DR Alvi Armani??why is he not recommended on this site?

[Pats205]

Comparison photo number 2

[Bill - Seemiller]

Pats,

 

You said,

 

"We encourage Bill to post our legal letter to you the letter"

 

I've haven't received a copy of any legal notices sent to and/or or from Balboa or the Armani clinic to one another regarding this dispute - and I don't need to.

 

However, I don't object to you and/or Balboa posting copies of letters as long as personal identify information remains protected.

 

Regards,

 

Bill

[Einstein]

Time out for a second. A few questions please:

 

Regarding the photo Pats just posted of Balboa...

 

1) Is that 5 months post op?

 

2) Is that the latest pic balboa posted?

 

3) How many months post op is Balboa now?

[Sparky]

Pats205, your digging yourself into a deep hole posting letters from Balboa, this will just end up hurting you. Like when you told us about that patient that had testicular cancer or something along those lines.

 

IMHO Balboa's head looked way better before you got hold of it, his hairline is wonky, theres no disputing that. If you had done a good job he wouldnt be taking legal action. End of.

[SonicWannabe2009]

Wow, thanks for your post Pats, this clarifies a lot in my mind re: Balboa.

[Balboa]

Right here we go once again

 

@ PATS

 

You say that your firm is not trying to sue me to remove the pictures and comments from this site.

I will upload the letter from BAKER&McKENZIE shorty to prove thats what you have asked me to do.

 

yes i did threaten to go out of my way and go puplic which i will still plan to do if im not treated seriously. e.g. NEWSPAPERS etc.

 

Thing i find most amusing is the fact you think my pictures are deceptive and that i have made my head wet before hand to try and misslead.

 

you asked for pictures from me as follows

1- front

2- top

3- side L

4- side R

5- top with wet hair

6- front with wet hair

7- side L ??“ wet

8- side R ??“wet

 

You Have CHOSEN to use my LEFT WET picture

 

INFACT MY HAIR LOOKS BETTER WET

i make my hair wet and style it before i go out becuase it looks better.

 

at the end of this post i will add a perfectly DRY pic just to Prove my points.

 

I will also show my clear BEFORE pics that i have never realy posted before to show how much hair i had before.

 

I Love the way you chose the pics you did PATS thats just great lol.

 

the pictures you show are so low res you cant even zoom in to see my SCARED hairline.

 

I will reupload that exact same picture in full qaulity and then we can see.

 

 

I will now answer what you have implied 1-7

 

1. You have failed to disclose the fact that i had been co-operating with you in this matter and you had failed to respond to me within 5 days, resulting in my response telling you that you had 48 hours. although you have mislead about my intentions. so yes a threat was made due to the fact of being ignored, I actually told Mike from Farjo about this.

 

2. COMPLETE UTTER LIES AS USUAL, YOUR LETTER CLEARLY REQUEST THAT I REMOVE MY COMMENTS AND STAY AWAY FROM HERE. I will upload the form and add it to the end of this post.

 

3. I have not posted any fair after images???? what is that suppose to mean, I have posted a clear shot of my hairline from daylight. i think what you meant to say is i haven't used the misleading photo tactics your company uses by closing all the blinds and taking my pictures in dull light. if that's what you describe as fair then yes im guilty as charged lol.

 

4. The 5 Month pictures i feel are good apart the missanged hairline and the left side being thinner, i didn't really have any complaints at 5 months with the growth etc, my only concerns were the hairline Design and that i was worried about the Bumps (scaring) as i wasn't sure back then if they would heal. so i don't know why you think anything is suspicious about my 5 months pictures, infact the light was quite dull and made it look better so i don't see what your getting at because that 5 month pic makes your clinic look good.

also to clear up any confusion with dates of pictures ect. all the pictures listed of me in this thead are 11 months+ post opp, including the pictures that PATS posted of my comparison in the posts above. any 5 month pictures you will have to do a search for.

 

5. excuse me but you asked for Left side Wet and Left side Dry,

You have chosen to show Left side Wet and you have also used them as a comparison to my before picture so if they were so DECEPTIVE why would you use them as a comparison. you really like to shoot yourself in the foot don't you PATS.

 

6. THIS IS AN OUTRIGHT LIE, I clearly stated in my response to Fernando Armani (President of your clinic) that i would love to meet with doctor Armani to discuss this properly but i said i live in the UK. so wouldn't know how this would be possible.

 

did you expect me to pay to fly over to Toronto to meet with the doctor???? i don't call my response refusing to meet , do you? if Dr Armani fly's over to the UK then fine that's brilliant i would meet with him.

 

7. Clever Boy PATS i did indeed come to the Armani clinic with a receding hairline.

yes indeed maybe 2500 grafts was needed for YOUR clinic due to the fact that you have to overpack areas to compensate for poor growth while risking scaring by doing so. my hairline is not dense packed as it should be, i have closely inspected my head and there are so many dots of scaring that don't have hair growing from them so the hair clearly did not grow In places, if it wasn't for a few thick grafts in the hairline hiding what's behind it, the left side would be extra poor.

 

to conclude this post i will now upload the pictures as stated and i think i have clearly answered PATS post and cleared up what and idiot he can be. you really should get your facts right before making such a post. you just do more harm to your clinic than good you realy do.

 

FULL SIZE PCITURE OF WHAT PATS USED

 

DRY LEFT SIDE

 

TOP OF HEAD DRY

 

1 MONTH BEFORE TRANSPLANT WITH ARMANI

[Stingray]

I don't really want to get massively involved in this but felt now would be a good time to remind people of my Armani results. My results are a long way shy of the 95% growth rates promised to me.

 

[SonicWannabe2009]

Where are your before pics?

[Stingray]

 

You can see in the after pics where my natural hair is and where my pluggy Armani hairline is.

[Sparky]

I can see all of the white bumps, that certainly is not what you would expect. I hope people who are considering a HT see this thread first so they can rule out Armani at the offset.

[Sparky]

I just read the letter that that sent you, wow Armani isnt very clever not offering you an immediate refund, hes gonna end up a lot worse off cash wise afterwards considering what they have done to your poor head.

[SonicWannabe2009]

Sparky, Balboa and all the others who are not pleased with their Armani HT, I apologize for coming across as a supporter of the clinic. I can understand what you are going through and I truly hope you get your desired result should you go through another surgery.

 

From personal experience, I think Armani did a fantastic job, but I guess as you say it needs perfect consistency across all the patients.

 

best regards,

Sonic

[Balboa]

I have now re-uploaded the letter to show both pages on the same link so have another look sparky.

 

and thank you sonic thats very big of you, and im also glad you got satifactory results.

[Sparky]

My word he is a nasty piece of work. That letter has just been sent to you as a scare tactic.

 

Your evidence of being ripped off and scarred are on your head and they are not going anywhere. These scare tactics only work on people who dont have a legitimate claim, yours is totally justified and they have no defence.

[Capelli]

Wow. I can't figure out what Pats is saying. When he makes a statement that is misleading, you have to wonder how you can trust anything he says. Technically Pats is correct about deleting postings as the letter requests removing references to Armani et al. It is just a technicality though.

 

For example:

 

From Pats posting:

2- Our letter does not request you to delete postings but to stop making false statements. We encourage Bill to post the legal letter that was sent to you.

 

From the Baker & MacKenzie letter:

Dr. Armani and AlviArmani hereby demand that you immediately and completely cease and desist from making any further threats and/or disparaging statements to or about Dr. Armani and AlviArmani, and that you immediately remove from the internet all references to Dr. Armani and AlviArmani you have made in the past.

[Acrobaz]

Balboa - many thanks for your persistence in dealing with this issue and, despite receiving legal threats of this nature, for continuing to share your experiences with the members of this forum. More power to your elbow. I sincerely hope you are able to achieve a resolution.

 

Originally posted by Sparky:

I hope people who are considering a HT see this thread first so they can rule out Armani at the offset.

 

That would have been my response - to run a mile. It astonishes me that Pats/Eric does not realise this when he makes posts of the sort that have appeared on this thread.

[SonicWannabe2009]

I don't understand the logic in your post. I'm dispensing with the pleasantries as generally the individuals on this forum are rude and abrasive so I'm just "fitting in".

 

You had an HT, your in your mid 30s and you say you are worried about original hair receding. That is but normal and that means you have to go back for a 2nd transplant which covers those areas...

 

I would be worried if you told me that your transplanted hairs fell out.

 

There is no doctor that would have looked at you and said, you know I don't want to give you a young hair line (although you're only 30 or so) and I want to focus on the future and start putting in hairs in in areas where you already have thick hair...

 

Armani himself told me that should you continue to lose hair in the back areas of course you need to come back for another HT.

 

Sonic

[Acrobaz]

Originally posted by SonicWannabe2009:

I'm dispensing with the pleasantries as generally the individuals on this forum are rude and abrasive so I'm just "fitting in".

 

That is neither a fair nor accurate description. It is also an irresponsible thing to say to a first-time poster. I will resist the temptation to say more as that might accord with the misleading picture you are trying to paint.

 

Regards

[shanti]

@ Sonic...

 

Plenty of doctors out there will refuse to lower a hairline or close off the temples but these tend to be doctors with a conscious. These doctors do "focus on the future", that's the essence of a successful hair transplant. A HT is for life and for most of Armani's patients their HT will have to stand up to scrutiny for another 60 odd years. Not an easy task with a teenage hairline.

 

Due to the finite supply of donor hair Armani's approach just isn't a good idea. Anyone with MPB should be aiming for a mature hairline to save grafts for the future. Armani packs in half your donor supply to re-create a youthful hairline and then basically it's fingers crossed for the future.

 

Sure it "can" look good for a few years and it might help with the ladies.... but what about when you are 40 or 50 and your wife's friends can't stop looking at your head because it looks weird. You will care just as much.

 

Now for the lucky ones that don't loose more than their donor can supply, they can keep topping up but topping up itself is a nightmare. The native hair creeps back slowly and unevenly so you only have little gaps at a time to fill in which means multiple mini touch up sessions (would Armani even take these "mini" sessions on??). But you have to do it as the frontal HT hairs will become obvious with no supportive native hairs behind to stop the light passing through. With each touch up your donor becomes significantly more scarred and FUE extraction become harder and much more painful. Transection rates will increase and that aside just playing the numbers game, by creating a low hairline, chances are you won't keep up with the loss. There just isn't enough donor to support a dense low hairline on an average MPB male. There is barely enough to support even a mature hairline.

 

Realistically you'll end up with a dense un-natural Armani hairline with less density behind as your HT supportive native hair leaves and you try in vain to fill in behind. It's the nature of the beast.

 

Armani however has developed a business based on giving young patients exactly what they want. He's acquired a niche audience of young patients who at the first sign of MPB want to recreate their youthful hairline.

 

Is it right?... no, is it hell, but he's not the first and he probably won't be the last. I've been on these forums for nearly 10 years now and I've quietly watched Armani become the force that he is. In all honesty it's been an accident waiting to happen and now his mega session FUE is the icing on the cake. But finally it seems the word (and the results) are starting to come out.

 

Look, everyone knows it's wrong, including his fellow doctors... and that's the only reason he gets bad press. He's always had bad press. He's always had his "haters". His poor representatives Shane, Pats etc get slated on a daily basis. It's not easy working for Armani I'm sure and they are always on the defence. But why is that? You don't see that from Feller, Hasson & Wong, Shapiro etc. Their boys, Spex, Jotronic, Jason etc get a comparatively easy life in this regard. Why?

 

The simple fact is Armani has gone against the grain of what we know is sensible and considerate HT practice. It's nothing new. The error of creating a dense packed low hairline for a young MPB patient has been discussed for years. Does Armani knows that?.... of course he does and unfortunately over the next few years I think more and more of his patients will realises it.

 

It's not really that he found a niche as the niche was always available but most doctors chose not to go there. Armani however cashed in on it and ethics aside, I have to say he's executed it very well. He has a slick website, his patients look like "L'Oreal" adverts and he's branded his pratice like the "GQ" of hair transplants. It sells. It's not realistic but it sells. It appeals to the younger patients and their "dream" of perfect hair. Mature hairlines, pfff, why would you want one of those silly looking things when you can have an Armani hairline !!! It's what you WANT to hear but unfortunately is not what you NEED to hear.

 

I expect 10-20 years from now these forums will be flooded with middle aged men with un- natural low hairlines searching for a solution. I hope I'm wrong but as the history of hair transplantation has shown there is no way around it. In my opinion I'm sad to say Armani will have a fair bit to answer for in the future. Watch this space.

[SonicWannabe2009]

Acrobaz: unsubscribe. you are exactly what I was referring to in my post.

 

Shanti, thankyou for your post i agree with a lot of your points. May I however say that realistically, isn't it quite possible that in 5 years time we have a cure for hairloss based on follicular neo-genesis? (Adreans, AA Genomics, Intercytex e.t.c). I mean I know that it has been ongoing for decades now, but we will get there eventually...and after reading into some research, I really don't think we are that far away..

 

After reading your post and me being an Armani patient, I feel depressed. You're telling me its game over for me and that after 2-3 years I'm gonna look like a proper a-hole?

 

I can't argue with that...I hope you are wrong, for my and other AA HT patients' stakes.

 

Sonic

[mattj]

Personally I do think a slightly higher hairline is more sensible, and to me it provides a more dramatic and masculine aesthetic. I don't wish to get into the question of ethics here, but I do want to challenge the assertion that a low hairline will look bad on an older man. A minority of older men retain youthful hairlines and they don't look ridiculous. If anything they are envied for their hair. My dad is nearly sixty and he still has a low hairline with closed temples (although he's losing it now due to chemotherapy).

[shanti]

Sonic,

 

Unfortunately the hair multiplication, neo genesis or whatever it's called nowadays, always comes up. It seems to be the "insurance policy" for being reckless with your donor supply. I believe Armani brings it up quite often. It's part of his sales pitch.

 

Problem is mate..... it doesn't exist.

 

I for one can't base my future happiness/ appearance on something that may or may not happen. It's not rational. It not even a calculated risk.... it's blind hope and a completely reckless gamble.

 

I just can't count on it being commercially available and more to the point, cosmetically viable in my lifetime, just like I wouldn't count on the lottery providing me a living wage.... although at least I can buy a tangible ticket with the lottery. What can hair neo-genisis offer me? Nothing. It no more than research.

 

We've nearly had 20 years of FUE and 10 years BHT and most doctors still can't get it right. But these hairs do exist. They're already there, they don't need growing in a lab, they just need plucking and moving around our bodies. Problem is they are so delicate and complex even in their natural form, that I can't even imagine the struggle it must be to clone an already fragile follicle and then grow a cosmetically acceptable hair that will again continue to grow once implanted.

 

Anyway, I don't know your case and I don't know what your hairloss future holds. You could be fine and I hope you are. Any HT patient from any doctor is vulnerable to future hairloss and runs the risk of leaving the HT hair stranded. My issue is that Armani does tend to plant low, dense hairlines on young patients that will only look good if the native hair remains. It's reckless practice and it can't be argued that in the majority of cases it isn't in their long term interests. I once emailed my photos to Armani for a touch up session. I thought I needed maybe 300-400 grafts to fill in. He quoted me something like 2000 - 2500 grafts. Where he would have put them I have no idea but from that point on I saw that it wasn't my interests he had in mind. In the end I had a postage stamp 200 graft touch up with Dr Feller and it did the job.

 

Armani isn't breaking any rules. It's what a young patient wants and they are adults so hey.... but without a doubt there is more likely to be a serious consequences than if the patient had gone for a more mature hairline with a more conservative doctor. No amount of sales pitch/ hair neo-genesis or whatever can change that. Even Propecia has been guilty of providing to much false security for going aggressive with the hairline. You can't count on that long term either.

 

The fact remains, that which ever way you turn it, you have your hair on your head and all you can do is move it around to try and create a cosmetically satisfactory result to hide your hairloss. That is what you have to play with, no more, no less. It needs to be used wisely.

[shanti]

"that a low hairline will look bad on an older man"

 

MattJ, I never said that.

 

Some old men do have low hairline and they look great. Lucky buggers..... but they don't have MPB.

 

The point is low hairlines are great IF you can fill the rest of your head with the same density. Problem is, chances are, you can't. There isn't enough hair in the donor especially when you've stuck it all up front.

[mattj]

Originally posted by shanti:

"that a low hairline will look bad on an older man"

 

MattJ, I never said that.

 

Some old men do have low hairline and they look great. Lucky buggers..... but they don't have MPB.

 

The point is low hairlines are great IF you can fill the rest of your head with the same density. Problem is, chances are, you can't. There isn't enough hair in the donor especially when you've stuck it all up front.

 

I see. Sometimes I do hear that claim being made and it sounded like that formed part of your argument above.

[shanti]

No worries Matt,

 

Anyway, Armani's had a bit of a bashing but it's been due in my opinion.

 

I'm sure he has plenty of happy patients and I'm sure Pats will come on here and say the same soon.

 

Problem is these happy patients may not be happy 20 years down the line. Some will but the nature of MPB means most will be in trouble and with half their donor gone and a teenage lowered hairline, there maybe no way to fix the problem.

 

Pats (or the happy patient) simply can't and doesn't know the long term implications, they can only go off what they see now. What they see (and what Armani's website portrays), are great looking, youthful, perfect hairlines.

 

But any decent doctor can plant half your donor upfront on a guy with minimal loss and it'll look good. If it doesn't then something is very wrong. They should all be looking like GQ models and most (with a little creative lighting) tend to look amazing. It's like Armani is in another league.... but he's not I'm afraid.

 

The sad thing is that Armani is a technically competent doctor and I think he has a good creative eye. He had good strip results (aggressive hairlines aside) but unfortunately he got greedy with the mega session FUE, which maybe his undoing.