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Grace

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Bill,

 

If that really was a picture of her, it certainly might increase viewers on this forum. You should ask Pat if the Co-Moderator can hire an Assistant to the Co-Moderator? You better snap her up quickly before Feller gets her. Spex will be tossed aside like yesterdays trash. icon_smile.gif

 

 

NN


NN

 

Dr.Cole,1989. ??graftcount

Dr. Ron Shapiro. Aug., 2007

Total graft count 2862

Total hairs 5495

1hairs--916

2hairs--1349

3hairs--507

4hairs--90

 

 

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It's funny, I was reading this thread diligently and then I got down to the final strip of photos and... I kkinda lost tracck.. of whatt the thread was... about...

 

Something about hair... I think...


--

1st HT with Dr. Damkerng Pathomvanich, Bangkok, Thailand - 18 JUL 07 - 3300 grafts (FUT) - US$6,930

 

2st HT with Dr. Pathuri Madhu, Hyderabad, India - 31 JUL 10 - 2249 grafts (FUT) - US$2,200

 

3rd HT with Dr. Pathuri Madhu, Hyderabad, India - 26 JUL 11 - 320 grafts (FUE) touch up - US$0

 

My Hair Loss Weblog

 

My opinions are my own. I am not paid by, nor do I receive any benefits from ANY hair-related website, clinic, or doctor for my posts.

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Grace,

 

Still waiting on the official offer. Smile I applaud you for sticking it out and argueing your points. You could be a great addition to this forum as it sounds like you have a decent knowledge of the HT industry and are one heck of a sleuth. We need a few willing to go toe to toe.

 

Sounds like many do want to see some photos from your doc as this is one of the only ways to validate statements of ability. I'm sure that you'll get around to things when you get the chance. Good luck with the condo.

 

NN

 

NervousNelly and folica,

 

Posters like you are *dangerously* sucking me into this forum more than I want. But hearing some supportive words from you have convinced me. I want to personally thank you.

 

So this is the tentatively plan. I will give an update on things this Sunday so that everyone is crystal clear on my stance. And then the following week I'll post some pics. Sorry for the delay. Reason being is that posting pics of patients on these online forums require some legal formalities and social etiquette.

 

In addition, my doctor doesn't know actually that I've become this involved on this forum... oops. Before I get sucked in any further I really need to ask his permission on all this. But some posters have questioned my *PERSONAL* integrity, so if need be I'll seduce the doctor in his office so that I'll be allowed to post some pics.

 

Talk to you again soon, NervousNelly and folica. I didn't let you down with PowerRanger, right? And I won't let you down this time either.

 

-Grace

 

=============================================

 

And a general side note to everyone!!! I just have to say that the testosterone level on this thread is getting out of control! You guys are bald enough without the extra DHT!!! icon_wink.gif Some of you are getting a bit too daring with your sexist comments. Please tone it down. I'm not that kinda girl.

 

-Grace


I am affiliated with a Bosley clinic. I am not here to recommend Bosley. What I post are my personal opinions.

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Some of you are getting a bit too daring with your sexist comments. Please tone it down. I'm not that kinda girl.

 

Grace,

 

I'm not sure who you are referring to here (I know I made a couple comments like "she's my girl").

 

So first let me say that if my playful banter has offended you in anyway, I apologize.

 

But with all due respect - your initial presentation found here put me in a similar place.

 

"I think you are a nice, generally helpful guy and I find your muscular physique extremely hot "

 

"btw your new mane sure looks hot on you. May I ask if you're still single?"

 

"GENUINELY VERY NICE GUY and have a great new mane of hair and an EXTREMELY HOT bod that I'd glad throw myself at "

 

I will add that I was NOT offended by any of your remarks and was rather flattered.

 

However, you may want to reconsider how you present yourself if you don't want return playfulness.

 

Best wishes,

 

Bill

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Hey Bill,

 

In a different thread, I asked you where you got the James Dean avatar. I hope that you did not misconstrue that as playful banter. icon_biggrin.gif

 

NN


NN

 

Dr.Cole,1989. ??graftcount

Dr. Ron Shapiro. Aug., 2007

Total graft count 2862

Total hairs 5495

1hairs--916

2hairs--1349

3hairs--507

4hairs--90

 

 

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I lost interest in the original post about halfway through, but...

 

<UL TYPE=SQUARE>

<LI>Yes, "Bill" and "Jotronic" and "Spex" are paid by their respective clinics, but they are also entirely open about that fact. Absent that openess, sure, I'd be skeptical if I thought that someone were posting a glowing recommendation of a particular surgeon based on $$$ rather than the doctor's actual work...

<LI>Yes, it's unfair to blast a particular clinic or doctor without backing it up, and at times people also post here when they are legitimately angry because of shoddy work that they literally have to wear on their heads, or unethical behavior from doctors that costs them thousands of dollars. There are also, at least as I've seen, many more posts from people who honestly want to learn more, and who try to share information with others as fairly and honestly as they can. My $.02 is that Pat does well at striking a balance.

 

 

 

Benjamin

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OK Bill I had a bad day yesterday, alright? I'm sorry. Listen Bill, you, out of all people should understand that women can go through mood swings and become emotional especially in an alpha-male dominated community like this one. So if you feel the need to *actively* portray me as a total slut then fine I don't mind icon_wink.gif Why can't you reference some of the other nicer things I called you in my past PowerRanger thread, eh?... such as... MUFASA icon_wink.gif

 

4681029633_mufasa.JPG?ts=46D5ACF9&key=8CE20F6F05D5508A90840FD75C0E1112&referrer=http%3A%2F%2Fhair-restoration-info.com%2Feve%2Fforums%2Fa%2Fga%2Ful%2F5681029633%2Fmufasa.JPG

 

(I apologize for not asking permission yet to use your pic. I will seriously stop this if you are offended)

 

In a more serious tone Bill, I have a job for you. Have at least 6 respected members of this forum *copy and paste* the following list of agreements enveloped in quotations below and post them on this thread. After that is done, I'll be ready to post some pics by this Sunday. Thanks. -Grace

 

 

"

I completely understand that:

1). Grace was *originally* provoked to come to this forum due to a former prospective patient (PowerRanger) and I will at least consider the fact that she has good overall intentions. She truely believes that there are some educational information on this website.

2). Grace is not recommending Bosley and she is posting pictures solely because members of this community is encouraging her to do so.

3). Before/After pictures that Grace will be posting will be faceless pictures selected by her doctor and not herself due to legal formalities.

4). Graft counts, hair counts and single-hair graft incision sizes will be revealed for each photo that Grace posts.

5). Grace's doctor is not comfortable in revealing himself nor the location of his clinic.

6). I fully realize that some of the non-coalition recommended doctors of this website and even a few coalition doctors listed here:

http://www.hairtransplantnetwork.com/Consult-a-Physicia...nsplant-surgeons.asp

have yet to put *ONE* photo on this forum that recommends them. At the very least, Grace should be respected in doing something many recommended clinics have not.

7). After viewing the pictures posted by Grace, I will consider listening to the constructive critisms she has to say about this forum as well as try to evaluate the notion that each clinic and doctor should be considered as separate entities.

8). Most importantly after posting some pictures, Grace will be allowed to go away quietly at anytime without the need to defend her clinic or further explain herself.

"

mufasa.JPG.c11453cda076316963abbbd9590f5ce8.JPG


I am affiliated with a Bosley clinic. I am not here to recommend Bosley. What I post are my personal opinions.

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Grace,

 

You made me laugh out loud on that one. That's a cute picture and I'm certainly not offended.

 

I certainly do NOT intend to portray you like a slut as I am sure you aren't one.

 

In fact you remind me of one of my closest female friends with your wit and charm.

 

And yes, I was flattered by the majority of what you wrote in the "PowerRanger" thread - including the "genuine nice guy", "Mufasa of Pride" and all the comments about my looks!

 

In fact, I even said we should have dinner sometime and chat remember? icon_smile.gif.

 

And you are right...this community is dominated by men. It is ok for you to "assert" yourself. You are woman...and I hear you roar icon_smile.gif.

 

As for "job" related things...

 

As for the 8 points you have made, I certainly think they are reasonable and fair.

 

As for members copying and pasting....

 

This is a hot thread and believe it or not many members are hanging onto every word you have to say. I'm sure you understand. So those who want to encourage you will agree to it.

 

That being said...

 

Here are some suggestions for you:

 

Though I recognize that you are not technically recommending Bosley and are only posting photos because you are encouraged to - I do recommend that you ask your doctor to select pictures that accurately represent the work. If anything it will help your clinic avoid any unnecessary public scrutiny. It is probably best that the doctor you work for selects some of his BEST work to present. Also consider including some varying single session sizes from smaller to larger.

 

I also encourage your doctor to provide the graft count (and preferably hair count breakdown), general patient history and goals.

 

I for one will keep an open mind as you present your clinic's work. the one thing I do hope is that your doctor will change his mind and reveal his name/location etc. After all public display of excellence deserves credit.

 

I think it's also fair to suggest that all members viewing the photos do not constructively critique Bosley as a whole but instead see this as one clinic out of many.

 

Grace, though you are "allowed" to leave this community at any time, we hope you'll stick around. I believe there really are a great group of people here.

 

Best wishes,

 

Bill

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I'm in.

 

NN


NN

 

Dr.Cole,1989. ??graftcount

Dr. Ron Shapiro. Aug., 2007

Total graft count 2862

Total hairs 5495

1hairs--916

2hairs--1349

3hairs--507

4hairs--90

 

 

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This thread is getting interesting.

 

I welcome seeing some updated Bosley photos.

 

Grace, is it the Doctor's choice not to disclose where he works or what his name is, or (under contract to Bosley) are they not allowed to individually promote themselves so that we instead know them collectively as 'Bosley'?


___________________________

1662 with Dr. Ron Shapiro - Spring 2006

1105 with Dr. Ron Shapiro - Fall 2009

M&M Weblog

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Something is a little iffy here....

 

What happened to one of our respected posters, folica?

 

Why do I get an error message when trying to view his profile on *every* thread of this forum?!

 

And his weblog has disappeared from the face of this planet as well!

 

Bill, What's going on here?! If things are being *quietly* deleted I want nothing to do with this forum!

 

-Grace


I am affiliated with a Bosley clinic. I am not here to recommend Bosley. What I post are my personal opinions.

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Grace,

 

Didn't know if I should leave this one for Bill or not, but what the hell. Folica wanted to take a hiatus from this forum. He is starting to see some results from his HT and figures that he has learned a lot and contributed a lot. He is also a little tired of the debates and wanted to just try to help people and not debate just to argue a personal choice.

 

You might find this out, it is difficult to quit this site cold turkey. Hairbank, a respected member and myself for example, said our goodbyes and well guess what--here we are again. Folica thought it would be easier if there was no temptation.(kind of like the chain around the fridge for the overweight person) By having his membership closed, he couldn't log on easily and would resist the temptation to log on and express his point of view to so many of our wild discussions. Nothing shady going on at all. He is a good guy and helped a lot of people and I believe that he was going to send me his e-mail to keep in touch. He is taking a hiatus and possibly a long one, but he did his part here and I respect him very much for all of his input. Hope this explains things for you.

 

NN


NN

 

Dr.Cole,1989. ??graftcount

Dr. Ron Shapiro. Aug., 2007

Total graft count 2862

Total hairs 5495

1hairs--916

2hairs--1349

3hairs--507

4hairs--90

 

 

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Originally posted by NervousNelly:

Didn't know if I should leave this one for Bill or not, but what the hell. Folica wanted to take a hiatus from this forum. He is starting to see some results from his HT and figures that he has learned a lot and contributed a lot. He is also a little tired of the debates and wanted to just try to help people and not debate just to argue a personal choice.

 

 

Sorry to be a drama queen as I'm accused of here, but this is a sad day and I understand *COMPLETELY* how:

 

This forum has DRIVEN AWAY a respected member like folica who was one of the only *FEW* people who *TRUELY* had PowerRanger's concern at heart in this thread:

http://hair-restoration-info.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/346...861/m/8761077033/p/4

 

This forum has DRIVEN AWAY a knowledgeable member like Thomas Ortiz. JASON, don't DENY the fact that almost everything you learned about the highly repsected Dr. James Harris was from all the juicy stuff Thomas posted on Hairsite. Please tell Pat that!

 

This forum has DRIVEN AWAY a knowledgeable member like Peter MacDonald just because he was affliated with DHI.

 

Do you see what you guys are FUCKING doing?!

 

The one thing that we have *LEARNED* from the past is that we have *NOT LEARNED* from the past!

 

We are all REAL BREATHING PEOPLE HERE and not just "posters" on the screen.

 

PAT .... or BILL! SAY SOMETHING!!!

 

-Grace


I am affiliated with a Bosley clinic. I am not here to recommend Bosley. What I post are my personal opinions.

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Grace, You seriously need to relax.

 

I asked a serious question for you:

 

"Grace, is it the Doctor's choice not to disclose where he works or what his name is, or (under contract to Bosley) are they not allowed to individually promote themselves so that we instead know them collectively as 'Bosley'?"

 

Instead, you ignore it and decide to attack the forum and accuse the site owners / members as to why someone has gone 'quiet' and that you want nothing to do with this forum.

 

The situation is explained to you, and your response? An apology? No, a further attack at the forum including swearing (nice professional touch), accusing us all of driving people away due to people not wanting to be involved in 'debates'.

 

Your solution? Start a *debate* attacking everyone on the forum.

 

Brilliant. Simply brilliant. Cornell taught you this?

 

Let's review your history on this forum: Attack everyone, accuse everyone, defend Bosley, indicate you only want to help people, then say you are not recommending Bosley after everyone asks for photos, then you flirt with Bill, people comment back, you ask them to back off and not to be sexist, then you ask for a commitment from the posters to grant you patience and know you have good intentions, we believe you, then you attack the forum and its members again. I simply don't understand. We're here to learn and help each other. Not to have to put up with your self-described mood swings.

 

Why not just act professionally, answer questions, and be a help to forum members?


___________________________

1662 with Dr. Ron Shapiro - Spring 2006

1105 with Dr. Ron Shapiro - Fall 2009

M&M Weblog

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Grace,

 

You initially came to our community as a disturbed representative from Bosley who just lost a prospective client "PowerRanger".

 

You have been asked by many well respected members of our community to provide patient photos of your clinic and you have not risen to the challenge.

 

We answered all your questions, responded to all your half truths and out right lies, and have been tolerant of your attempt to discredit a community driven to help its members.

 

But it is obvious at this point that your only motivation for being here is to stir up trouble by becoming a poison in the well.

 

And though you have added some humor into our lives by providing funny pictures of well respected members in our community, it is now time to get back to the purpose of this community: to help educate hair loss sufferers.

 

It is now time for you to bow out "grace" fully.

 

Sincerely,

 

Bill

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This will be my last post on this:

Tom Ortiz was a complete jerk when he began posting on this forum and we took him to task rightfully so. However, he has taken great steps elsewhere to amend his postings a bit and once you get to know him, he is a very good guy, a very good technician and a source of solid technical knowledge. He was in a very difficult emotional state at that point in time, and I believe his employment with Dr. Harris has helped him tremendously.

 

I am sorry, but my knowledge of Dr. Harris was formed by talking to those who respect him and his work, but you are correct that most recently Tom has provided myself and others a very detailed look at a top clinic that is really attempting to produce dramatic results using a .75mm extraction tool for 1,2,3 and some 4 hair groupings for fue sessions.

 

They are also detailing their bht experience for all to see as is the Dr. Bisanga, who BTW is looking for 10 volunteers who meet a very strict criteria for free bht work in the efforts to actually determine efficacy.

 

As far as Pete goes, he is still around helping out as usual, being a solid guy with tremendous knowledge.

 

Anyway, at the end of the day, we help people here....we talk and debate... we share in each others successes and help out during failures.

 

I am sorry that you cannot see this and chose instead to attack myself and others as opposed to simply silencing your critics with detailed photo's, which would have been critiqued like everything else.

 

Anyway, I harbor no ill will toward you, and I wish you well in your endeavors.

 

BTW, M&M, NN, Bill, everyone else --you handled this one pretty well guys.

 

Jason


Go Cubs!

 

6721 transplanted grafts

13,906 hairs

Performed by Dr. Ron Shapiro

 

Dr. Ron Shapiro and Dr. Paul Shapiro are members of the Coalition of Independent Hair Restoration Physicians.

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Ladies and Gentlemen,

 

Since Grace apparently has a hard time playing nice with others, I have suspended her posting privileges at this time.

 

Her last post revealed her true colors. Instead of rising to the challenge of posting patient photos, she chose the obvious and desperate road - the continual attempt to discredit our community and what we stand for. Many before her have tried this and failed why?

 

Because RESULTS are what matter here.

 

Thank you to the dedicated members of this community who saw through her masquerade from the beginning.

 

In the midst of all things, let's remember what this community is about...

 

We are here to educate and encourage hair loss sufferers in their hair restoration journey.

 

Thanks for understanding,

 

Bill

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Originally posted by Bill:

Ladies and Gentlemen,

 

Since Grace apparently has a hard time playing nice with others, I have suspended her posting privileges at this time.

 

Although she was charming and witting at times, I encourage you to take a look behind the mask. Her intentions have become obvious.

To me this is censorship based on unilateral interpretation of intent and selective criteria ... such as ...

There's nothing like a pretty face to potentially divide and conquer a community of men looking for encouragement. Just remember that nobody would be captivated by her charm if she was a man.

 

AND she is still a Bosley representative.

 

Sexism and discrimination based on employer. It's one thing to say her language was out of line, but this commentary is very inappropriate.

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Bill,

 

I thought you would know better. Your rational behind this suspension comes of as sexist and frankly, reeks of censorship.

 

We dont have to collectively agree on everything thats posted. For this community to exist independent of agenda, speech must not be regulated that closely.

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I apologize to all of you who were offended by those comments. They were not intended as interpreted.

 

Those comments however, were not the reason for her suspension.

 

I have thus removed them from my original thread and left only the reason for her suspension.

 

If you look back - please remember that I was on of those who ENCOURAGED her to post pictures of her clinic's work and was rather glad to hear that she was considering it.

 

She was suspended for one reason: she was CONTINUALLY trying to discredit this community by drudging up half truths and lies from the history of the forum.

 

Too much time and energy was being spent disputing her when she didn't want to hear any rational explanation for anything.

 

All she wanted to do was get a rise out of people.

 

It worked.

 

Ultimately it was beginning to distract from the purpose of this community.

 

People who have been here for some time now know that censorship is NOT something we practice here.

 

Very few members over the years have lost posting privileges. Each one was for good reason whether or not everyone agrees or not.

 

I'm sorry if people disagree with this decision but I'm asking people to trust me on this. It is now time to move on to bigger and better things.

 

I am now locking this thread.

 

Bill

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