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FUT is more popular than FUE


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  • Senior Member
Thank you for the advice. From everything I have read, Dr. Lorenzo is the best FUE in the business but I would have concerns with a medical procedure so far away and in another country. What are people's opinion for the best FUE doc in the US?

 

I keep saying it - the benefits of getting the procedure with the best surgeon for your case should easily outweigh the concerns you have with having a medical procedure in another country. The top FUE surgeons are located in Europe - plain and simple. Not only that, but the cost in Europe is ridiculously cheaper than the cost of FUE in North America with the best. I think patients are insane to be paying so much for FUE in the States when the FUE surgeons in Europe are better and substantially cheaper. What possible concern could you have with jumping on a plane for a procedure? Just man up and do it.

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Do you say this from experience? Who did you have do yours and which procedure? Would you change the way you did any of it?

 

Yeah I do actually. See my story below. I screwed up by limiting myself to surgeons in New York for my 1st procedure. If I could go back in time, yes I would have absolutely changed who my surgeon was. Would have definitely gone with a mega-session FUT with Rahal or Hasson. Luckily I came right for my 2nd procedure.

 

http://www.hairrestorationnetwork.co...edure-fut.html

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  • Senior Member

@ Mikeey -

 

in the correct hands FUE is scarless - i took the Feller challenge and shave to #0 and you cannot see any scars I regular have my hair cut #1 blend thats after 4700 FUE, i have photos you can have a look and judge for yourself.

 

75-80% yeild, In the correct hands such as Dr Bhatti survival rate i think is above some FUT clinics, plus his cherry picking method means you get more bang for buck with a higher rate of 3 & 4 grafts covering more area for less grafts.

 

 

I think that FUT is still being performed for 2 reasons

1st, Price point, generally speaking FUT is cheaper

2nd, You scar yourself once you will scar yourself again. many people return for a second or third HT or as Feller says, strip strip until you cannot strip no more, then go FUE,

June 2013 - 3000 FUE Dr Bhatti

Oct 2013 - 1000 FUE Dr Bhatti

Oct 2015 - 785 FUE Dr Bhatti

 

Dr. Bhatti's Recommendation Profile on the Hair Transplant Network

My story and photos can be seen here

http://www.hairrestorationnetwork.com/Sethticles/

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  • Senior Member
II think patients are insane to be paying so much for FUE in the States when the FUE surgeons in Europe are better and substantially cheaper. What possible concern could you have with jumping on a plane for a procedure? Just man up and do it.

 

absolutely!

June 2013 - 3000 FUE Dr Bhatti

Oct 2013 - 1000 FUE Dr Bhatti

Oct 2015 - 785 FUE Dr Bhatti

 

Dr. Bhatti's Recommendation Profile on the Hair Transplant Network

My story and photos can be seen here

http://www.hairrestorationnetwork.com/Sethticles/

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  • Senior Member
absolutely!

 

Here are some concerns - or at least issues to consider - before jumping on a plane.

 

Poor communication and misunderstanding with doctors and staff if they do not share your native- language.

 

A lack of understanding about medico-legal comeback or standards in said foreign country.

 

The requirement for further return journeys for any follow-ups or repair work should it go wrong (and to be cynical - the potential for the doctor not to give too much concern for a patient he's botched to be able to do anything about it from 5,000 miles away and pursue any action in a country from which he has no legal knowledge, no language or contacts).

 

And of course to a lesser extent the hassle or travelling when you're feeling vulnerable/in pain/woken up in bed in an foreign country realising you've made a horrible mistake (which I'm sure we've all done in some capacity).

 

These things are worth factoring into any decision you make about medical procedures abroad.

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Here are some concerns - or at least issues to consider - before jumping on a plane.

 

Poor communication and misunderstanding with doctors and staff if they do not share your native- language.

 

A lack of understanding about medico-legal comeback or standards in said foreign country.

 

The requirement for further return journeys for any follow-ups or repair work should it go wrong (and to be cynical - the potential for the doctor not to give too much concern for a patient he's botched to be able to do anything about it from 5,000 miles away and pursue any action in a country from which he has no legal knowledge, no language or contacts).

 

And of course to a lesser extent the hassle or travelling when you're feeling vulnerable/in pain/woken up in bed in an foreign country realising you've made a horrible mistake (which I'm sure we've all done in some capacity).

 

These things are worth factoring into any decision you make about medical procedures abroad.

 

Definitely things to be considered. But lets look at them a bit in detail...1 by 1.

 

Communication - Important one. Culturally we all differ a bit based on where we come from, surroundings etc... However, look at Medical tourism expanding, other industries expanding...The world is now Flat. You get what you want from anywhere at the best possible price. People undergo much more complex surgeries travelling abroad.

 

Legal - In the current system in any country the doctors do make you to sign there standard documentation which safe guards them in case things don't turn out to be as expected. So a patient typically can't do much if any cosmetic surgery does not turn out to be what was expected or sold to him/her. Assumption here is that one would choose the clinics properly who usually have experience on handling dissatisfied customers and accordingly safe guard themselves against all eventualities.

 

Repair and follow up - That's the big one and must be factored into the decision as one would might need to go back on a case by case basis. This one is the ONE! (So factor it into your Business Case when planning)

 

Travelling post op - Important one but how much of that is a real issue. There are so many people on the forum here who have travelled long distances with out any issue. Besides one could avoid it by staying for a extra few days at the place of transplant to avoid any issues. All the clinics & doc already market their skill saying in a week's time one could resume normal life with instructed care ofcourse. So no big deal with travelling.

 

At the top of the list (I intentionally kept at the bottom) is the "Business Case".

We all have limited wealth and so many responsibilities to shoulder. And we must spend it wisely! If one can get the same quality for less amount why not go for it. There will always be some trade offs but no gain without pain. The Business Case eventually makes or breaks depending on Risk & Benefit analysis.

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I would say travel is a requisite for most guys in the UK . I've seen so many crap results form guys who've had hair transplants here ,even if I was rich I wouldn't go near them, and trying to claim back any money for a failed transplant good luck with that , they are chancers big time.

I'm Irish so obviously I looked at the Blackrock clinic they charge 10 euros per graft I had 4200 FUE grafts inTurkey it cost me 1750 pounds including hotel and transfers, at the Blackrock clinic it would have cost me 35000 ponds aprox I don't know the exact exchange rate.

 

Bottom line its a business do you think Dr Feller would have started this thread if everything was hunky dory in the FUT camp, not a chance ,he sees the way the wind is blowing so he got in there, not really caring how people who have spent good money on getting an FUE procedure might feel, with his claims of only 60 per cent growth on average, but it's OK business is business and believe me the hair transplant business is a ruthless one.

Going to turkey was one of the best decisions I have made in my life, my hair transplant is a resounding success, none of this thin wispy hair that I'm supposed to have, will be updating at the 15 month mark, you tell me if I only got 60 per cent growth.

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Definitely things to be considered. But lets look at them a bit in detail...1 by 1.

 

Communication - Important one. Culturally we all differ a bit based on where we come from, surroundings etc... However, look at Medical tourism expanding, other industries expanding...The world is now Flat. You get what you want from anywhere at the best possible price. People undergo much more complex surgeries travelling abroad.

 

Legal - In the current system in any country the doctors do make you to sign there standard documentation which safe guards them in case things don't turn out to be as expected. So a patient typically can't do much if any cosmetic surgery does not turn out to be what was expected or sold to him/her. Assumption here is that one would choose the clinics properly who usually have experience on handling dissatisfied customers and accordingly safe guard themselves against all eventualities. .

 

In general, it seems your point is you can price risk - hence the business plan. I wouldn't disagree with this, but pricing risk is notoriously difficult and only as good as the information you have and the model you use.

 

On the two points above. You're right many people travel abroad for surgery - and even within a culture people are different. But neither of those things worsen or lessen the risk for you if you go to a surgery which doesn't speak your language. Even if, as you say, the world is flat, the surface area is exactly the same. In your model, it seems you price this miscommunication risk at zero - I wouldn't.

 

On the second point - I said medical standards (which you didn't mention) as well as the medico-legal system. I have a reasonable idea of what medical standards to expect in my country - the UK. Whatever disclaimer you sign does not change the law - you cannot opt out of the law in the UK. The law is well developed around informed consent, capacity, medical negligence etc. I have no idea if this is the case in many countries in which you might get a HT. (And it's not so much the recourse in law I think that's the important part, it's the change in behaviour among doctors that potential legal action creates). I would assume most people wouldn't know and don't bother to look it up in foreign countries. So, again, you seem to price this risk at zero - I wouldn't.

 

And I'm not saying this to argue the specifics, I'm just trying to point out that people should think these things through.

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  • Senior Member
In general, it seems your point is you can price risk - hence the business plan. I wouldn't disagree with this, but pricing risk is notoriously difficult and only as good as the information you have and the model you use.

 

On the two points above. You're right many people travel abroad for surgery - and even within a culture people are different. But neither of those things worsen or lessen the risk for you if you go to a surgery which doesn't speak your language. Even if, as you say, the world is flat, the surface area is exactly the same. In your model, it seems you price this miscommunication risk at zero - I wouldn't.

 

On the second point - I said medical standards (which you didn't mention) as well as the medico-legal system. I have a reasonable idea of what medical standards to expect in my country - the UK. Whatever disclaimer you sign does not change the law - you cannot opt out of the law in the UK. The law is well developed around informed consent, capacity, medical negligence etc. I have no idea if this is the case in many countries in which you might get a HT. (And it's not so much the recourse in law I think that's the important part, it's the change in behaviour among doctors that potential legal action creates). I would assume most people wouldn't know and don't bother to look it up in foreign countries. So, again, you seem to price this risk at zero - I wouldn't.

 

And I'm not saying this to argue the specifics, I'm just trying to point out that people should think these things through.

 

You are overthinking and over engineering this. I think the number one factor should be quality of results. If you can get the best possible results in Spain, then that is where you should go. If you determine that you can get the best possible results in both Spain and the US, then you factor in pricing and go with the cheapest. That was the point I was making. When electing FUE, the top FUE surgeons are in Europe, and whilst the likes of Konior and Shapiro may be on the same par in terms of FUE, they are ridiculously expensive. I emphasize with what HairJo is saying regarding wanting to sleep in his own bed after surgery, but if that is the sole basis he is selecting his surgeon without regard to where he can get the best results, then I wish him the best of luck. Let's say that he determines Dr Feller can get him the best FUE result, yet we know Feller charges $10 or so per graft, whilst HairJo also realizes he can get the same result for 3euros in Belgium. Let's say 2,000 grafts. When you factor in travel and exchange rate, he can still save $7,000 by travelling. $7,000 is a big price to pay just to sleep in your own bed no?

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Totally agree with the above post if someone is over-thinking having a hair transplant to that degree possibly they are not a suitable candidate to begin with . if I could have afforded Dr Farjo in the UK or the Blackrock hair clinic in Dublin, yea sure I probably would have gone there ,luckily there are other options travelling isn't really that big a deal

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Mav, on that basis, I'd agree with you: Lorenzo and Feruduni do great FUE, speak English and work in developed Western European surgeries. And they are cheaper. So then it's question of how much you are willing to pay not to travel. But a lot, maybe a majority, of people go abroad for cost reasons (not quality). That's ably pointed out in Mick50's follow-up post. And my point is you need to factor in more than just cost and an assumption that everything will be fine and dandy.

 

Mick, genuinely curious how you conclude that thinking about risks makes someone an unsuitable candidate.

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I have to agree with newbie33 here. He makes sense. There are great doctors around the world. Way more than just ten years ago so the need to travel is just not there as much anymore. I had a problem almost a month after my transplant and could not go back to the doctor because he was too far away. I would speak with the secretary but that really didn't help so I had to go to a dermatologist who really didn't want to touch me. It was a mess. Travel sounds like a good idea at the time but having done it my advice is not to do it. It sounds like there are people on here who think their doctor is the best of the best and everyone should go to him. That is really not the case at all. If there is a doctor who has a good record 50 miles away isn't that better than traveling 500 miles or more? Or going to another country altogether? Look on this sight, there are dozens and dozens of really impressive doctors to chose from. I just looked at doctors in my area and took it from there.

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Mick, genuinely curious how you conclude that thinking about risks makes someone an unsuitable candidate

Newbie33

 

I forget sometimes that we are all different, I am by nature impulsive which obviously isn't a good thing where having a hair transplant is concerned but at the same it's a time a leap of faith no matter where you have the transplant and I feel certain personalities may not be equipped to deal with the process and overly worrying about what could go wrong [risks] could be indicative of that. I agree the reason most people travel abroad is cost but as I said if you live in the UK you really don't have much option .

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  • Senior Member

Your right there Mick - I had x2 FUT in the UK before heading out to Turkey. I got a much better result using less grafts with FUE. With someone who had proven results already.

5 years ago I could not find a decent choice in the UK.

Add to that the cost was around x5 times as much here. I would certainly travel again for any future need.

Bottom line is it sucks to be in the Uk if your after a decent Ht !

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Indeed, we are all different. We're all individuals...

 

You ever done any Myers-Briggs personality testing? (I'm ENTJ - very strongly T, nearly as strongly J). Gathering information, systematising, making decisions based on data - it's all very comfortable to me. Understanding risks and how things work eliminate worry for me - I would worry much more if I didn't have a clear idea of what to expect (and how near I can get to it - the odds of achieving it, if you like) and what might go wrong.

 

As an example, let me relay my first consultation experience with a HT doctor (Doganay) and a dental surgeon.

 

Me: How often do your procedures end in failure?

Doganay: Blank face

Me: I mean, how often do you get less growth than you expect? Less than is acceptable, than your patient is happy with?

Doganay: Laughs and brushes his hand in the air to suggest it's not a question worth answering

Me: Let's say less than half the grafts grow...

Doganay: (Might have been his translator, and not him) It's always successful.

Me: So you're saying 100% of your operations are successful?

Doganay: Maybe one or two in a hundred get less growth...

 

I can be generous and say maybe some of this was a lack of understanding of the question as he doesn't speak great English (which is my point about communication, above). But you can decide for yourselves what to make of that.

 

Same type of conversation with my dental surgeon for placing an implant - in London, but he's Scottish, so the same translation difficulty ;-)

 

Me: Can these procedures fail?

Him: Yes.

Me: How often?

Him: About 5% of the time. They usually do it in the first few days. If that happens we take it out, or it falls out, and we let it heal and try again a few months later. We don't always know why they fail but having it fail once doesn't increase the chances of a second failure.

 

We had more of a discussion about what I'd do it it did fall out and he gave me his mobile number which I was to call.

 

I only proceeded after one of those consultations. Can anyone guess which?

Edited by newbie33
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  • Senior Member

I see where you're coming from Newbie33 ,I 'm actually in a strange position in that although I'm happy with my result so far ,[it's not perfect but as Norwood 5-6 I had realistic expectations] I can't really recommend the clinic i went to to anyone who contacts me.

 

I went to Turkey knowing Jack shit in reality about hair transplants ,I knew the Doctor didn't actuality perform the transplant ,but I was surprised he didn't even look at my donor just drew the hair-line and took some pics Ok I had sent pics but surely he should have inspected my hair. This Doctor is quite a respected plastic surgeon in Turkey but there you have it, he obviously saw an opening in the market to exploit, hired, luckily for me experienced Nurses/technicians and there you go .I still would recommend people to got to Turkey as there are clinics who only perform hair transplants ,Dr Erdogan .Dr Yaman etc but you're dead right do your research unlike me and chances are you'll be happy with the result.

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There is no substitute to Due Dilgence... One has to do it, on the parameters listed. You don't just got to one doctor just like that. There is a process and all the parameters listed on this thread must be considered and then one finally goes with the ONE he is comfortable with and the ONE he feels will provide the most promising result fitting in the budget one has.

Through the consultation process one is able to clarify and understand nitigrities. And as we all are different the choices we eventually make for the same set of doctors also differs.

 

Any HT aspirant must make a checklist of items discussed on this thread for making his decision.

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