process as reverse balding, when you go bald the hairs miniaturize slowly and become thinner and thinner until they disappear. Well it’s exactly the same but in reverse. Unfortunately, hair restoration is a process of shedding, growth and maturation and some results don’t fully blossom until 18 months. Stay calm and try not and focus on your current state, track your progress by month not by day. 

Warmest regards- Melvin

I realize this, every source ive read states that the majority of new sprouts occurs in the first six months though, so realistically as others have stated I should be able to make an informed assesment at the six month mark, correct? As of month 4.5 there is very little happening behind the front hairline.

Edited by Payam

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 7/19/2018 at 1:28 AM, Gasthoerer said:

I know the waiting game is hard, but isn't it a little early to discuss lawsuits and all?

a) Erdogan has top notch results, foreigners or not, in this very forum and on many other forums

b) Every clinic has bad results (and we do not even know if this is going to be a bad result)

c) If I remember right, there is a Konior case in here with exactly the same crusts and gaps after a couple of days like discussed at page 1

d) Day 0 pics look good in my opinion.

Just wait 2 more month and then start to worry. There is nothing you can do now anyway. And the same for some other users: Please do not make the poor guy crazy when he is the most vulnerable.

I think the progress is as expected, he will definitely have good results. My point is the experience that he had in the clinic has boosted his anxiety levels. When you travel on airplane to another country and spend big money (relatively) for the procedure you expect more attention from this big shot doctor. You expect the doctor to involve his hands on the work more. I don’t trust young technicians regardless of the clinic big name. Please read patient’s words carefully to understand where his worries are coming from. Every one is focusing on results and forget the experience. Dr. Koray should take care of this in future.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Payam said:

I realize this, every source ive read states that the majority of new sprouts occurs in the first six months though, so realistically as others have stated I should be able to make an informed assesment at the six month mark, correct? As of month 4.5 there is very little happening behind the front hairline.

Where are you reading this? Hair begins to sprout around 3-4 months that is the very beginning of hair growth, around 6 months more growth occurs, but it is not the end of hair growth. In fact, some cases may take up to 18 months to fully grow. Everyone is different and growth rates are not the same for every person. You have hair growth at 4 months this is a positive sign. Unfortunately, it’s a waiting game there is nothing else to do but to wait. Try and focus on other things besides your hair, by the time you know it you will look significantly better. 

Warm regards- Melvin 


I do not provide medical advice, recommendations, all responses are my opinion.

My Hair Transplant Journey

Melvin- Editorial Assistant and Forum Co-Moderator for the Hair Transplant Network, the Coalition Hair Loss Learning Center, and the Hair Loss Q&A Blog.

Follow our Social Media Instagram @thehairtransplantnetwork FacebookPintrest, Linkedin and YouTube.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, 2941grafts said:

I think the progress is as expected, he will definitely have good results. My point is the experience that he had in the clinic has boosted his anxiety levels. When you travel on airplane to another country and spend big money (relatively) for the procedure you expect more attention from this big shot doctor. You expect the doctor to involve his hands on the work more. I don’t trust young technicians regardless of the clinic big name. Please read patient’s words carefully to understand where his worries are coming from. Every one is focusing on results and forget the experience. Dr. Koray should take care of this in future.

This doctor has a huge record of excellent work. Age is not an indicator of skill level, very ageist thing to say tbh.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Also OP can you post some pics of your crown as everyone says its a bad idea to get grafts there if you have full coverage but low density. You risk permanent shock loss on the crown and end up replacing the shock lost roots with transplanted hairs so it ends up looking pretty much the same. 

You should be on fin, minox and dermarolling to combat this anyway

Edited by HairGone29

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, 2941grafts said:

I think the progress is as expected, he will definitely have good results. My point is the experience that he had in the clinic has boosted his anxiety levels. When you travel on airplane to another country and spend big money (relatively) for the procedure you expect more attention from this big shot doctor. You expect the doctor to involve his hands on the work more. I don’t trust young technicians regardless of the clinic big name. Please read patient’s words carefully to understand where his worries are coming from. Every one is focusing on results and forget the experience. Dr. Koray should take care of this in future.

You genuinely sound like a shill from a rival clinic trying to trash them, your comments are that bad and disingenuous.

 

"When you travel on airplane to another country and spend big money (relatively) for the procedure you expect more attention from this big shot doctor. You expect the doctor to involve his hands on the work more."

They're a third of the price of typical US FUE rates, and not all US surgeons including some top names like Diep (more than triple the price) do extractions either. Lorenzo and Feriduni who no one would suggest aren't at the top level for FUE aren't involved in the extractions or implantations for example also.  You and OP keep talking about the money you're paying and that he should have chosen someone like Konior (who is three times the price) , the reality is that if you think ASMED is expensive he could have under no circumstances afforded Konior to begin with. If you want a more tailored approach then pay triple the price for Konior like you say you would have preferred, but don't act like you weren't aware Erdogan doesn't do extractions or implantations or that it wouldn't have indeed cost you three times as much.

"I don’t trust young technicians regardless of the clinic big name."

Do you actually know what happens during a hair transplant or the skills required specifically in extractions and implantations? This is as blatantly moronic as saying that you don't trust world cup soccer players because they aren't in their forties or fifties. The skills required for hair transplant extractions or implantations don't relate to age and they don't require a medical degree. 

"Please read patient’s words carefully to understand where his worries are coming from."

His worries are coming from himself because up to this point nothing he has said is atypical or shows a lack of care from the clinic. It's complaining and worrying for the sake of it, he even lied when posting his "4 month photos" by doing so over a week before the actual date, and then denied this despite the dates being clearly there for anyone to see in the thread. He could have spent three times the price for Konior and I guarantee you he'd still be complaining.

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Melvin-Moderator said:

Where are you reading this? Hair begins to sprout around 3-4 months that is the very beginning of hair growth, around 6 months more growth occurs, but it is not the end of hair growth. In fact, some cases may take up to 18 months to fully grow. Everyone is different and growth rates are not the same for every person. You have hair growth at 4 months this is a positive sign. Unfortunately, it’s a waiting game there is nothing else to do but to wait. Try and focus on other things besides your hair, by the time you know it you will look significantly better. 

Warm regards- Melvin 

So, it's not true that all the grafts should sprout until 6 months? and after six months the hair only get thicker and mature?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, 2941grafts said:

Please read patient’s words carefully to understand where his worries are coming from.

That is a little unfair. The OP was afraid due to the "crust and islands" he had and asked if that is a mistake of the clinic. He also believed that would not have happend with a "do all be the surgeon" approach" like Konior.

I gave him an example of a Konior (FUT) case which much worse (!) crusts and islands but very good results. If that doesn't help to calm down, what will help him? I cannot change his experience at ASMED.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, JeanLDD said:

  You and OP keep talking about the money you're paying and that he should have chosen someone like Konior (who is three times the price) , the reality is that if you think ASMED is expensive he could have under no circumstances afforded Konior to begin with.

Personally I believe that one important point is missed: This is a big case not a small hairline fine tuning. Clinics like Konior, Keser, Heißtmann, Lupanzula etc. cannot do such a big case in a single day. Most would even require several session over month/years. There is also an advantage in using techs especially for such a huge case.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×