Regular Member partnerfue Posted December 11, 2015 Regular Member Share Posted December 11, 2015 I'm writing on behalf of my husband since he does not necessarily agree with me. He just had about 3000 grafts by FUE by a reputable surgeon on this forum. On the flight back we were discussing how I didn't feel like it looked like 3000 little scars/scabs. So when we got home I did the VERY tedious process of counting.....twice. There are only approximately 1500 little marks. He justified it by saying they might put multiple grafts in each cut. Is this true? Is it possible he was ripped off since he was charged by the graft? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member leftygolfer71 Posted December 11, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted December 11, 2015 (edited) I'm writing on behalf of my husband since he does not necessarily agree with me. He just had about 3000 grafts by FUE by a reputable surgeon on this forum. On the flight back we were discussing how I didn't feel like it looked like 3000 little scars/scabs. So when we got home I did the VERY tedious process of counting.....twice. There are only approximately 1500 little marks. He justified it by saying they might put multiple grafts in each cut. Is this true? Is it possible he was ripped off since he was charged by the graft? Your husband is correct. 3000 Grafts do not = 3000 incisions. The Dr. should have given him a break down of the hairs per graft. Edited December 11, 2015 by leftygolfer71 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member partnerfue Posted December 11, 2015 Author Regular Member Share Posted December 11, 2015 He did get a breakdown. There were mostly doubles so even though there were 3000 grafts, there were about 8000 hairs transplanted overall. So with this in mind I understand multiple hairs (each on the same graft) are placed into each incision. However, are multiple grafts placed in each incision? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Wwiizzkkiidd24 Posted December 11, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted December 11, 2015 Yeah your husband could be right usually how it works is you have 1 haired grafts at the front and then 2s 3s 4s and 5 if not more family grafts going back into the crown area. you can't just gauge on just counting the grafts you need a proper examination done by magnifying glass as it where. and I don't mean the one where you use for reading small printed words haha. hope this helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member leftygolfer71 Posted December 11, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted December 11, 2015 So your husband actually SAT still while you counted the incisions TWICE? :-) Who was the Dr.? If he's recommended here and I would assumme you read results of other patients I wouldn't worry. Best thing to do is post a pic, blur out his face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member esrec Posted December 11, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted December 11, 2015 Can I just say...... I think its AWESOME that you're so protective of your husband's results. Good for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member partnerfue Posted December 11, 2015 Author Regular Member Share Posted December 11, 2015 (edited) Ha, thanks. I'm actually a doctor so I think I'm much more scrutinizing than him regarding his own skincare/health...especially since it is such an expensive procedure. I counted using on of the professional magnifying glasses from my clinic. It is a recommended doctor here who produces good results. I don't doubt the quality of work, just the number of grafts placed. Saying this, I did not do any training in hair transplantation so am just trying to understand/learn. The other thing that made me a little suspicious is my husband consulted with three other quality/recommended surgeons. Each have equally amazing results. Also, each quoted him far fewer grafts that they would have transplanted (from 1500 to 2000). Edited December 12, 2015 by partnerfue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member esrec Posted December 11, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted December 11, 2015 Ha, thanks. I'm actually a dermatologist so I think I'm much more scrutinizing than him regarding his own skincare/health...especially since it is such an expensive procedure. I counted using on of the professional magnifying glasses from my clinic. It is a recommended doctor here who produces good results. I don't doubt the quality of work, just the number of grafts placed. Saying this, I did not do any training in hair transplantation so am just trying to understand/learn. The other thing that made me a little suspicious is my husband consulted with three other quality/recommended surgeons. Each have equally amazing results. Also, each quoted him far fewer grafts that they would have transplanted (from 1500 to 2000). Did he mention if the doctor or technican was nearby with a click-counter? Many docs will have someone nearby literally counting off the grafts as placed. On the latter point, every doctor has a unique approach--some are more conservative while others take a more aggressive approach-this will influence the total # of grafts achieved. Oftentimes, the final # isn't determined until you're under the knife. For context, I was originally quoted for 1600-1800 grafts. My following 3 consults estimated me at 2000-2500 (big range), I ultimately finished with 2450. His doctor should have provided a breakdown of grafts and placements during his post-op consult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Stig Posted December 11, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted December 11, 2015 Your husband is correct. 3000 Grafts do not = 3000 incisions. The Dr. should have given him a break down of the hairs per graft. Um - actually 3,000 grafts should equal 3,000 incisions. If she is counting the hairs, then it should be more hairs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Stig Posted December 11, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted December 11, 2015 He justified it by saying they might put multiple grafts in each cut. Is this true? Nope - this is nonsense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member esrec Posted December 11, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted December 11, 2015 Nope - this is nonsense Missed this. Good spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member leftygolfer71 Posted December 11, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted December 11, 2015 Yeah, but can you have more than one graft per incision?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member leftygolfer71 Posted December 11, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted December 11, 2015 Not sure why you don't mention the Dr.s name? You would be helping yourself and the forum if this Dr. Lied... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Stig Posted December 11, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted December 11, 2015 Yeah, but can you have more than one graft per incision?? Nope - it's one graft per incision and each graft can have multiple hairs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member leftygolfer71 Posted December 12, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted December 12, 2015 Nope - it's one graft per incision and each graft can have multiple hairs Thanks! Sounds like the Dr. didn't implant 3000 grafts then... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member partnerfue Posted December 12, 2015 Author Regular Member Share Posted December 12, 2015 Right. More hair are per incision since he had several doublets and triplets, which is why I only counted incisions. I agree knowing the doctors name will be helpful but if I am missing something, I don't want to defame anyone because of my ignorance. However, I was just reading about the procedure in a medical text and you guys are correct....only one graft per incision (unless there are variations on technique). Since I counted half the incisions that my husband was quoted/charged, I am going to contact this doctor asking where the discrepancy is. Again, his breakdown was approx 3000 grafts placed with more than double the hairs. Only approx 1500 incisions. This doctor is touted for high density hairlines but his colleagues are using half this with mostly similar results. The more I am looking into this the more suspicious I am becoming. In theory, if some surgeons are doing this I'm sure they never expect their patients do actually count/confirm the quoted number. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member partnerfue Posted December 12, 2015 Author Regular Member Share Posted December 12, 2015 Correction: Unfortunately my husband does not want me to make any accusations or question the surgeon since he would like to remain in good graces in the event there are complications. His justification was that since it is done recently, he would rather have the doctor as a consultant in this tenuous period than make an enemy (which is worth more to him than the money at this point). After he get's growth he is happy with he stated he would be more comfortable with me contacting him. I will respect his wishes but am taking photos for verification. For anyone who underwent a recent surgery with a doctor who does higher graft packing that most other surgeons, I might encourage you to take photos and count. If you don't have a good microscope you can use photo editing programs to click dots on the incisions, which counts the number of dots you make. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member esrec Posted December 12, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted December 12, 2015 Fair enough. Understand and respect your calm approach to this, but I also don't see anything you've stated to be unfair to ask. After all, this forum is largely a resource for pre / post op questions. Keep us posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member densedream Posted December 12, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted December 12, 2015 You should get in contact with the Dr. privately for now and get an explanation. Tell him that you are a doctor as well and that you counted 1500 incisions. I hate to say but even though a doctor is recommend here doesn't mean they wouldn't try to squeeze out extra cash. Because in 99% of cases nobody is going to count each incision. The fact the other doctors told you 1500-2000, would get my spidy senses a tingling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member HairCenter Posted December 12, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted December 12, 2015 Nope - it's one graft per incision and each graft can have multiple hairs This is not necessarily true. Some clinics will occasionally place two grafts into one incision in various situations. For instance, if too many grafts were prepared and not enough incisions made the clinic may choose to put the remaining grafts into existing and already filled incisions, instead of letting them go to waste. It is just one possible scenario but the clinic should have informed you of this. Keep in mind that even shortly after surgery you cannot count each incision easily. Some have not formed an obvious crust and close up fast so unless you have magnification to aid your count you likely missed a fair percentage. If the clinic is a reputable clinic I doubt they tried to squeeze more money out of you. That said, you should look at the amount of hair transplanted and not just the number of grafts per incision. I represent Dr. Jerry Cooley online. All opinions are my own and do not necessarily represent those of Dr. Cooley. I am not a doctor. Learn more about Jerry Cooley MD and Hair Center in Charlotte, NC For complimentary consultations with one of the leading hair transplant doctors worldwide please contact us here. Hair Transplant Consultation With Jerry Cooley MD at HairCenter.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Stig Posted December 12, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted December 12, 2015 This is not necessarily true. Some clinics will occasionally place two grafts into one incision in various situations. For instance, if too many grafts were prepared and not enough incisions made the clinic may choose to put the remaining grafts into existing and already filled incisions, instead of letting them go to waste. on. Um - this sounds like a terrible idea. I can't imagine it would be good for the graft to be shoved into an incision created for a single graft with another graft. Also, if the surgeon screws up the incision count, then you have a bigger problem, and even worse if the surgeon cant come n an make a new incision? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Britanium Posted December 14, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted December 14, 2015 So how long was the surgery time? or in particular how long did they spend making the incisions and how long did they spend on the implanting stage? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member MrGio-WHTCClinic Posted December 14, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted December 14, 2015 An FUE incision site is about .8 to 1 millimeter in diameter. In this case, multiple grafts in one incision site would not only affect the yield but the aesthetic result as well. Immediately after a one-day or two-day FUE procedure, 1500 FUE grafts will be in 1500 incision sites. If multiple sessions over multiple days were performed, 3000 grafts may possibly appear as 1500 grafts on a certain day. My opinions are my own. I am one representative of MyWHTC Clinic's European branch. Consultation Dates & Cities for Dr. Patrick Mwamba London, United Kingdom - Available (Sat.) Zurich, Switzerland - Available (Saturday) Bologna, Italy - Available (Saturday) Brussles, Belgium - Available (Sun.-Sat.) *No Fee* Dr. Patrick Mwamba is a member of the Coalition of Independent Hair Restoration Physicians Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member TakingThePlunge Posted December 15, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted December 15, 2015 The physicians we recommend are held to the highest standards. If there is a question about the number of grafts received I suggest reaching out to the clinic and discussing your concerns. If you would like us to contact the clinic on your behalf we would be happy to do so. You may email me at service@hairtransplantnetwork.com David - Former Forum Co-Moderator and Editorial Assistant I am not a medical professional. All opinions are my own and my advice should not constitute as medical advice. View my Hair Loss Website Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member aWidowsPeek Posted December 28, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted December 28, 2015 If she counted 1500 incision sites and the doctor claims to have done 3000 grafts i highly doubt the doctor "doubled up" each incision. Sounds like he doubled up his wallet and his free time to o play golf that day. I'm sure a lot of doctors give you fewer grafts than they claim. They love to have you on the hook for a 2nd , 3rd, and 4th transplant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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