'Age Appropriate' - Whats that?

[MikeTheDane]

Many posters on these forums advocate a mature hairline that will look natural as you age. Much of their argument is based on how unnatural a low hairline would look as you grow older.

 

Of course, if grafts is the restricting factor, then that's definitely a solid argument, but for the cases where grafts aren't, I think that the general consensus for what's natural and what isn't could use a revision.

 

For example, womens favorite silverfox George Clooney at age 49:

 

 

Now whether or not his hair is natural or not is irrelevant, the point is that he has a perfect NW2 hairline at nearly half a century old. I think it looks awesome, as do most.

 

Brad Pitt's hairline is even lower while only 3 years George's junior.

 

I'm not idolizing celebrities at all, they were just the archetype of well known people with amazing hairlines.

 

So what about old age, nearing the end of your life? Here's a pic of Sean Connery at the age of 70.

 

He's probably using a hairpiece in this one though. Still, I think it looks great. I haven't seen any doctors creating preteen NW1 hairlines (that would indeed look unnatural), but I've seen 60-70 year old NW2's in real life and they've never looked unnatural other than the fact that it subtracted 10-15 years from their appearance.

[TC17]

I don't think the issue is whether a NW 2 would look nice on an 80 year old, it would. The issue is whether a NW 2 hairline on an 80 year old with MPB would look good, it wouldn't. George Clooney looks great, bu this hair is thick all over. If he had that hairline and a bald spot, or that hairline but a density of 25 or 30, it would look bad.

[mahhong]

I think that's the issue. George Clooney's hair is natural and it looks good because, well, it's his hair. If he had low density or a thin crown/vertex and ridiculously thick hairline he'd just look weird.

 

Incidentally Sean Connery is most definitely wearing a hairpiece there. He went bald very early and wore a hairpiece from his second Bond movie onwards. Not that it invalidates your argument, just thought I'd put that out there.

 

Getting a hair transplant is about planning for the future; will you need more, how much further hair will be lost etc. If you could guarantee your hairloss had stopped or know without reservation you had enough donor hair to cover your needs with good density you could probably get a NW2 hairline but you'd look beyond awful if you had the first inch of an NW2 hairline, then patchy hairloss and thinning. No respectful doctor would want to be responsible for that and no self-respecting patient would want to be the recipient of it.

 

I don't think the hairlines you're showing are impossible with a hair transplant it's just you need to build up to that sort of a hairline (if you can) and not just "whack it in" and see what happens. I think most men would rather have a mature hairline with good density than a younger looking hairline you could see straight through.

[Megatron]

I just don't think anyone with MPB should or could have hair like Clooney or Pitt. I think guys with MPB should aim for Nw 2 which would look more natural with their characteristics. I know it's difficult to make generalizations like this, but that's my two cents.

 

btw - Clooney is a NW 1 at most.

[MikeTheDane]

My point goes for cases where the patient is expected to have enough grafts to cover future balding patches, and achieve a decent density for the hairline.

 

For example the 55 year old NW3 that has been on propecia for 3 years and has had no advancements in his hair loss would be a great candicate to achieve a youthful hairline. Perhaps not Clooney level, but you get the picture. Personally I started balding early, so in my case I did have to use some restraint with the hairline, but for far older people I think that a lower hairline can benefit the appearance without looking unnaturally youthful.

 

If you cannot get the grafts to support it in the first place, then of course, I agree that it's a bad idea.

 

Megatron, from my understanding NW1 are preteens and girls/women, but perhaps you're right. Still, NW2 would still look great on most people past their teens to their grave, so I guess the point stands.

[MikeTheDane]

 

 

Here's one of Johnny Depp. Probably a more realistic scenario, and another example of someone in their late forties with great hairlines (without being freakishly perfect like clooney or pitt)

[Megatron]

if you google norwood scale pictures you'll see that even NW 1 shows recession in the temple area. I don't hardly any recession in Clooney or Pitt and just a little in Depp.

 

When I look at Depp's picture I see a little recession, but the remaining hair is thick and dense. Guys with MPB don't have the characterestics to look anything like that and that's why I get so annoyed when I see HT doctors saying things like, "I'll make you look like the guys in GQ" - that's actually a Dr. Armani saying.

 

Unrealistic expectations are a recipe for disaster.

[MikeTheDane]

Very well then.

[EpilepticSceptic]

I think the "illusion" of Depp's hair could be acheivable for a NW4 that would likely not advance much further, but only after about 10,000 grafts. So the patient would have to have good donor density, great laxity, be older than 40, and have very stable hairloss. Who knows, Depps hair might not look that full in real life either.

 

But I've seen H & W patients that were not past NW4 acheive a head of hair that looks that good -- but only after a major # of grafts. A photo that LondonLad posted recently looks to be on the same level as Depp's hair.

 

Clooney and Pitt I doubt anybody but a NW2-3 could get there with HT. But who needs THAT much hair to look good anyway ?

[MikeTheDane]

That's a good point labrat. Londonlad is an exception as he received what, 11000 grafts? However he was very bald afaik. Like you say, a NW4 could achieve 'Depp' look with rigorious use of grafts, given the proper donor and hairloss situations ofc.

[TC17]

Why do you think so, spex?

 

And guys, let's not forget the ultimate two of ridiculous hair that makes me jealous, Ronald Reagan and Andrew Napolitano.

[TC17]

Assuming those pictures accurately represent his hairline, I think you're right. I never would have guessed that he had anything done.

[MikeTheDane]

I never would have guessed. Did armani work on him? Lol..

 

Considering the density, is it possible that he is wearing temple specific hairpiece?

[mahhong]

I hate to sound like a celebrity columnist here with all my "juicy" facts but, interestingly, George Clooney was unwilling to have his hair shaved for a role in the film 'Syriana'. He put on a lot of weight for the film but originally they wanted to give him a bald head (just on top I think) to make him look older and he refused, citing the rather witty but distracting argument that he was "afraid it would never grow back". We all know that if you're not suffering from MPB that's scientifically incorrect (I'd imagine Clooney's physician would know that all too well!) so my hunch is he was hiding a scar or didn't want to mess with his hair too much.

 

I feel like some dirty columnist from Heat magazine, but, there we go, just wanted to get that in!

[Severn]

 

This is Judge Napolitano from Fox News. It's his real hair but it certainly isn't age appropriate. He looks like a mongoloid.

[TheEmperor]

Its possible for a hairline to be too high to provide cosmetic advantage.

 

Hair tranplant can take a bald guy and make him "not bald", but that is not the same thing as reframing his face.

 

My new hairline is higher than any hairline I had, even when receeding and it doesnt frame my face in the way that I would have hoped. So while I am not "bald", I did not achieve any facial balance.

 

Lots of things plan into whether or not a lower hairline can be achieved or whether it is appropriate, however I agree with the OPs argument. An artifically "mature" hairline is not necessarily more appropriate than a NW1 hairline. The question is whether it can be pulled off or not.

 

When hairline matures in most men (not MPB), I think there is some temple recession and overall thinning which makes the hairline more see through. This makes the hairline _look_ higher, but it is actually not so. When HT docs plant a hairline 1-2cm higher than the original hairline, it is only because there would not be enough grafts to cover more area. But make no mistake. This is not desirable.

[Sparky]

lol defo a hairpiece on Connery! hes totally bald, he was bald when he was bond!

[Sparky]

That is Clooneys natural hair, I read an article saying that he shaved his hair into that shape when he was on ER, hes done it on several films aswell, you can see the hairline shadow on The Perfect Storm, where it has been shaved off, it looks like beard stuble but on his hairline.

[MikeTheDane]

Originally posted by Severn:

 

This is Judge Napolitano from Fox News. It's his real hair but it certainly isn't age appropriate. He looks like a mongoloid.

 

I disagree. If he was to lose 25 pounds and get a different hairstyle it would look great.

[MikeTheDane]

Originally posted by Sparky:

That is Clooneys natural hair, I read an article saying that he shaved his hair into that shape when he was on ER, hes done it on several films aswell, you can see the hairline shadow on The Perfect Storm, where it has been shaved off, it looks like beard stuble but on his hairline.

 

The plot thickens..

[Sparky]

I'd have that Judge guys hairline anyday.

[Megatron]

 

 

Personally, if you have MPB I think you should be aiming for a Tom Hanks look as opposed to the Hollywood hunks like Clooney, Pitt and Depp. I happen to disagree with Emperor. I think a higher, hairline is more desireable in most guys over 35.

[TheEmperor]

Originally posted by Megatron:

 

 

Personally, if you have MPB I think you should be aiming for a Tom Hanks look as opposed to the Hollywood hunks like Clooney, Pitt and Depp. I happen to disagree with Emperor. I think a higher, hairline is more desireable in most guys over 35.

 

It can look natural on a man who is in his 50s. But Tom Hanks hairline makes him look older than he is. If he lowered his hairline, he would look alot better.

 

That is the point I was making. Its possible to make an advanced NW "not bald", but unless the hairline is (say) within .5cm of where the original one was, the original face framing, the face proportions will still be out of whack.

 

And this is why baldness looks bad on some men, because it draws their features out of proportion. Not having hair is secondary.

[MikeTheDane]

The discussion is not so much about what's a good idea for someone who is limited by donor and age factors, but rather discussing how it would look on someone who has the right age and donor characteristics to achieve a youthful hairline (and get away with it). In cases like that, I do not believe that a 'mature' approach isn't necessarily the end-all approach.

[mattj]

Originally posted by Sparky:

That is Clooneys natural hair, I read an article saying that he shaved his hair into that shape when he was on ER, hes done it on several films aswell, you can see the hairline shadow on The Perfect Storm, where it has been shaved off, it looks like beard stuble but on his hairline.

That info fits with a photo that I found (but can no longer locate) where I noticed stubble at his hairline. It was a hi-res portrait.