4065 Grafts Dr Hakan Doganay! Australia To Turkey!

[Mickeydw]

HTsoon look at he's pre op pics there was no native hair in the recipient area to lose

 

Exacty! there was no native hair to lose!

 

sounds like you work for dr Hakan HTsoon. I'm still waiting on a reply from Dr Hakans clinic and I've heard nothing back from them as they were quick to reply to me yesterday when they seen I wasn't happy on this forum they quickly emailed me but as I asked to why it looks to seem like I've lost my HT Hairs at the frontale third I get no response.

 

Can I get a please explain dr Hakan as to why my right side temple is pluggey?

and why have I lost my HT hairs at the frontal third?

 

was the techs not up to scratch? was it poor workman ship by you?

 

just an answer to my questions would be great!

Edited October 1, 2015 by Mickeydw

[mosd]

following!

[Melvin- Admin]

Exacty! there was no native hair to lose!

 

sounds like you work for dr Hakan HTsoon. I'm still waiting on a reply from Dr Hakans clinic and I've heard nothing back from them as they were quick to reply to me yesterday when they seen I wasn't happy on this forum they quickly emailed me but as I asked to why it looks to seem like I've lost my HT Hairs at the frontale third I get no response.

 

Can I get a please explain dr Hakan as to why my right side temple is pluggey?

and why have I lost my HT hairs at the frontal third?

 

was the techs not up to scratch? was it poor workman ship by you?

 

just an answer to my questions would be great!

 

Wow my bad man, I didn't notice those pics you posted were at 4 months, it's confusing when you post 4 month pics as your first post but my apologies no need to get defensive, I don't work for Dr. Doganay, but I'd like to see what he has to say, the only logical explanation is the transplanted hairs were taken from outside the safe zone.

[Oliverqueen01]

Very keen to hear a response regarding this! I am a fellow Aussie who was just reading this thread with great enthusiasm ready to book a HT in Turkey and make the dreaded trip but now i don't know what to think.

 

Its such a shame after all the money and effort you spent you didn't get the desire result.

[Mickeydw]

Very keen to hear a response regarding this! I am a fellow Aussie who was just reading this thread with great enthusiasm ready to book a HT in Turkey and make the dreaded trip but now i don't know what to think.

 

Its such a shame after all the money and effort you spent you didn't get the desire result.

 

Tell me about it! and $8,000 Euros later, I'd expect a response from them soon as Dr Hakan is apart of this forum and this HT community.

[mosd]

still no reply?

[Mickeydw]

still no reply?

 

 

Nope, not a word! it's getting beyond a joke now. I've got questions and I'm getting

no answers. :rolleyes:

[Mickeydw]

here's a copy of the 2nd email I sent now, sent clear photos as requested and still not a word

 

"Yes, that's correct I'm not happy with the result!

 

It's been well over the 1year mark now and I had this procedure done on the 23rd December 2013! so that's well over 1 and Half year! it's coming up to 2years!

 

May I ask whom I'm speaking to? as I know this wouldn't be Dr Hakan.

 

Also why would my transplant hairs fall out? after getting more then 4000 grafts dense pack I wouldn't expect this to happen in the frontal third? unless the hairs were taken from outside the safe zone?

 

 

Photos are on the forum which you obviously seen and the pictures are there which I uploaded you can see clear as day that the HT hair is gone!

 

Can I get a please explain dr Hakan as to why my right side temple is pluggey?

and why have I lost my HT hairs at the frontal third?

 

was the techs not up to scratch? was it poor workman ship by you?

 

I demand a timely response as you were quick to e mail me when you seen I wasn't happy on the form but not so quick to reply to my questions as this is my 2nd email I'm writing you!

 

Sent from my iPhone "

 

On 30 Sep 2015, at 11:38 PM, Dr Hakan Doganay <info@hakandoganayfue.com> wrote:

I

Dear Michael,

 

We hope that everything is going well.

 

We understand that you are not happy with your hair situation and you believe that it gets worse. .

 

We would like to remind that even if the full result of a HT can be seen in 12 months, we keep following our patients and do our best to help them if they have any problem with their transplanted or original hair after seeing the full result. Therefore, please feel free if you have any question.

 

We would like evaluate the current situation, so we kindly ask to email us some clear pictures that we can see the situation of hair?

 

 

Best

AHD Clinic

[Mickeydw]

This is the response I get, :rolleyes::rolleyes:

 

"Hey Michael,

We will get back to you soon. We have discussed your case, please do not worry we are standing behind our work.

Thanks for the patience.

All the best, "

[CJD]

Mickeydw, I am sorry to see what has happened to what originally appeared to be a really good result for you. it was obvious how happy you were and how much it changed you at the time ! That must make it even more frustrating that things went so well for a while and then started regressing. I hope it will resolve or will be fixed for you.

 

Given the point in time at which this happened and the fact that there was not hair there previously, it does seems as if hair was transplanted that obviously was not from the "safe" zone as others have pointed out already.

 

I personally am not a fan of these mega-sessions that the mentioned docs in Turkey often do. Even though that may not be the direct problem here, they can cause bad results and do often IMO. This is not a growing issue as it appeared in the pics you had initially achieved a good result and good growth. I have seen people discussing several bad results from this doctor recently and unhappy people in recent threads I have read...kind of strange.

I would suggest those interested in him read them for themselves.

 

I have actually seen some doctors mention that a FUE procedure has this type of result as a risk since hair is taken from so many areas to try to prevent thinning of the donor area in one spot. As a result, it increases the chance that hair will be taken that is not "safe" and will thus fall out. That is one benefit of the FUT in their opinion. The FUT takes lots of hair from a more precise location typically although it obviously leaves a large scar.. Having said that , the doctors are supposed to be experts and have the experience and knowledge to know where to take hair from.

 

One subject this story brings up for me is meds and getting a HT. I know meds affect some people in a way they can't tolerate. My thinking is people should not get a HT without meds. In theory, if someone was completely bald on top and lost all the hair except for that left in a "safe zone", a person should not have to take meds since the hair is "safe". The purpose of meds is really supposed to be to prevent further loss of the natural hair or to slow it down , not the transplanted hair . Most surgeons recommend meds for this reason and some mandate it for a patient ( I believe). What is scary to think about is all the people that have gotten tons of FUE grafts by bad docs in which hair was taken outside of their safe zone. If they are on meds pre surgery, they have no idea that they might be keeping the transplanted hair in with meds alone and not simply preventing future loss of the natural hair. This means they did not really get the great result they think they did since much of it could go at any time. :eek:

There is obviously a lot of risk in getting a HT in many ways.

 

 

Turkey is getting a lot of patients, especially Dr. Erdogan in his large clinic which is like a mill and floods the boards with advertising and posts. I can tell people horror stories about people I know who went there and got bad results . Thereafter, they were completely ignored by the clinic and doctor and all communications were ignored. Some tried for months and longer to get through. I warn people to save the extra money and find a doc elsewhere. I could actually see in several cases where Dr. Erdogan has taken hair out of the area traditionally seen to be the safe zone. Not only that, but he has done 10000 grafts on some young people and many HT's on young people using very low hairlines for when he can have no idea about their future loss pattern nor does he seem to care. Asmed took the money under the table from those I know very quickly when they arrived . Once they left they were on their own .... left to deal their problems all alone with no help. Sure they were treated great like anyone would be who was about to give them thousands in cash. Once they left, it was like they didn't exist anymore. Since they paid in cash, there is probably no longer any record of them being at that place...LOL.....

 

 

Mickeydw , At least you seem to be in a better situation in that you have already gotten replies from your doctor. I know that the next one could not come quickly enough for you. I don't know much about this doctor, but I hope he will respond again soon and offer a resolution to this for you. It sounds like that is where this is headed. Have faith.

 

I wish you the best of luck and will be keeping my eye on this forum hoping for a good resolution for you.

Edited October 3, 2015 by CJD

[Melvin- Admin]

I agree that mega session are not a good idea for FUE, and can lead to hairs being extracted out of the safe zone, what seems peculiar though, is that from the pictures posted the crown doesn't seem to be thinning, which would somewhat debunk the hairs taken out of the safe zone theory, it's not mentioned whether or not Mickey is on meds, but even if he's not, it doesn't appear that he's lost hair from his crown. I always say if your going to get FUE be prepared to do multiple procedures, in my opinion that's really the only true benefit of FUT is the ability to harvest more grafts at once, like you said, the yield was good it appeared to be good.

[ersko72]

Hey Mickedw,

Losing successfully transplanted hairs within 2 years is odd.I agree with others, it does sound like some of the transplanted hair was taken outside the safe zone. Please keep is posted on the clinic's response, and I hope they do the right thing and find a way to make it up to you.

 

Hi CJD,

In my research I've been seeking out both good and band results for Erdogan. I spotted Delm's recent posting that he had no follow-up response from Asmed, then questionable results. But other than that I've struggled to find poor outcomes from Erdogen/Asmed. I'm booked for December and want to be s informed as possible. Who are the other users who've reported poor results? Let me know (even by PM so as not to hijack this post) and I'll check out their post and profiles. Thanks!

 

Ersko

[Mickeydw]

Thanks for the comments guys! Means a lot to me to get more information even if it's not from the clinic!

 

CJD, you bring some valid points and info, cheers!

 

@HTsoon, I was on proscar but stopped taken them as I was getting sexual side effects from the meds! FUT does seem to have more yield but I just can't deal with that scar you get

[mosd]

how long has it been?

[Mickeydw]

Ive got a reply, not that all my questions were answered anyways, here it is,'apparently my HT was a success. :rolleyes:

 

Didn't get a answer to;

1) why is my right side temple pluggey and looks unnatural?

2) Who am I speaking to?

 

"Hello Michael,

 

We have been following your post on the forum especially 8 months to 1 year so that means your procedures was successful... If procedures not success you wouldn't get all hair growth on 8 months...

 

Dr. Hakan DOGANAY recommend medication such as Propecia 1mg and Biotin 5mg for 6 month because Hair loss might be temporarily After 6 month please update your pictures again we would like reevaluate.... If you need touch up please do not hesitate contact with us.

 

Useful information If hair from donor area will fall of in future, after transplantation patient will also lose them on recipient area even from safe zone..... If you believe that donor hairs never fall off you wouldn't see people with norwood 6 and 7.

 

 

At any rate, please use medication for 6 months or so then let see how your recipient area react.

If you still need another surgery due to thinning on the transplanted areas we can make another FREE transplantation to increase the density. However, it seems that your donor grafts resistance to the DHT is low in the recipient area OR DHT rate is high in the recipient area which is effecting your implanted grafts as well. Hence, the best way is to keep using medicines.

 

 

For more information about cycles of Human Hair growth please see below.

 

Human hair growth

Hair grows in cycles of various phases:[7] anagen is the growth phase; catagen is the involuting or regressing phase; and telogen, the resting or quiescent phase (names derived using the greek prefixes ana-, kata-, and telos- meaning up, down, and end respectively). Each phase has several morphologically and histologically distinguishable sub-phases. Prior to the start of cycling is a phase of follicular morphogenesis (formation of the follicle). There is also a shedding phase, or exogen, that is independent of anagen and telogen in which one of several hair that might arise from a single follicle exits. Normally up to 90% of the hair follicles are in anagen phase while, 10–14% are in telogen and 1–2% in catagen. The cycle's length varies on different parts of the body. For eyebrows, the cycle is completed in around 4 months, while it takes the scalp 3–4 years to finish; this is the reason eyebrow hair have a much shorter length limit compared to hair on the head. Growth cycles are controlled by a chemical signal like epidermal growth factor.DLX3 is a crucial regulator of hair follicle differentiation and cycling. Specifically, colocalization of phosphorylated Smad1/5/8 complex and DLX3 regulate role for BMP signaling to Dlx3 during hair morphogenesis in animal models.[8][9]

 

Anagen phase[edit]

Anagen is the active growth phase of hair follicles[10] during which the root of the hair is dividing rapidly, adding to the hair shaft. During this phase the hair grows about 1 cm every 28 days. Scalp hair stays in this active phase of growth for 2–7 years and is genetically determined. At the end of the anagen phase an unknown signal causes the follicle to go into the catagen phase.

 

Catagen phase[edit]

The catagen phase is a short transition stage that occurs at the end of the anagen phase.[11] It signals the end of the active growth of a hair. This phase lasts for about 2–3 weeks while the hair converts to a club hair. A club hair is formed during the catagen phase when the part of the hair follicle in contact with the lower portion of the hair becomes attached to the hair shaft. This process cuts the hair off from its blood supply and from the cells that produce new hair. When a club hair is completely formed, about a 2-week process, the hair follicle enters the telogen phase.

 

Telogen phase[edit]

The telogen phase is the resting phase of the hair follicle.[12] When the body is subjected to extreme stress, as much as 70 percent of hair can prematurely enter a phase of rest, called the telogen phase. This hair begins to fall, causing a noticeable loss of hair. This condition is called telogen effluvium.[13] The club hair is the final product of a hair follicle in the telogen stage, and is a dead, fully keratinized hair.[6] Fifty to one-hundred club hair are shed daily from a normal scalp.[6]

 

Hair growth cycle times[edit]

Scalp: The time these phases last varies from person to person. Different hair color and follicle shape affects the timings of these phases.

anagen phase, 2–8 years (occasionally much longer)

catagen phase, 2–3 weeks

telogen phase, around 3 months

 

All the best

 

AHD CLINIC's Team "

[newbie33]

Mickeydw, sorry to hear about your result. I'm not sure I follow the clinic's response. Are they saying the transplanted hair is going through the hair cycle and has fallen out due to it? Are they saying your 'safe zone' hair isn't resistant to DHT? (And/Or that they took grafts from NW zones 6/7)? What do you think they are telling you?

 

For me, this highlights come of my secondary concerns about going to clinics in your non-native country, such as possible language barriers, distance barriers and no clear idea of the medical/legal standards. All things that matter much more if it doesn't pan out as you hope.

Edited October 3, 2015 by newbie33

[mosd]

how long since op?

[CJD]

Mickeydw, I am sorry they did not directly answer all of your questions in a very clear way. It sounds like it was a representative of that clinic sending the e-mail. The language is unfortunately somewhat confusing which is obviously a result of them being in another country.What is strange to me in that message is that they seem to imply a couple of things are responsible for what has happened without being direct about them. They seem to say that is is wrong to believe that there is a safe zone from which you will not lose hair over time. That contradicts the whole nature of the HT. While I have heard about people debating such a topic, I would think they would inform you of this with certainty before your surgery if they strongly believe this or know this to be fact. Did they ?

 

They next present the growth phases of hair to you as if that is also responsible for what happened, but they do not comment on it further. Maybe that is used as their reason for you to have to wait longer ? Like you, I can only guess about the exact meaning of some aspects of the message.

 

It is unfortunate that you must wait a lot longer to address this with them and to be able to correct it. It is very common for doctors to make patients wait an eternity when something goes wrong. Most of the time it is unnecessary in the cases I have seen online. Maybe your situation will change somehow and resolve itself.

 

I know you were not happy about using meds, but consider that nearly everyone who has a HT takes them. It is usually just part of it. If you have already tried Propecia, you can consider trying Avodart . Even though it is stronger, the half life is longer and you do not have to take it every single day and it could possibly make the side effect issue better for you ? The study using Avodart actually showed any side effects reported went away after using it a short time.There is only one way to know for sure and that is to try it .

 

Obviously, the best thing about the message from them is that it is clear they did offer to fix this for you for FREE if it does not clear up somehow.

 

Hang in there and wait it out knowing it will be resolved in one way or another !

[Mickeydw]

I remember asking the question to dr Hakan if my transplanted hair will ever fall out and he said NO!

this was before the procedure and now they are saying different when my HT hairs actually fall out?! :rolleyes:

 

I won't be flying back to Turkey for a free touch up either. even though they offered just don't think I can go through another procedure with them again.

[Melvin- Admin]

I still don't understand how the transplanted hair fell out, if it was taken from a zone that was bound to bald, then why isn't your crown bald? something is not computing, this is a very strange case, I wouldn't go back to a doctor if I wasn't happy even if they paid me, when dealing with a finite donor supply you need to use the grafts wisely, I would suggest going to another hair restoration surgeon and have him examine you, could it be DUPA diffused unpatterned alopecia? it just seems very strange that your crown doesn't look like its balding so why would transplanted hair from the crown fall out if the hairs on your crown haven't.

[CJD]

I remember asking the question to dr Hakan if my transplanted hair will ever fall out and he said NO!

this was before the procedure and now they are saying different when my HT hairs actually fall out?! :rolleyes:

 

I won't be flying back to Turkey for a free touch up either. even though they offered just don't think I can go through another procedure with them again.

 

 

Mickeydw, this is NOT good. That means that Dr. Hakan did not tell you the truth in person when you specifically asked about the issue. It also seems he is structuring his answer to shift blame off of him. They did tell you in your message that they are following this thread on the forum. It appears they are trying to now give an answer to refute what people have thought might be the cause of the problem and thereby shift the blame off of them.

 

Not being honest is a big deal breaker for me ...PERIOD. I can understand an honest mistake or a subpar result that results from the risk a HT provides. I certainly don't blame you for not wanting to go back to that place nor to the same doctor that caused the problem and has now replied in this way. Not being honest will break anyone's trust. It seems you asked questions before the surgery which is the right thing to do. That is all a patient can do and puts a patient at the total mercy of the doctor's honesty. Most of the time when doctors offer to do a free surgery over again, people commend them for doing the right thing. Personally, I think the right thing to do would be to give them the choice of having a free surgery or money back so that they can seek help elsewhere. Giving a free surgery costs the doctor next to nothing. You seeking help from someone else still costs you a similar price. Only offering a free surgery is holding the patient hostage in a way.

 

If anyone is considering going to this doctor, this thread should be an advertisement for not going there now after finding out the latest details. I have seen people make similar comments to this lately in other threads . I warn people often about Dr. Erdogan based upon what has happened to several people I know and the evidence I have personally seen. As I mentioned before, they did not ever respond to the people in those situations. People see what they think is a good result or two online and can't understand why bad stories and bad results aren't flooding the forums and posted by doctors. They don't want to believe someone could be treated badly or a doctor could be dishonest so they still continue to go forward after being warned. It seems no amount of evidence is enough for them to believe. Based on what I have now learned from this thread, I would recommend Turkey be a place people stay away from for HT's . If you have already been there, consider yourself lucky if you had success. Of course that is my opinion, but it is an opinion I formed from evidence I have seen in the stories I know about.

 

Mickeydw, please update us on how things are going and what your plans are. Keep this thread alive . Best of luck to you !!!!!

[mosd]

is he still a recommended dr on this site?

[Scandinavian]

This is not a nice read.

I am considering this doc for a transplant myself.

 

Did you consider Dr Bhatti in India also? That would have been closer to you and Australia.

[Mickeydw]

This is not a nice read.

I am considering this doc for a transplant myself.

 

Did you consider Dr Bhatti in India also? That would have been closer to you and Australia.

 

I was thinking about it but I didn't see any good results from him as I wasn't following any cases this was when he was first started

to pop up on this fourm

 

I'am consdering Dr Bahatti for a future HT as I'll be following some cases of his on this forum.

 

I'm not sure if Dr Hakan is still a Recommened Doc on here?!

Edited October 4, 2015 by Mickeydw

[Mickeydw]

Mickeydw, this is NOT good. That means that Dr. Hakan did not tell you the truth in person when you specifically asked about the issue. It also seems he is structuring his answer to shift blame off of him. They did tell you in your message that they are following this thread on the forum. It appears they are trying to now give an answer to refute what people have thought might be the cause of the problem and thereby shift the blame off of them.

 

Not being honest is a big deal breaker for me ...PERIOD. I can understand an honest mistake or a subpar result that results from the risk a HT provides. I certainly don't blame you for not wanting to go back to that place nor to the same doctor that caused the problem and has now replied in this way. Not being honest will break anyone's trust. It seems you asked questions before the surgery which is the right thing to do. That is all a patient can do and puts a patient at the total mercy of the doctor's honesty. Most of the time when doctors offer to do a free surgery over again, people commend them for doing the right thing. Personally, I think the right thing to do would be to give them the choice of having a free surgery or money back so that they can seek help elsewhere. Giving a free surgery costs the doctor next to nothing. You seeking help from someone else still costs you a similar price. Only offering a free surgery is holding the patient hostage in a way.

 

If anyone is considering going to this doctor, this thread should be an advertisement for not going there now after finding out the latest details. I have seen people make similar comments to this lately in other threads . I warn people often about Dr. Erdogan based upon what has happened to several people I know and the evidence I have personally seen. As I mentioned before, they did not ever respond to the people in those situations. People see what they think is a good result or two online and can't understand why bad stories and bad results aren't flooding the forums and posted by doctors. They don't want to believe someone could be treated badly or a doctor could be dishonest so they still continue to go forward after being warned. It seems no amount of evidence is enough for them to believe. Based on what I have now learned from this thread, I would recommend Turkey be a place people stay away from for HT's . If you have already been there, consider yourself lucky if you had success. Of course that is my opinion, but it is an opinion I formed from evidence I have seen in the stories I know about.

 

Mickeydw, please update us on how things are going and what your plans are. Keep this thread alive . Best of luck to you !!!!!

 

Some Money back would be nice, not sure if I've followed a case were the doc is actually wiling to do this!