Jump to content

Bosley or MHR


Recommended Posts

  • Replies 106
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Bill, I don't mean to be presumptuous, but I think the sad face is that he already laid down $2,500.00 of his hard earned money by working two jobs & was looking foward to his new hair & confidence.

 

Instead, he has us telling him to cut his losses by cancelling his Bosley procedure, Run like hell, loose his money, not get a hairtransplant right now.

 

Give him something to smile about...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Senior Member

Power Ranger,

 

Something to smile about...search thru and look at some of the poor results all over the internet. You've possibly just avoided looking and feeling worse. icon_smile.gif

 

 

As I stated earlier. Possibly this Dr. is one of the few employed by Bosley that is OK, but we all need to see and hear the proof before we will recommend him. Sorry.

 

 

I truly do feel for you as this is not the news you wanted to hear from us. Do everything possible to try and get your deposit back---or postpone your surgery and I would think they would honor your deposit.

 

Here is another thought. There is a poster on here that went to Bosley I believe and was treated by a female doctor that did a great job from what I could tell in the photos. Will they allow you to transfer the deposit to a procedure at another office?? You might have to travel but at least you wouldn't lose $2500. Look into that as an option.

 

Good luck my friend. icon_smile.gif

 

 

NN

NN

 

Dr.Cole,1989. ??graftcount

Dr. Ron Shapiro. Aug., 2007

Total graft count 2862

Total hairs 5495

1hairs--916

2hairs--1349

3hairs--507

4hairs--90

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

Good afternoon,

 

This thread at this particular forum was brought to my attention yesterday by a prospective patient. I hope that that patient is reading this because I would like to boldly speak out and say:

 

Fact: Lots of people are getting paid to post here.

 

Fact: If a doctor is good but do not want to pay, he will not be listed on this website.

 

Fact: The numerous pictures and patient testimonies on the Bosley website are REAL.

 

Fact: Bosley routinely remove doctors from our list of doctors if they fail to give quality and consistent results similar to the recommended doctors of this website.

 

Fact: A lot of the bad stigma about Bosley that has been highly publicized are from procedures done years ago with older technique that was only available at the time. There are risks as in any surgery.

 

Fact: Laser therapy is the third treatment in the history of the FDA to be approved to treat hairloss.

 

Fact: Copper Peptides are proven to be beneficial in aiding the healing process post op.

 

Fact: I know for a fact that my posting privileges and post will be removed because I'm stirring up "trouble".

 

TRUTH:

There are educational information on this website. However, this forums is dominated by a handful of clinics that hire people to proactively post on the forum. Thus clinics earn a reputation not based on their actual work but visibilty. Patients end up with a deceptive fixated view on a handful of clinics and miss the holistic picture of what the HT industry is really like. In my opinion, some of you are unnecessaryingly and disgustingly scaring, confusing and giving out inaccurate information to prospective patients.

 

I feel I am extremely knowledgable of what goes on in the HT industry so go head, bring out your arguments in an articulate backed-up manner. But be careful with what you say because I will quote you back and take the pleasure to discredit each and everyone of you who dare to come forth.

 

 

 

youngsuccess, I see you called me a bimbo. Well..... two can play that game, little boy.

 

 

 

-Grace

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Senior Member

Grace,

 

Thanks for posting to this forum. I appreciate you taking the time for the benefit of your potential client.

 

One thing to remember though, we didn't seek him out, he came to us. I personally don't believe that the owner of this site would choose to kick you off if you continue to post in a civilized and professional manner.

 

Would you mind aswering some questions?

 

1. Do you stand to benefit financially if Power Ranger is a client?

 

2. Do you honestly believe that your doctor is as good as the best on this site?

 

3. Can we see quality photos of pre, immediately post and 1yr. post of sessions 2500+?

 

4. Can Power Ranger use his deposit at another Bosley office? If not, Why?

 

5. Why such a large, non-refundable deposit?

 

6. How many techs will work during a 2500 fu session?

 

7. Would you trust this Dr. with a close relative of yours?

 

8. Do you believe that money is not a major motivator for Bosley?

 

9. Are there more skilled docs than the one that Power Ranger scheduled with?--not just Bosley. Remember that you posted on a forum that you are very knowledgeable about HT's.

 

10. Don't you want your client comfortable with where he goes, even if it is not your clinic?

 

Thanks for taking the time. I respect you taking an interest. I hope that you can enlighten us all and we can feel comfortable in recommending that Power Ranger continue with his scheduled appointment. Take care.

 

NN

NN

 

Dr.Cole,1989. ??graftcount

Dr. Ron Shapiro. Aug., 2007

Total graft count 2862

Total hairs 5495

1hairs--916

2hairs--1349

3hairs--507

4hairs--90

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Senior Member

Grace,

 

Since you dared us, I will come forth icon_rolleyes.gif. The Bosley reputation preceeds itself. Do you think the negative posts from real patients who have photographic proof of there crappy work are made up by other clinics and paid posters???

 

Please continue to attack ths forum and the posters here, it only serves to show how afraid you are of facing the truth about your hair mill.

 

By the way, how many top doctors do you have working there currently?? Nevermind, anyone who is any good will quickly leave your company.

 

Also, check my signature, I am not paid to push for any doctor!!!!

NoBuzz

 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Senior Member

11 - Has Powerranger seen the consent form or even the doctor for that matter ? If not he can P.M. me so I can explain it to him and what INFORMED CONSENT is.

Noone would ever be obligated to pay for services not yet rendered , under false pretences.

Why doesn't "Grace" enlighten us on what informed consent is, as well as the Bosley " position on that, while I back up my next post.

You also state that you are affiliated with Bosley. Medical, Sales or Threat management?

Because you are offering medical advice and I want to be clear.

We kinda like trouble makers around here. As well as sucking sounds going South.

A hair on the head is worth two on the brush.

I don't work for commision.. I bust e'm for free. Thank me later.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Senior Member

I'll take this "fact" by fact, if you don't mind.

 

FACT: Many posters are not paid to post here, and most of your most vehement critics within this thread are not.

 

FACT: The doctors recommended on this site reside on the vanguard of hair transplantation, and serve to provide the best service which is ultimately what we all want.

 

FACT: Yes, the numerous (horror) stories documented about Bosley certaintly are, unfortunately, real.

 

FACT: Perhaps you do fire *some* doctors....just like some doctors choose to leave because they are put off by both your sales tactics and quality of work.

 

FACT: There are risks in any surgery, sadly for Bosley patients those risks are exponentially greater than with any number of the doctors recommended on this website.

 

FACT: Laser therapy's efficacy is murky at best....but hey, you are offering the young man TWO FREE LASER SESSIONS!!!!!! if only he will just follow through and sign his follicular sould over to you...hey, can't beat that offer.

 

FACT: Ok.....

 

FACT: Well, assuming you don't go totally spastic I look forward to your final "fact" being brutally slaughtered as well.

 

But hey, rolling the dice with this young man's life really means nothing to you....well, wait, it actually might mean a few $$$$$.

 

The information within this thread I suspect will continue to bolster the points and perspectives initially set forth; hopefully, this will aid others in the future as well as PowerRanger himself.

-----------

*A Follicles Dying Wish To Clinics*

1 top-down, 1 portrait, 1 side-shot, 1 hairline....4 photos. No flash.

Follicles have asked for centuries, in ten languages, as many times so as to confuse a mathematician.

Enough is enough! Give me documentation or give me death!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Senior Member

Grace,

 

Your ignorance is showing.

 

Fact: Very few people get paid to post here, and those that do nearly always identify their affiliation with their respective doc/company.

 

Fact: If the doc is good, the folks on this site will be the first to say so.

 

Fact: While Bosley may have some good docs, the facts are that they have also had/have many bad ones based upon the various lawsuits.

 

Fact: If you're going to claim that your docs can produce results similar to the docs listed in this site, prove it by providing mega-session photos [not blurry or manipulated photos] for before, after, 1 year, etc.

 

Fact: The bad stigma about Bosley is deserved. Your defensive position in your post just further shows the Bosley way. Are you concerned that PowerRanger might actually do some research & realize that he may not get what you've promised? Or worse yet, that he may end up in litigation with Bosley like others before him?

 

Fact: Laser therapy is a rip-off that benefits only the seller. Just because the FDA approved it's use doesn't mean it has any benefit. Do you have any "scientific" proof that it works? Since nobody else does, it would be an incredible thing for Bosley to have some proof.

 

Fact: Copper peptide may be beneficial for some, but I used it for my first procedure after paying a pretty penny & noticed NO difference vs. the HT when I did not use it. Bottom line, I considered it a waste of money.

 

Fact: If you really had PowerRanger's best interest at heart, you would refund his deposit if he got cold feet, especially if he didn't meet with his proposed doctor.

 

By the way, exactly what is your age, position, training, education, & experience?

 

Which docs have you trained with/worked with?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Senior Member

"youngsuccess, I see you called me a bimbo. Well..... two can play that game, little boy."

 

OHHHHH!! BURNED!! OWNED!!! I shouldn't have "play[ed] that game" with you Grace!

 

You started it: we're all using cunning rhetoric to deceive this kid right? That's what you told him, right? We're all liars paid to post here?

 

I will not retract my "bimbo" remark! Nevahhhhh!!! icon_biggrin.gif

-------

 

All opinions are my own and my advice should not constitute as medical advice.

 

View my My Hair Loss Website

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Grace,

 

It looks like you are going to have your work cut out for you since there will be a number of people to reply to.

 

There are a number of things you said that are indeed true, and there is no sense in denying them...after all, this IS an educational forum and we desire that the truth is spoken. At the same time, there are statements that you made that are false - or have only spoken half of the truth.

 

Allow me to make some comments on your comments

 

Fact: Lots of people are getting paid to post here.

 

 

Nobody is paid to post here directly. But now we are talking about a handful of people, not "lots of people". But let's be clear...the site owner does NOT pay people to post here. But those who represent clinics, I'm sure, as part of their job, indirectly are paid to post on the forums - as that's part of their job. Those who represent clinics must reveal this in their signature just as you. Hey, since you represent Bosley, aren't you being "paid" to post here by your clinic?

 

Fact: If a doctor is good but do not want to pay, he will not be listed on this website.

 

 

Yes, this is true - however, you have failed to mention the other half of the truth. Just as well, there are clinics who WANT to be listed on this website who aren't being admitted into membership because they don't meet the high level of standards that this community requires.

 

Fact: The numerous pictures and patient testimonies on the Bosley website are REAL.

 

 

Since I can't prove it one way or another, I can't speak for that and won't attempt to dispute it...however...

 

Just the same...all of the pictures and testimonies from dissatisfied Bosley patients on this forum are real. This is not particular to this forum - other forums reveal the same information. Do the research...use this forum and others...see how many dissatisfied patients there are? Reality is shown not by testimonies from a commercial website, but by real patients posting on free forums.

 

I will say, however, that Bosley infomercials are extremely misleading. If you disagree, feel free to tell me that and I'll list my reasons for this.

 

Fact: Bosley routinely remove doctors from our list of doctors if they fail to give quality and consistent results similar to the recommended doctors of this website.

 

 

I'm glad to hear it. Again, I am not going to try to dispute something I don't know about. How can I possibley know about the business practices of Bosley? But you have to deal with the fact that the majority if patients from Bosley that post on this and other forums are dissatisfied. The results speak for themselves.

 

Fact: A lot of the bad stigma about Bosley that has been highly publicized are from procedures done years ago with older technique that was only available at the time. There are risks as in any surgery.

 

 

Yes, I agree that some of the bad stigma Bosley have received is based on the past. But what have you to say about Seth's results from Bosley? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iOdbXnsx9do&mode=related&search. Do you think these results are top quality? After all, he went on national TV with Bosley to promote this work. Now compare this work to the videos you see on www.hassonandwong.com for example. Do you see a difference? Be honest with me...tell me what you think?

 

Fact: Laser therapy is the third treatment in the history of the FDA to be approved to treat hairloss.

 

 

Sadly, since the lasercombe has become FDA approved, many clinics such as Advanced Hair Studio hide behind words such as this. Unfortunately, there is still no evidence that the lasercomb and other laser devices help with hair loss. I encourage you to read the following article so you understand what FDA approval for medical devices really means. http://hair-restoration-info.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/146...701040113#8701040113.

 

I'll add that very few credible doctors hold firm that laser therapy does anything to fight against hair loss.

 

Fact: Copper Peptides are proven to be beneficial in aiding the healing process post op.

 

 

I do believe that Copper Peptides can assist with the healing process post op - but there is no proof that it will regrow hair (some have claimed this is true).

 

Fact: I know for a fact that my posting privileges and post will be removed because I'm stirring up "trouble".

 

 

To me, this is not stirring up trouble, and at this point, I see no reason that your posting priviledges would be removed. However, if you become like a virus with the intent to spread lies, then yes, this will happen. But I prefer having a HEALTHY debate over seeing someone get banned for sharing their opinions.

 

There are educational information on this website. However, this forums is dominated by a handful of clinics that hire people to proactively post on the forum.

 

 

So what? Even if clinics are paying some employees as part of their job to post on this and other forums...where is the harm in this? What about you? Are you here on your own time or are you being paid by Bosley to post here? I can't prove you are being paid for posting here and certainly you can't prove that members of other clinics are being paid to post here. But it IS safe to assume that consultants of any clinic are compensated for their job which may or may not include posting on this community.

 

Thus clinics earn a reputation not based on their actual work but visibilty. Patients end up with a deceptive fixated view on a handful of clinics and miss the holistic picture of what the HT industry is really like. In my opinion, some of you are unnecessaryingly and disgustingly scaring, confusing and giving out inaccurate information to prospective patients.

 

 

We do not stop clinics who are not recommended on this community from coming here and posting their patient's results. Heck...we encourage it. Clearly those clinics who are proud of their work would want to post publicly for the world to see! Are you willing to rise to the challenge? Post your clinic's results and let's see if they can stand up to the standards of this community. Heck, I hope they do! I'm not ANTI-Bosley, despite what you might think. My statements are from the evidence I've seen over the years, however, and unfortunately, Bosley has proven to be disappointing. Change my mind!

 

I feel I am extremely knowledgable of what goes on in the HT industry so go head, bring out your arguments in an articulate backed-up manner. But be careful with what you say because I will quote you back and take the pleasure to discredit each and everyone of you who dare to come forth.

 

 

Good...I encourage a good debate. I am not going to say anything that is false. I will admit what I do not know to be 100% true - can you? Unfortunately, you have already made a number of accusations based on your assumptions rather than actual facts. I hope if you are going to debate with me (or any of us), that you change your tune a bit and debate what you KNOW to be true.

 

I am willing to be open minded when it comes to what Bosley can provide. But as we know, Bosley is a company. Results come from a doctor and their technicians. So I encourage you that if you post before/after high resolution pictures, to also name the doctor, number of grafts and hair count breakdowns.

 

youngsuccess, I see you called me a bimbo. Well..... two can play that game, little boy.

 

 

This is childish and stirring up trouble. And yes, Youngsuccess was childish when he called you a bimbo too. But you will quickly lose credibility if you fight fire with fire. Stand up and speak the truth...don't stoop to name calling.

 

You have to remember...

 

People here believe what they see. And the results posted on this and other forums from Bosley are far from impressive IMO and unfortunately, most have reported disappointment. So though you may have walked into a hostile crowd, I encourage you to attempt to win people over with gentle and truthful words, before/after pictures and details of surgical experiences, rather than attempt to beat people down.

 

Cheers,

 

Bill

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

Oh dear.... I never knew I was so popular. You all act like a mob. Anyways, since you guys want to come a long for the ride? Let's go.

 

 

 

Your answers, NervousNelly -

 

1). Yes, I am salaried but not commissioned similar to other consultants of doctors listed on this website.

 

2). Yes, on par with many of the recommended doctors performing single-strip, microscopic follicular unit transplantation.

 

3). We do not do a lot of sessions above 2500 because that is not approach that we like to take. We have a more conversative philosophy similar to a lot of clinics recommended on this website. I do not have pictures of 2500+ session sizes. Lots of patients, especially young patients, like PowerRanger, do not need a 2500+ session. I am surprised that you didn't know that being a doctor and all yourself.

 

4). No, we operate autonomously.

 

5). The amount we ask of the deposit is at our discretion. It is no one else's business kinda like how some of your coalition clinic charge a whopping $5 per graft. This information about our deposit is known in advanced.

 

6). We have very skilled 3 techs, and one more will be joining our practice shortly. Our doctor places close to half of the grafts and the hairline unlike some of the doctors recommended on this website.

 

7). I don't know what this questions has to do with anything. But yes, if my husband for example needed a hair transplant I would recommend him.

 

8). Like any independent clinic that your site promotes, profit is essential. I sense that you do not know how it is like to run a business.

 

9). I know what you are trying to do here by cunningly cornering me with this questions. I know how to conduct myself with humility so yes, there are more "skilled" doctors who are more "hyped". As I said before, not everyone needs a BMW when a robust honda civic is adequate.

 

10). Yes I do.

 

 

 

nobuzz4me -

 

If you have any questions or concerns, ask them. Stop with the insinuation those smiley faces. I implore you to look at the dates at which those procedures with bad outcome were done - a long time ago. As stated doctors who perform bad results are remove just like how it's done in this website. The doctors that I've worked for have been very good.

 

 

 

Youngsuccess -

 

I demand that you apologize to me and retract that bimbo comment at once or else I won't hold back on the ammunitions. Why don't you tell the world who did your HT? Why are you even still here dwelling on this forum? Are you dissatisfied with the results? That's it isn't it? If it isn't why don't you put your mane to good use and go get laid for once in your life.

 

 

 

Aquarius -

 

Yes, indeed, PowerRanger has seen, readed and signed the consent form. I serve as Administrator for a particular Bosley clinic. I am not a doctor and my advice is not to be takened as such. However I stand by my statement about the laser therapy and copper peptides. Lastly, I could take serious offense to your last comment to me. I sense that you are nothing but a foul-mouth wanker.

 

 

 

thanatopsis_awry -

 

I don't take your belittling comments lightly. You sound like the 21 year that you are. You are still young and very ignorant about the industry. Let me give you a little homework: This site has promoted the term "Ultra-Refined" follicular unit transplantation. Go up and call up let's say 10 clinics on the recommended list and see if they even know the term. In addition to address your concerns about our advanced laser therapy, please note that even minoxidil nor finasterides works on everyone either but it doesn't mean it wil not work on some. The scientific proof that laser therapy works on some patients is documented on the FDA website, if you are electronically-challenged to look that up, PM me and I'll find the direct link for you, ok? How did your SAT go? Got into Yale's Divinity School yet or did you only UConn accepted you...

 

 

 

Rhodemn -

 

I want you to take a deep look in the mirror to see who is the ignorant one.

 

Very few people get paid? Ok let's see from my research in just a few hours I found..... Jotronic, Spex, Tha Joe, TheHairlosscure, Janna, Ailene, Jessica4Limmer, hairtechnician, do you want me to go on? There are probably a lot more that don't disclose the info as you think.

 

You should be aware that the media overly hype everything up.

 

As stated we do not do megasession of 3000+ often. I want to restate that the majority of people of don't need this. I'm also suspect that everyone posting in this forum are all NW7+ like you.

 

Minoxidil and finasteride, both are FDA approved do not work for everyone similar to the laser therapy will not work for everyone. Here is the proof that it works on some patients: http://www.fda.gov/cdrh/pdf6/K060305.pdf

 

AS for the copper peptides, if you don't know what SOD stand for then you are not conversant in this so I advise you do more research or ask any respected HT doctor the benefit of copper peptides for post op.

 

As for the desposit of PowerRange, you don't understand either how it is like to operate a business. Even this website is a business. You have no empathy at all. Ok, I'll talk to my supervisor about this. Consider as a favor to demonstrate we are not soul-less sharks as you hype us to be.

 

I just turned 30 last week - the big 3 O, if you must know. I have a background in Human Resources and Public relations and have been working in the HT industry for over 5 years. I am not a doctor and never claimed to be. As for my education, I am a graduate of the Industrial and Labor Relations School at Cornell - heard of it?

 

 

 

Bill -

 

First, I don't plan regularly post on here like the other consultants of other clinics. I have better and more important things to do. For some consultants that's what they do all day long manipulating all sorts of info on the forums. I'm not going to stoop down that low.

 

You know what? I'm not saying that the clinics listed on this website are bad. It's just the forum has a mob mentality like: "oh I never heard of this surgery, he better post some immediate post op otherwise he's work is probably not up to par". You got to understand that good doctors are busy trying very hard to keep their business running smoothly.

 

Also check the dates as to when the procedure of the "disasters stories" were performed. Most of them were a long time ago when older techniques are used. One or two bad clinics is not representative work of all the clincs under the Bosley umbrella.

 

As for the youtube video. You know what?, the one thing that most people forget to stress is that if the patient is happy, that's what counts.

 

As for the lasercomb, I bet you haven't read the scientific studies. I bet you don't even know who were the authors and all you go by is just layman word of mouth. I'm sorry but there are a few of your coalition doctors that even recommend laser therapy.

 

Never said copper peptides regrow. I standby my previous statment that SOD (hope you know what that stands for) copper peptides have been proven to help the healing process, period.

 

I'm not hear to change your mind about think. If you don't know what you are talking like you haven't seen the work of the clinic, shut up and don't say anything.

 

btw your new mane sure looks hot on you. May I ask if you're still single? icon_wink.gif

 

 

 

Ok yall, I might have missed addressing a few points because I have so many of you to address. I don't plan on continuing to post here on a regular basis since I have better things to do and I'm also going on a vacation in a day. So I have only one more day left for now to continue to challenge you all. I stand by on all of my points I made in my original post and I also want to point out that a lot of you rely on diluted or overhyped second-hand information and make extremely unedcuated and definitive statements. Some of you will be too ignorant to undestand this and this medium is not the most optimal for show and tell.

 

-Grace

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Senior Member

Grace,

 

1. Everyone needs a BMW when it comes to cosmetic surgery. I am travelling to Minneapolis to see Shapiro in 2 weeks. My research leads me to believe that he is a BMW and not a Honda.

 

2. I do know business. Treat people right and the money will come as a result.

 

 

A great business move and gesture would be to let Power Ranger out of his contract if he wants. Wouldn't that demonstrate the integrity and compassion of your doctor and clinic? Shouldn't his comfort level be a consideration?

 

NN

NN

 

Dr.Cole,1989. ??graftcount

Dr. Ron Shapiro. Aug., 2007

Total graft count 2862

Total hairs 5495

1hairs--916

2hairs--1349

3hairs--507

4hairs--90

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Grace,

 

Bill -

 

First, I don't plan regularly post on here like the other consultants of other clinics. I have better and more important things to do. For some consultants that's what they do all day long manipulating all sorts of info on the forums. I'm not going to stoop down that low.

 

 

It is a matter of your opinion that it is "stooping down" for consultants to showcase here. This is a PATIENT driven community and we are here for education and to help other members make INFORMED decisions.

 

You bring up words like "manipulation"...another accusatory word. Backup your words with evidence or as you said "shut up and don't say anything".

 

You know what? I'm not saying that the clinics listed on this website are bad. It's just the forum has a mob mentality like: "oh I never heard of this surgery, he better post some immediate post op otherwise he's work is probably not up to par". You got to understand that good doctors are busy trying very hard to keep their business running smoothly.

 

 

Education is power. I CERTAINLY do and will continue to advise perspective patients to go to a publicly documented doctor who yields consistent results over the unknown doctor. Why? Because it is risky to go into the unknown. Who should the patient listen to...company word of mouth? Because Bosley Medical has promised a good result, is that good enough?

 

There is a need for such a community like this because of how many companies that are out there bullying people and then they end up looking worse than they did before surgery. See this thread as a RECENT example (and this has nothing to do with Bosley).

 

http://hair-restoration-info.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/346...861/m/2031076772/p/1

 

Also check the dates as to when the procedure of the "disasters stories" were performed. Most of them were a long time ago when older techniques are used. One or two bad clinics is not representative work of all the clincs under the Bosley umbrella.

 

 

Some are from a long time ago, some are more recent. And though your statement "one or two bad clinics is not representative work of all the clinics under the Bosley umbrella" may be accurate, one can't ignore that the majority of PUBLIC information about Bosley is negative. Why is that? Where are all the satisfied Bosley patients?

 

As for the youtube video. You know what?, the one thing that most people forget to stress is that if the patient is happy, that's what counts.

 

 

Whether he is happy or not doesn't dispute that the results are sub-standard for today's standards. Don't get me wrong. I am happy that the patient is happy. The fact that this patient is satisfied with a sub-standard result is more likely because he doesn't know better can be achieved. Did you even look at his video and then compare it with the Hasson and Wong videos? Bosley took this guy on national TV to parade his results around...does this not represent the best Bosley can do? Now compare Bosley's best with Hasson and Wong's (or any other of our coalition doctors) best, and tell me...which do you think is better?

 

As for the lasercomb, I bet you haven't read the scientific studies. I bet you don't even know who were the authors and all you go by is just layman word of mouth. I'm sorry but there are a few of your coalition doctors that even recommend laser therapy.

 

 

I have read some of the scientific studies and they are weak at best - but you are right, I couldn't tell you the author's names off the top of my head. What about you? You try to dispute my knowledge of the topic with false assumptions. What do you know of the topic? Have you read the studies? I can resort to your level if you'd like and tell you that you don't know this or that either...but clearly this is a tactic only to attempt to appear superior. Using your words, "I'm not going to stoop that low".

 

Never said copper peptides regrow. I standby my previous statment that SOD (hope you know what that stands for) copper peptides have been proven to help the healing process, period.

 

 

Yes, I am familiar with the studies: Copper peptides are supposed to increase the amount of SOD in the body to detoxify itself. To me, however, wherefore I agree that copper peptides MAY improve the healing time post op, it is not necessary. Many doctors believe in a dry healing just as many believe in a wet healing.

 

By the way, nice attempt to appear superior in knowledge. Do we really want to play the abbreviation/acronym game? Besides, I'm really not interested to appear superior over you...I'm only interested in facts.

 

I'm not hear to change your mind about think. If you don't know what you are talking like you haven't seen the work of the clinic, shut up and don't say anything.

 

 

My dear...

 

Firstly, I have seen work from the clinic...remember the youtube video link that I posted? It's not impressive compared to today's standards, period.

 

There is evidence of other work from Bosley posted online...again, not impressive. Do you want me to go and find the links and post them back for you?

 

BUT...you have the chance now to display the work of your clinic right here. You are choosing to insult me and others instead of producing hardcore facts and photos? Why is that? This is a typical response of someone who can't produce such evidence. Give us what you got? Show us some hard facts and photos of any one of your clinic's latest work?

 

btw your new mane sure looks hot on you. May I ask if you're still single?

 

 

Thanks...I'll let my wife know you approve!

 

Bill

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Grace, Thanks for being brave enough to post here!

 

It is evident that there are a number of paid consultants for doctors on this forum.

 

I think you are entitled to debate here as anyone eles is.

 

The only thing I would ask of your clinic is to let Poweranger off the hook for now, he is not ready or a candidate.

 

This kid is not ready fot a Hairtransplant with any surgeon at this point.

 

I guess the one point I would half to make is that where Bosley will perform a HT on a 21 year old, my doctor would not.

 

Please, let this kid out of his contract, then when you get back from vacation, become a part of this forum, I am sure you can enlighten us on Bosley's philosophies!

 

Have a great vacation!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Senior Member

Grace, Grace, Grace....

 

I really don't *need* to belittle you, nor have I really tried -- you seem to do a truly marvelous job on your own, as you descend into hurling lame, ineffective personal attacks.

 

A true LOL @ that pseudo-imperious, pathetic attempt at an insult....not only do you prove yourself (once again) to be an ass by hurling a *very* weak insult -- in this case to a fine university -- which, I have zero affiliation with; but, your post manages to reach epic lameness when you ramble incoherent about divinity school (icon_smile.gif); and, topping things off, you bring up SATs in a desperate (and once again patheticly inane) attempt to compensate for your company's tawdry, ugly, inferior makeup...which, by the way, you seem to be an excellent reflection of! Tsk, Tsk, Tsk.

 

So good job, Grace, keep on truckin' at Bosley, clinging to your hilarious notion of smug, snide intelligence. You come off as an unhappy, shrill shill....and I have the sneaking suspicion that I am not the first nor the last to think this!

 

Intelligence is what intelligence does, Grace, didn't you learn that at Cornell?

 

As an aside, you write *horribly*, almost to the point of being offensive since you like to act so smug at the same time....I would implore you and/or your family to ask CORNELLLLLL for a refund.

-----------

*A Follicles Dying Wish To Clinics*

1 top-down, 1 portrait, 1 side-shot, 1 hairline....4 photos. No flash.

Follicles have asked for centuries, in ten languages, as many times so as to confuse a mathematician.

Enough is enough! Give me documentation or give me death!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Senior Member

Grace,

 

I apologize for some of the attacks towards you. Please allow Power Ranger out of his contract--it is the right thing to do.

 

NN

NN

 

Dr.Cole,1989. ??graftcount

Dr. Ron Shapiro. Aug., 2007

Total graft count 2862

Total hairs 5495

1hairs--916

2hairs--1349

3hairs--507

4hairs--90

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Senior Member

Nervous,

 

I am not sure Grace will go for the gentle approach, she is quite a shrewd businees person from CORNELL no less.

 

Her arrogance will make it hard for her to do the right thing and refund the poor guy his hard earned money.

 

Hope she proves us wrong and sets a positive example for Bosley, I will not be holding my breath to wait and see though.

NoBuzz

 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Senior Member

At first, I thought maybe some things were said that were too harsh and emotional, perhaps she actually had the best interest of PowerRanger in mind to an extent...

 

But I just re-read this entire thread, and The Great Shill Of Bosley comes off even more deceitful and distasteful...its *almost* comical, except she is actually aiding in the rolling of dice of a young man's life and who knows how many others...which, after all, is ultimately what many of us have taken serious objection to!

 

From the start, she spews *blatent* deceit and half-truths in her ironic "FACT:" post, which many members systematically ripped apart, and naturally took offense to.

 

Virtually every word she has spoken, from first to last, regarding hair restoration, has been laced with a combination of the following: ignorance, arrogance, smugness, deceit, and corporate sales sleaze, and doublespeak.

 

To me, "Grace" is part of an effort (and apparently a big cheerleader to boot) that prays on people, particularly the young, when they are at their weakest, most vulnerable, most confused; and, at a time when they need honest guidance and truth the most, betrays their trust.

 

Whether her impetus is ignorance & good intentions, or pure, outright deceit people like her are dangerous and contemptible.

-----------

*A Follicles Dying Wish To Clinics*

1 top-down, 1 portrait, 1 side-shot, 1 hairline....4 photos. No flash.

Follicles have asked for centuries, in ten languages, as many times so as to confuse a mathematician.

Enough is enough! Give me documentation or give me death!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Senior Member

Grace, Im not big on typing alot of words to express myself so i'll keep it simple. I am not now nor have i ever been employed by a doctor to hype them. I actually got a HT from Dr. Phillips at the Boston Bosely office and i now have less hair than before i had the procedure done. Not to mention an ugly scar on the back of my head. So i can be frank w/ you. You work for a horrible company that ruins more lives than it helps. Read your companies medical violations and know that thats all people need to form a judgment. Sorry to bust your bubble!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Senior Member

I think it is apparent that Grace feels strongly about her position.

 

I can certainly understand that.

 

However, one of the main criteria in researching patient results or assessing the level of work being performed by a particular doctor is consistent results and overwhelming evidence to support high patient satisfaction.

 

Often, it seems that chain clinics like Bosley or MHR are able to hide many of the poor results that are bound to happen, given the very high turn-over at these clinics.

 

Grace, your operating from a "I am sure I am right" position.

 

Is your position with Bosley your only experience with the hairloss/hair transplantation industry?

 

If so, it would be a fair statement to say that your biased in your views.

 

While this is not the most terrible attitude to possess, you must realize that limiting yourself in such a manner grossly undermines your ability to accept the reality inherent in a corporate approach to hair transplantation.

 

You must understand that artistry and skill is what separates the truly elite from those who do solid or good work. There is no formula or amount of practice that will change this.

 

In any case, I would ask that you simply prove your statements.

 

What size incisions do you use? (1,2,3, 4 hair grafts)

 

What type of incisions do you use/promote?

Hairline/Crown?

 

Do you use custom cut blades, or needles to make recipient sites?

 

Do the docs make all the incisions or do some of the techs?

 

What density per square cm do you transplant at on a regular basis?

 

For an average patient (white male donor density of 80-90 fu's cm/2) do you use longer thinner strips to reach your graft counts, or do you stay "between the ears" and go as wide as necessary (up to 2.5cm)?

 

What type of closure do you use?

Sutures or Staples?

 

How many patients do you perform surgery on per day?

 

Do you use all microscopic dissection, or do your docs/techs look at some grafts and think they are ok as is?

 

What do you charge per graft? What is your full pricing schedule?

 

In your current office, what is the length of time your doctors have been practicing and how long have the techs been employed?

 

Are your docs members of the ISHRS?

 

Obviously, I would like to see some photographic evidence (ie interoperative high resolution photos) along with any response you give.

 

I hope you broaden your horizons and use this forum and others to see how you can make a difference in your clinic.

 

I am interesting in your response. I happen to know someone who recently worked in a Bosley office and he shared some of the protocol with me, so your assertion that Bosley is superior or equal to the doctors in the Coalition is a bit hard to swallow.

 

Take Care,

J

Go Cubs!

 

6721 transplanted grafts

13,906 hairs

Performed by Dr. Ron Shapiro

 

Dr. Ron Shapiro and Dr. Paul Shapiro are members of the Coalition of Independent Hair Restoration Physicians.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

Good evening. Please read everything.

 

Firstly let me call out to PowerRanger since I have left him a voicemail but have not heard back. The poor kid is probably reading this and is confused and scared to death thanks to yall. PowerRanger, if you are reading this please, give me a call and we can work something out concerning your deposit.

 

After all, this thread is about him and his well-being. It disgusts the living day lights out of me that some of you are using this as stage for your own personal entertainment: "Oh the Bosley witch has popped up, let's burn her alive ". You guys are no different from the mob at the Jerry Springer show.

 

In any case, I apologize that I feel strongly about my position. But there some things that must be put forth. I have taken A LOT of time to study the past threads of this forum. I hope that by doing this coupled with my formal training in the analysis of public opinion at Cornell University School of Industrial and Labor Relations will arm me with the right tools and examples to be able to contradict you all and fight fire with fire.

 

The posters that I have some respect for, I will respond to you in the upper portion of my post and at the end of this post I will respond to the scumbags of this forum.

 

 

folica and NervousNelly,

 

I have respect for you the most. You speak in a manner that makes me truely believe that you have PowerRanger's concerns at heart. There will a lot of formalities to work out concerning his deposit, but I'll work with him to demonstrate that we are not the soul-less sharks this forum has hyped us to be.

 

I would like to address some of your concerns: We do not often operate on young patients like PowerRanger and most of our patients are in their 40s and 50s. In deciding weather a young patient is a good candiate we look at the following criteria:

1) has definitely decided against the 'shaved head' look

 

2) has significant frontal hairline recession that makes them look significantly older than their age.

 

3) lack of significant thinning throughout the rest of the scalp

 

4) commitment to keeping their hair through medical treatment

 

I don't want to violate patient confidentiality agreement but I'll say what I can. You never met PowerRanger, but I have and I believe a young patient similar to him is a mature 21 year old that who can make an informed decision about his life. Someone like him has built himself from the ground up single-handedly to where he is today without any aid from parents. Believe me he has worked hard, in fact too hard for his goals. Some one like him is deciding where to go to college, whether to join the military, who to marry....all of which have life changing consequences. Likewise I think he can weigh the pros and cons of doing a conservative follicular unit transplant procedure. I remember very vividly what he said to me during consultation:

 

"Ms Grace, I have been saving up over a year and half so I can become handsome enough so that I can get a girl as beautiful as you so that I can finally be happy. Thank you thank you thank you for helping me".

 

(PowerRanger loves saying thank you to people as you noticed from his posts). Anyways, those words were the saddest and at the same time the most uplifting thing I have ever heard. I am confident that our clinic can carefully provide the 700-1000 grafts that he needs so that he doesn't have to spend more of his hard-earned money to get on a plane like all you suggested to go to one of the coalition doctors. Money and personal situation are a factor to some people. I just believe PowerRanger can happier sooner rather than later.

 

There are doctors that I respect that refuses to treat patients under 25 for example Dr. Alexander, who I have the utmost respect for. So I think this is an area of legitimate disagreement.

 

Folica, you have chosen a great ethical doctor of the highest order. One that doesn't hire a consultant to routinely manipulate info in this forum. He is not "hyped" up, but he is one of the best in the world. Don't let anyone like Bezane tell you different.

 

NervousNelly, I hope that you will change your mind that not everyone needs a BMW and all the "standard options" that comes with it. Seriously, in this industry, we have elevated certain doctors to some sort of celebrity status. Some people feel that they have bragging rights if they went to this doctor or that doctor. There is one advice I would like to give to you when you have your procedure with Dr. Shapiro whom I respect. And that is: make Dr. Shapiro HIMSELF assess your donor density. Don't let anyone else M do this. I wish you well.

 

 

 

.

 

 

 

Next in line: Bill! the Mufasa of the Pride. I have some respect for you too. Firstly what did you mean when you said this (thanks for the offer btw):

Grace,

 

P.S. If you'd like to stay away from feeling like you are being ambushed by a mob, feel free to Private Message me and we can continue this discussion in private.

 

Bill

 

I did not realize you speak on behave of everyone else on this forum. Are you now the unofficial moderator of this forum? Because I've seen numerous examples where I can provide links if you wish where to TELL people WHAT to post and NOT to post!

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but your virtues is that you noblely welcome every new member to this forum. I think that is great. Everyone thinks you are a nice guy and I think that you are too. A VERY VERY nice guy that this forum needs. However, you're not the most TECHNICAL guy out there. You have NEVER READ one single scientific published study, you have NEVER GONE to any conferences, you have been a patient but have NEVER witness a surgery in process. Sorry to single you out, but actually this is true for most posters here who only get diluted over-hyped second-hand info. I truely feel you are a GENUINELY VERY NICE GUY and have a great new mane of hair and an EXTREMELY HOT bod that I'd glad throw myself at icon_wink.gif (but you are taken, your wife is a lucky girl). HOWEVER I'll say it again that you are NOT the most technical of people as exemplied by this thread:

http://hair-restoration-info.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/346...591084313#2591084313

 

So don't argue with me about the Laser comb and things like that when you HAVE NOT READ ANY OF THE PUBLISHED SCIENTIFIC STUDIES!!!!!!! IF YOU WANT TO DISCUSS THE FINE PRINTS OF THE STUDIES LET'S DO THAT! But Don't just definitively say that a FDA product is a "SCAM" and "there is no proof that it works" because that is VERY INACCURATE. If there is something SPECIFICS in the study that you disagree, let's hear at what page of the study and at what paragraph!!!!

 

In addition, I've seen threads where you advised a 40+ guy to stop taking finasteride and advise your friend hairfree to stop using minoxidil. IMO these are all bad advice and if you want a link to where you stated this I can provide them, I just don't want to clutter this thread with so many links. I digress, I think you are a nice, generally helpful guy and I find your muscular physique extremely hot icon_wink.gif

 

 

 

.

 

 

 

Who's next?! Oh Yes, the B Spot. (Should I call you B spot or J?)

 

Firsts of all who are you? Who do you work for and what is your agenda? You seem to be TOO technicially conversant to be just "another poster". Why did you finally decided to "pop up" again. Is it your intent to help PowerRanger or to just roll your eyes at him? You made an esoteric joke to him in your first post, days ago and now that the Bosley lady has arrived things are getting exciting so you decide to chime in again?! Why did you not "warn" PowerRanger if you really cared for his well-being? An yet you publically state that it is your call of duty to SAVE people from the "chain mills" in this thread:

http://hair-restoration-info.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/146...361073813#5361073813

 

So I ask you again. WHat are your intentions and what do you think PowerRanger should do?

 

Now, I will answer your questions and address your concerns in a more serious tone.

 

 

Grace, your operating from a "I am sure I am right" position.

 

You are entitled to your OPINION.

 

Is your position with Bosley your only experience with the hairloss/hair transplantation industry?

Yes, may I ask if you have EVER worked in the HT industry or gone to any of the conferences?

 

If so, it would be a fair statement to say that your biased in your views.

Ofcourse, similar to you having no problems giving SMG free advertisement with your signature as well being the head cheerleader for recommending Dr. Shapiro and Dr. Rose even though the former doesn't do his own phone consultations and the latter doesn't even have a SINGLE before/after photo in his NEW website. I still however have the highest respect for those two doctors.

 

While this is not the most terrible attitude to possess, you must realize that limiting yourself in such a manner grossly undermines your ability to accept the reality inherent in a corporate approach to hair transplantation.

I disagree, Bosley has a vast network of good doctors and a lot of resources. Please elaborate your point.

 

You must understand that artistry and skill is what separates the truly elite from those who do solid or good work. There is no formula or amount of practice that will change this.

Well if you cannot systematically quantify artistry how do we come to an agreement to who is elite and who is not? You know what? You don't have to be Michael-Angelo to design a good hairline. It takes less than 20 minutes, IMO. How long did Dr. Shapiro spent designing your hairline?

 

 

What size incisions do you use? (1,2,3, 4 hair grafts)

0.8mm for single hair grafts, which I understand is not the smallest, but in my opinion, very adequate. I'm sure there are coalition doctors that uses similar size incisions for single hair as well.

 

What type of incisions do you use/promote?

Hairline/Crown?

Sagital incisions everywhere except in the mid-scalp section where we employ lateral for 3-hairs and 4-hairs graft to capitalize on the "fanning-out" effect - Do you understand what I mean? I can elaborate further if this is unclear.

 

Do you use custom cut blades, or needles to make recipient sites?

Doctor make all the incisions as well as places a lot of the grafts.

 

What density per square cm do you transplant at on a regular basis?

35 to 40/cm2

 

For an average patient (white male donor density of 80-90 fu's cm/2) do you use longer thinner strips to reach your graft counts, or do you stay "between the ears" and go as wide as necessary (up to 2.5cm)?

Max strip is 30cm by 1.5cm. It is our belief that going "beyond" the ears is highly risky.

 

What type of closure do you use?

Sutures or Staples?

Dissolvable sutures. From experience, patients like this the best. Past patients who received staples all complain of the pain when removing staples.

 

How many patients do you perform surgery on per day?

2, 3 max

 

 

Do you use all microscopic dissection, or do your docs/techs look at some grafts and think they are ok as is?

Microscopic slivering and dissection. My respect to Dr. Limmmer who is the inventor of this technique.

 

What do you charge per graft? What is your full pricing schedule?

3.75 dollars per graft for all session sizes.

 

In your current office, what is the length of time your doctors have been practicing and how long have the techs been employed?

7 years. 1 tech 5 years. the rest of the techs 2.5 - 3 years.

 

Are your docs members of the ISHRS

Yes and member of ABHRS as well.

 

Obviously, I would like to see some photographic evidence (ie interoperative high resolution photos) along with any response you give.

I mentioned before in another post in this thread that good doctors are very busy keeping there clinic running smoothly. Posting pictures and hiring consultants to post them on online mob-ish forums are not the highest priority. In addition, there is more legal formalities and social etiquette than you think to just post pictures of a patient online. It's not that easy unless the patient actively offers. Furthermore, we don't want to advertise here. The motive for me to originally post here was to rectify any inaccurate "don't-even-consider-any-Bosley-clinc" info/mentality given to a prospective patient. Last thing: what is this with the double standard? There are plently of coalition and recommended doctors who have yet to put one photo on this forum that recommends them!

 

I am interesting in your response. I happen to know someone who recently worked in a Bosley office and he shared some of the protocol with me, so your assertion that Bosley is superior or equal to the doctors in the Coalition is a bit hard to swallow.

OK fine I'll give you the coaltion doctors. But how about your recommended doctors on the recommended list?

 

 

Hope I answered your questions. It is nice to talk to someone who is technically conversant unlike others here and who actually "appear" to know what they are talking about. My Thanks.

 

 

 

.

 

 

 

dakota3 -

I am sorry for your situation. I will report that clinic that you mentioned to our central office to start an investigation. Keep in mind that poor growth could be due to your physiology and not doctor's skill and that there are risks to any surgery. Coalition doctors have been removed due to poor result. I've seen patient complains about poor growth with doctors who are still in the coalition as well. Here is an example:

http://hair-restoration-info.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/746...861/m/9721061723/p/1

 

 

.

 

 

 

Lastly, TO THE SCUMBAGS of this forum who took my bait and proved to this forum how childish you are. But let me play along one last time and see if you take the bait again. To:

 

youngsuccess: You are so ugly yo mama had to feed you with a sling shot when you were a kid.... wait you still are! Care for a b-job?

 

NoBuzz4Now: I saw your photos and you look like a half man half toad with a really REALLY (I repeat really) small wrinkled up wiwi. In my professional opinion that old repair is going to be EXTREMELY hard to fix. Congrats.

 

thanatopsis_awry: Have a nice life filling your post with verbose SAT words. You have a long way to go, my boy. I'll tell Peter to tell Dr. D to teach you a lesson you'll never forget. One last thing: UCONN SUCKS!!! It is normal for someone like you to have an inferiority complex.

 

-Grace

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...