Senior Member Swooping Posted June 24, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted June 24, 2015 If FUT is more popular in the States, it's probably more to do with the crippling high FUE costs over there. Fair point, but also market penetration. The supply of FUE in the USA is probably way less than in other regions of the world like for instance Europe. The ISHRS numbers are therefore probably even advantageous for FUT, because the most ISHRS members are from the USA. However FUT begins to cripple no doubt as supply and demand are changing heavily in favor of FUE. Joe is going to a FUE workshop in Istanbul this weekend; FUE Workshop Istanbul 2015,3rd Mediterranean Workshop Asmed Some elite FUE practitioners will be there it will be interesting what they have to say about some discussion points that were laid out there. We'll know soon probably . Proud to be a representative of world elite hair transplant surgeon Dr. Bisanga - BHR Clinic. Hairtransplantelite.com YouTube Online consultations: damian@bhrclinic.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member FUE2014 Posted June 24, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted June 24, 2015 Hopefully he comes back and tells us, because at the moment we only really have on here the opinion of two docs from the same clinic who, by the sounds of it, don't practice a lot of FUE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Blake Bloxham Posted June 24, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted June 24, 2015 2014, Dr Feller actually does quite a bit of FUE. Generally around 2 cases a week. He's also been doing it for 14 years. He's also invented FUE devices, new techniques, etc. What's more, I think it's important to realize that answers to these questions aren't really going to give us any concrete facts. It's just going to be the opinions of those who practice straight FUE -- and their livelihood depends on it -- versus those who practice mixed FUSS/FUE or FUSS only -- and, again, their livelihood depends on it . This is why we generally rely on objective research in the medical/surgical world. As we've pointed out, however, this is lacking. "Doc" Blake Bloxham - formerly "Future_HT_Doc" Forum Co-Moderator and Editorial Assistant for the Hair Transplant Network, the Hair Loss Learning Center, the Hair Loss Q&A Blog, and the Hair Restoration Forum All opinions are my own and my advice does not constitute as medical advice. All medical questions and concerns should be addressed by a personal physician. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member tommygun Posted June 24, 2015 Regular Member Share Posted June 24, 2015 Still no definition of "popular" as it relates to this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member KO Posted June 24, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted June 24, 2015 I would think the top FUE practitioners would agree on the points raised by Feller. The weaknesses of FUE, when it comes to graft quality, torsion, transection, graft supply, and yield are inherent to the technique, regardless of the skill of the surgeon doing it. Now the only debatable point might be the graft supply as the number of harvestable grafts depends on things like laxity, and donor zone trauma. 3382 FUE Lupanzula http://www.hairrestorationnetwork.com/eve/185463-3382-grafts-lupanzula.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member wazaam Posted June 24, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted June 24, 2015 Blake, 2014, Dr Feller actually does quite a bit of FUE. Generally around 2 cases a week. He's also been doing it for 14 years. He's also invented FUE devices, new techniques, etc Blake, 1. Is it possible for you or Dr Feller to provide some FUE results? If Dr Feller is performing 2 cases per week it shouldn't be an issue, however I have a hard time find many results (on any forums) based on my extended research. Also if you could include some larger cases that would be even better (2500-5000) graft FUE results from Dr. Feller. 2. Can you comment on the FUE pricing structure for Dr. Feller. I personally feel that $10/graft is excessive even in the U.S. where the prices tend to be inflated. Is there a reason why the clinic charges 40% more than some of the other top U.S. clinics & 60-80% more than top international clinics? Is there additional costs associated with working out of NY that cause such massive increase? 3. Blake how many FUE cases have you personally performed? Based your information provided and given holidays sick days etc. Dr. Feller is performing 75-90 FUE cases per year? Is that figure accurate? 4. Can you comment of the pricing structure for the MFUE procedures? I appreciate all your feedback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Blake Bloxham Posted June 24, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted June 24, 2015 Waazam, He has a stockpile of cases that need to be uploaded. I'll start doing it when I'm there full time next week. Dr Feller has explained before that he charges what he thinks the service is worth. It's fairly comparable to other established US HT clinics. I can't speak too deeply to this, however, because the fees were established far before I came on board. Not really sure how many I've participated in to be honest. I wasn't really keeping track during training. I'm sure I could figure it out, but I'm not sure off the top of my head. mFUE pricing will be the same as traditional FUE. NOT more expensive. "Doc" Blake Bloxham - formerly "Future_HT_Doc" Forum Co-Moderator and Editorial Assistant for the Hair Transplant Network, the Hair Loss Learning Center, the Hair Loss Q&A Blog, and the Hair Restoration Forum All opinions are my own and my advice does not constitute as medical advice. All medical questions and concerns should be addressed by a personal physician. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member HairJo Posted June 24, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted June 24, 2015 good to know about the price I can't wait to see more results from the Mfue procedure. I'm all for seeing new procedures and their outcome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member tommygun Posted June 24, 2015 Regular Member Share Posted June 24, 2015 If the doctor thinks so little of the service (FUE) why does he charge more for it? One would think the more "popular" procedure yielding the "better" result would naturally carry a higher cost. Something does not add up to me. Please help as it's difficult to not want to speculate. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member home1212 Posted June 24, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted June 24, 2015 FUE procedures cost more universally compared to FUT because they are more time-consuming - simple economics - harvesting a strip and then having techs cutting the strip into follicular units as opposed to harvesting single, double, triple follicles one at a time - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member wazaam Posted June 24, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted June 24, 2015 Blake you have stated on several ocassions that you felt it is cheaper to run an FUE clinic than a FUT clinic? If that is the case then why does Dr. Feller charge this amount for his FUE procedures? I would think he would charge significantly less for FUE than FUT based on this economic model you have described in past posts? Dr Feller has explained before that he charges what he thinks the service is worth. It's fairly comparable to other established US HT clinics. I can't speak too deeply to this, however, because the fees were established far before I came on board. I am not sure what you consider to be "other well establish U.S. HT clinics" but Dr. Fellers FUE rates are clearly not consistent with the other top FUE surgeons in the U.S. His prices aren't even close even if one were to argue his results are comparable or on par with these FUE surgeons; Dr. Vories-$4/graft (moving to $5 graft) Dr. Diep-$6/graft Dr Shapiro (s)-$6/graft Dr. Konior-$8/graft (last time I inquired) Dr. C***- $6/graft (shaven) $8 graft (unshaven) Dr. Feller-$10/graft I am looking forward to Dr. Fellers FUE results being posted. I have always been impressed with his FUT work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Blake Bloxham Posted June 25, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted June 25, 2015 It absolutely is cheaper to run an FUE clinic. More profitable as well. Even with low graft prices. Most of the surgeons I was thinking about off the top of my head were $8 and up -- like you showed with Konior and C***. "Doc" Blake Bloxham - formerly "Future_HT_Doc" Forum Co-Moderator and Editorial Assistant for the Hair Transplant Network, the Hair Loss Learning Center, the Hair Loss Q&A Blog, and the Hair Restoration Forum All opinions are my own and my advice does not constitute as medical advice. All medical questions and concerns should be addressed by a personal physician. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member wazaam Posted June 25, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted June 25, 2015 It absolutely is cheaper to run an FUE clinic. More profitable as well. Even with low graft prices. So why the need to charge 20-60% more than the rest of the top surgeons (elite U.S FUE $4-$6) especially given that your margins are much higher than with FUT procedures? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Blake Bloxham Posted June 25, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted June 25, 2015 Waz, Here was what Dr Feller said when asked a few weeks back: "I can't speak for why others charge what they do. It is not my place. If their price structure works for them, then bless them. I happen to like and respect all the doctors in your list by they way." The doctors on the list were some of the more established FUE and strip guys. I don't think I can really add much more than that. He charges what makes sense based upon when and how he thinks FUE should be used, and he can't comment on why others charge differently. You'll always see fluctuations in prices for all cosmetic/elective procedures. "Doc" Blake Bloxham - formerly "Future_HT_Doc" Forum Co-Moderator and Editorial Assistant for the Hair Transplant Network, the Hair Loss Learning Center, the Hair Loss Q&A Blog, and the Hair Restoration Forum All opinions are my own and my advice does not constitute as medical advice. All medical questions and concerns should be addressed by a personal physician. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member wazaam Posted June 25, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted June 25, 2015 Blake, Understand. I missed that post from Dr. Feller. If you could please comment on the FUE protocol for Dr. Feller. Does he does all the work himself i.e. extractions, incisions, & implantation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member mav23100gunther Posted June 26, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted June 26, 2015 Gentlemen, I believe he charges so much because that is what the market is dictating. If someone is willing to pay $10 for an apple he can get for $4 by traveling to Europe, why would he charge less than $10 if that's what that person is willing to sprnd $10. I would imagine that many patients needing FUE, don't want to travel to Europe, so they pay up. I guess it's the same reason Dr Bernstein charges in excess of $8 per graft for strip FUT. He obviously has a market for it. I say good on Dr. Feller if he can still run a business charging such a high fee. If we want to see the cost of FUE in the U.S. Come down, I would imagine all the FUT haters should just go to Europe for their FUE procedures instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member FUE2014 Posted June 26, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted June 26, 2015 (edited) No need to refer to people electing for FUE as FUT haters, that's a bit strong, lets keep things civil! As for Dr Feller charging $10, who cares? It's a free market, people can take it or leave it. No disrespect intended, but Feller is not someone people talk about (subjective assertion I know) anyway on the discussion boards as a doc worth going to for FUE. I suspect if you were to post a poll here asking forum members which coalition doc they would go to for FUE regardless of cost, not one would pick Dr Feller. He may have a lot to say about FUE (and rightly so, he's an expert) but current real life results are lacking and people rightly or wrongly will draw a negative inference from that. Edited June 26, 2015 by FUE2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member mav23100gunther Posted June 26, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted June 26, 2015 No need to refer to people electing for FUE as FUT haters, that's a bit strong, lets keep things civil! As for Dr Feller charging $10, who cares? It's a free market, people can take it or leave it. No disrespect intended, but Feller is not someone people talk about (subjective assertion I know) anyway on the discussion boards as a doc worth going to for FUE. I suspect if you were to post a poll here asking forum members which coalition doc they would go to for FUE regardless of cost, not one would pick Dr Feller. He may have a lot to say about FUE (and rightly so, he's an expert) but current real life results are lacking and people rightly or wrongly will draw a negative inference from that. Apologies if the word "haters" came off as strong, no disrespect intended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member JohnCasper Posted June 27, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted June 27, 2015 I continue to read such ardent defenders of FUT. Hopefully, the market will help folks decide. There will always be debates over yield and best results. If you don't mind having an 8 inch linear scar go with FUT, the results are great. If you would rather have no visible scarring to the untrained eye, and you want similar results, go with FUE. For me, that decision was easy but I respect everyone's choice. I've been very happy with my FUE procedure. I am an online representative for Carolina Hair Surgery & Dr. Mike Vories (Recommended on the Hair Transplant Network). View John's before/after photos and videos: http://www.MyFUEhairtransplant.com You can email me at johncasper99@gmail.com I am not a medical professional and my opinions should not be taken as medical advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Blake Bloxham Posted June 27, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted June 27, 2015 John, I'm pleased your happy with your FUE procedure(s). However, bumping threads, sharing an unrelated image, and re-hashing the scarring differences isn't necessary. This is even more true for clinic representatives. PS: I removed the image as it's unrelated and you've shared it multiple times now. "Doc" Blake Bloxham - formerly "Future_HT_Doc" Forum Co-Moderator and Editorial Assistant for the Hair Transplant Network, the Hair Loss Learning Center, the Hair Loss Q&A Blog, and the Hair Restoration Forum All opinions are my own and my advice does not constitute as medical advice. All medical questions and concerns should be addressed by a personal physician. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member JohnCasper Posted June 27, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted June 27, 2015 Well said Joe Tillman and good points Blake. I appreciate each of your point of views on the subject. I am an online representative for Carolina Hair Surgery & Dr. Mike Vories (Recommended on the Hair Transplant Network). View John's before/after photos and videos: http://www.MyFUEhairtransplant.com You can email me at johncasper99@gmail.com I am not a medical professional and my opinions should not be taken as medical advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Britanium Posted June 27, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted June 27, 2015 For me personally im thankful for both procedures. I would not have had enough grafts from just FUE alone. For those of us needing a lot of grafts to get decent coverage the 2 procedures work very well together in my experience. The strip scar i have does not really bother me - especially since its has been revised. I never have worn my hair that short i would need to worry. I max'd out on FUT (x2) and then went for FUE (X3) to get the density i wanted. So approx 13000 grafts in total. Being a high norwood i needed as many as i could get. Of course i now have hair greed so would still look at BHT (Beard) too ! :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Blake Bloxham Posted June 27, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted June 27, 2015 Thanks, John! Again, I really am happy you were able to find a procedure that helped you restore you hair. Like you said, both have their place and suit certain patients best. Johnny, Nice! If you are really trying to max out -- like a champ ; ) -- FUSS followed by FUE/mFUE is the way to go. "Doc" Blake Bloxham - formerly "Future_HT_Doc" Forum Co-Moderator and Editorial Assistant for the Hair Transplant Network, the Hair Loss Learning Center, the Hair Loss Q&A Blog, and the Hair Restoration Forum All opinions are my own and my advice does not constitute as medical advice. All medical questions and concerns should be addressed by a personal physician. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Britanium Posted June 27, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted June 27, 2015 thanks Blake. Im thinking BHT as i have a thick beard and would think it should work in my FUT scar to further hide it. Just cant decide who i want to do it out of Doganay and Karadeniz.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member delancey Posted June 27, 2015 Senior Member Share Posted June 27, 2015 I continue to read such ardent defenders of FUT. Hopefully, the market will help folks decide. There will always be debates over yield and best results. If you don't mind having an 8 inch linear scar go with FUT, the results are great. If you would rather have no visible scarring to the untrained eye, and you want similar results, go with FUE. For me, that decision was easy but I respect everyone's choice. I've been very happy with my FUE procedure. Hi John! I was wondering if you could share some photos of your crown with me? I couldn't find any photos detailing your crown restoration. We have similar hair characteristics and HL pattern. You can send me a PM. Thanks John. I am not a medical professional and my words should not be taken as medical advice. All opinions and views shared are my own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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