Potential Recommendation of Dr. Sanusi Umar of Redondo Beach, CA

[Bill - Seemiller]

Members,

 

I've asked Dr. Feller to withdraw from the thread now that he's made his point, so let's show him courtesy and get back to the topic of Dr. Umar's potential recommendation.

 

Thanks,

 

Bill

[something]

sorry Bill,

missed your previous post.

[Dr. Alan Feller]

That's real cute Hooray. Now you've obviously taken what I write out of context to distort it. Weasil was the right word for you. With cheerleaders like you, your doctor doesn't need detractors.

 

Seems you are the one who is scared because I still haven't received your real name in my private email.

[Guest]

What does posting you my name prove?

 

For the last year, my website has posted my FUE results from Dr Umar replete with nothing but full face photos at all times!

Am I somehow devious for not posting my full name, home address, and credit card details?

Are you serious?

Thanks for showing your true colours/pettiness.

Most people wouldn't want an emotionally unstable doctor working on them.

I stand by my "scared of the future" comment.

 

Oh, and it's spelt "weasel!".

An illiterate, to boot.

This just gets better and better.

 

Weren't you told to butt out of this thread, by the way?

[PLEASE GROW PLEASE]

H4H Could you please teach me to type and spell?

If you think spelling weasel is bad check out some of my posts

You have had some nice work by DrUmar, but to be fair to Dr Feller he is considered one of the best in strip and fue.

Im sure if he wanted to he could go all fue and be on par with whats out there right now.

[Dr. Alan Feller]

I appreciate it PGP, but there's no need to bother with this guy anymore. He's just another kook with an agenda.

 

I've made my points here about mega-FUE/BHT and I think that's enough.

[M&M]

Does Dr. Feller come across as a proud doctor with a strong ego sometimes? Heck Yes.

 

But I know many professionals who are so proud of their work, passionate to the nth degree and they would do likewise to protect their integrity and everything they stand for. Therefore, I don't read anything negative into what Dr. Feller says. Based upon the countless photos I've seen (either posted by him, by Spex or by the patients themselves), he still ranks as one of the absolute best in my opinion, which is one of the obvious reasons he is not just recommended but a member of the coalition on this site.

 

Now, back to the potential recommendation at hand. Pat / Bill - I ask that you please take some time to rethink this recommendation. I do trust your opinion and I know you want to do the right thing and I'm not saying that Dr. Umar is not talented, but all of a sudden on this forum and the other forum the same patients of Dr. Umar are being heavily promoted all of a sudden. I think if he can help these people who truly have no hope left, he is a true 'miracle worker'. But - let's have some questions answered first.

 

1. We need to see more photos. Not just photos from 6-months out. I mean honestly, how does that 6-month out patient (posted about 6-mths ago I think for the first time) look today? How do the BHT patients look 12,18,24,36 months out. We all know that hair transplanted from the back of the head lasts a lifetime (or close enough), but what about body hair?

 

And then, what about different types of body hair? Beard hair, Pubic Hair, Arm Hair, Chest Hair, Abdomen Hair, Leg Hair - are they all the same in the long run or not? Just as I don't like Dr. Armani telling patients they have 10,000 available FUE grafts on their head with no proof, I dislike seeing a BHT doctor potentially recommended without any evidence of the long-term results and if all hairs (from all over the body) are created equal. Let's just assume that all hair does grow, but which is the right type of hair to place in the hairline? We need more data and we need more long-term results and photos. How can we stake our collective reputation on BHT without further evidence? If you have seen considerably more convincing evidence, then please enlighten me as I presently am not comfortable.

 

2. What is the cost? It's rather well admitted that more body hair is required than head hair to achieve 'a similar level of density' (although I haven't truly seen a 'dense' BHT result to date, but still some marked improvements). What is the ratio? 1.5:1? 2:1? 3:1? And what is the cost?

 

Thanks - that's about all for now as I'm sure that is long enough and I'm sure I'll get some negative posts for this, but all I'm looking for is some solid evidence of a 'statistically significant' variety before we say that we recommend. Recommendation to me means consistent, high-quality, highly ethical results.

[wylie]

Originally posted by Dr. Alan Feller:

 

But you ask for it, you get it:

I repaired him in one session of 2500 grafts. One day procedure and very inexpensive compared to BHT.

 

 

There are no shortcuts to recommended status. To be put on the list your work must satisfy the AVERAGE patient on a consistent basis. None of yours compares to even mediocre strip results.

 

Not because YOU are flawed or unable. I happen to think you are quite capable and could be a great HT doctor. But as long as you use a flawed procedure like mega-FUE/BHT, you will never be able to offer results on par with mega-strip sessions. And as such should not qualify for recommended status.

 

Pat, I really hope you can look past this. It's bad enough Feller had to attack results that are clearly incredible for repair patients from previous butcherings, but then he had to post his own pictures and use it as the only "accepted" alternative for repair results.

 

The man is comparing apples to oranges in his argument and his arrogance prevents him from seeing this.

 

He has admittedly stated he has had no success with BHT and remains an ardent critic of something he neither can perform or seemingly can even understand. He then, arrogantly, stated that "most people are not on this forum needing these types of procedures".....How in the hell could Feller know this?

 

And I really loved this gem:

 

"If you want to compare your work to mine, as you stated in your post, no problem. I have the results of hundreds of my patients on this site and others, and they are all far superior to yours. "

 

Dr. Feller, you couldnt come CLOSE to taking on and fixing the butherings that Dr. Umar has already done, you wouldnt even know where to begin!

 

Pat, I hope you can judge accordingly what is best for your membership, as many, apparently unknown to Dr. Feller, do come to this forum looking for repairs. How many BHT specialists do you recommend? Well, it seems to me that Dr. Umar would be the first. His results are visible, apparent, and numerous, yet some think that he may be hiding something. FUE is real, tedious, and painstaking. Few can do it successfully. BHT is an exciting new advancement. Ignoring it wont make it any less viable.

 

Alot of people need more than the critics of Dr. Umar can offer, and not allowing him membership only does your membership a disservice, especially those in real need of repair.

[Pat - Community Publisher]

I appreciate everyone's impassioned input. M & M and Wylie, thanks for stepping in and interjecting some good points without jumping into the ring like an angry relative on the Jerry Springer Show.

 

I believe today's dramatic episode is wrapping up (It's now around 11pm on a Saturday night) and it's time for me to do my "Hairy Springer" impersonation.

 

Here goes:

 

Folks, we're all here to get hair not pull each others out. I think when the facts and issues are divorced from the personal attacks I see many genuine and passionate concerns.

 

I feel that strip and FUE both have a place as legitimate hair transplant options. Modern strip surgery is a proven cost effective method for restoring hair in the balding areas. It will leave a long and hopefully pencil thin scar that will be of no cosmestic concern to the patient. I know that has been true for me and hundreds of thousands of others.

 

Of course, many over the years have been left with scars in the back of the head that were as wide as 2 cm or even wider. Such scars are then a cosmetic issue. In even rarer cases the patient may have even experienced nerve damage. Fear of such scarring largely fueled the development and interest in FUE.

 

Fortunately, when performed by truly qualified physicians using optimal donor and closure techniques, cosmetically significant scarring from strip surgery has become rare.

 

FUE has certainly been proven to work. But personally I'm still not confident that it has as high a successful growth rate as strip surgery when done properly performed using microscopes. FUE also typically costs more for the amount of hair transplanted.

 

Many of the leading physicians recommended on this community offer both and patients and their chosen physician can decide which technique is best for them.

 

BHT (Body Hair Transplantation - body hair to head) is newer and, in my opinion, lacks the depth of evidence to fully determine its true rate of success both short term and long term.

 

However, I think all of us would like to believe that it will ultimately be successful. Clearly for some of Dr. Umar's patients it already has been life changing success.

 

However an enormous amount of work and tedious extraction was required to achieve these results.

 

I believe Dr. Umar is genuine in his commitment to making BHT a proven success. Perhaps his extensive experience he enabled him to now have a high rate of success in appropriately selected patients.

 

However, I think it is fair to error on the side of being conservative and give Dr. Umar and his patients more time to share evidence of both their successes and also the results that may not be as hoped for on this forum.

 

I hope that in the near future Dr. Umar, even without formally being recommended, garners patients from this forum who are appropriate candidates and yield great results.

 

I'm willing to be patient and I think this community is willing to be patient and watch and see as well. I trust that given Dr. Umar's strong belief in BHT and FUE that he will persist in continuing to present evidence of his work.

 

In the mean time, I would really appreciate Dr. Umar sharing his assessment of the success rate of his BHT procedures to date as well as the long term characteristics of his patients' hair and its typical growing cycles.

 

Let's all take a deep breath and relax and let the evidence continue to unfold. I look forward to learning much from Dr. Umar and his patients in the coming weeks.

 

So be good to each other out there and don't pull on each others hair, because all hair, body or scalp, is precious ;-)

 

Hairy Springer

[Bill - Seemiller]

I agree with Hairy Springer

 

Behind the personal attacks, there are some legitimate concerns posed that certainly demand an answer.

 

Given Dr. Umar's passion and believe in BHT and FUE, I believe he will address these concerns and continue to show evidence of his work.

 

The only solution to this quandry is to give it time for evidence to unfold and results to be demonstrated.

 

I trust that in the coming weeks, we will have more information and be able to make an educated decision on his potential recommendation.

 

Best wishes,

 

Bill

[Guest]

Originally posted by Dr. Alan Feller:

I appreciate it PGP, but there's no need to bother with this guy anymore. He's just another kook with an agenda.

 

I've made my points here about mega-FUE/BHT and I think that's enough.

 

The only point you successfully made is that you're frighteningly insecure.

It's actually embarrassing to see an obviously highly respected professional like yourself resort to childish insults and name-calling.

You'll never see Dr Umar responding to his detractors by lowering himself to that level.

He remains articulate and totally professional at all times.

Perhaps you should take a leaf out of his book?

[M&M]

folks, we're all here to get hair not pull each others out

 

 

I like that one! Pat - Thank you for the stand-up, long-term vision response. It is a testament to this site that you are listening to your members and leaning to the side of patience (and patients!).

 

Hopefully we see some long-term results in the near future.

[Dr. Timothy Carman]

Two cents:

Dr Umar is a class act. In addition to his skill as a surgeon, his professional demeanor and ethically-driven behavior was recognized and applauded at last years ISHRS meeting. An asset to our organization, he only strengthens the collective talents of the ISHRS. In my humble opinion, Dr Umar is very deserving of the "recommended" status here on the HTN.

Sincerely,

[Dr. Alan Feller]

Dr. Carman,

 

I must respectfully disagree.

 

Demeanor, ethically-driven behavior, and being a class act are not the criteria for recommended status on HTN.

 

A proven and demonstrated track record of top notch results is.

 

That's the whole point behind the recommendation list in the first place. It's a place for newbies to see at a glance those doctors who have demonstrated consistent success on average patients like themselves.

 

Sometimes stating the truth is unpopular and it obviously rubs many people the wrong way. The simple fact is that if you look at the very best results of any FUE/BHT doctor you will not find any results matching those of established recommended doctors like Dr. Shapiro, or Dr. Hasson, or Dr. Nakatsui, and many others.

 

Shouldn't that be the first and only criteria for recommendation?

 

It's not that Dr. Umar isn't professional or a nice guy. On the contrary, your glowing review after meeting him in person is good enough for me to conclude he is a gentleman.

However, the results he demonstrates on this thread are simply not up to the level of other doctors because he chooses to utilize an inferior procedure.

 

It is therefore not fair to either the other doctors who have achieved recommended status nor to the public to place such a practitioner on the list. Doesn't this make sense Dr. Carman?

[something]

Feller,

 

Weren't you asked politely to leave this thread?

 

There is a big difference between a coalition member and being recommended. Nobody is comparing Shapiro or Hasson to Umar. If they were, then the offer would be to invite him into the coalition.

 

there is a place for Dr Umar in the recommended list as far as my opinion is concerned because he provides a service that others Drs cant, in those individuals with very limited options.

[Sofarsogood]

Unbelievable.

I still can't believe this is an actual respected physician posting.

 

"Demeanor, ethically-driven behavior, and being a class act are not the criteria for recommended status on HTN." - Dr. Feller

 

 

CLEARLY this is true with one doc in this group.

 

 

"the results he demonstrates on this thread are simply not up to the level of other doctors because he chooses to utilize an inferior procedure." - Dr. Feller

 

 

Sell that to the repair patients documented here. Their reactions would be priceless.

 

Please tell us how you would go about repairing a patient with no head hair donor to work with because of "traditional HT methods"?

 

Nevermind, perhaps you've said enough on this.

 

I'll start another thread for your musings, pretty funny stuff in a tragic sort of way.

 

Thanks anyway.

[dakota3]

OMFG,

 

What the hell is wrong w/ you people! I would expect this out of posters such as myself or others, but Dr. Feller you need to calm down a little and realize that potential future patients are reading this thread and choosing other doc's because of your childish comments. I sure hope that you are'nt so cocky to think that people will look past comments like these when choosing a HT doc, especially when there are doc's out there that are considered just as good as you, if not better in some people's opinion

[Bill - Seemiller]

Dr. Feller,

 

Pat and I already stated above that we are going to give Dr. Umar more time to present his FUE and BHT results before we make an official decision on his recommendation. We've also asked him to address the concerns and questions of this community.

 

But people are entitled to form opinions that disagree with yours.

 

Your comments have been heard and I've alreadly asked you politely to leave this thread.

 

Please don't make me take more drastic actions.

 

Regards,

 

Bill

[PLEASE GROW PLEASE]

Bill thats the right thing to do . We will still point certain patients his way recommended or not . He has some dedicated posters that are happy but ALL docs have a handful . Im sure Dr Umar will be posting a bunch of photos very soon so theres no harm in waiting a little bit.

Im sure with all the botched jobs in the past hell be busy for awhile

Did Pat see a bunch of grownout pics when he was there?

[Dr. Alan Feller]

Excuse me Bill, when did I state or imply that people are not entitled to disagree with me? Is this not a forum for debate and discussion and open speech?

 

By asking me not to speak while you allow other anonymous posters to continue their rants and attacks is hardly fair. You should have locked the thread.

 

Why have you let posters like Something and Hooray attack me with ad homonym attacks? Have you read their disgusting posts? You should have deleted their posts or suspended their accounts for such behavior but you didn't. Do you honestly think the nasty posts they wrote about me were in good faith and germane to the discussion? I would think that as a moderator you would have put a stop to that. Instead you let it ratchet up.

 

This thread is about a very important topic. And as a member of this community, a paying member no less, I have been invited to speak out as is my right. Nothing I have said here was false, wrong, or untrue. What I said needed to be said and both you and Pat have endorsed it by deciding to rightfully hold off on recommendation. In fact, since I was the only voice of dissension I can only assume that your decision was based solely on my view points.

 

Am I now to understand that everyone else on this thread should be allowed to continue stressing and supporting their own views but that I alone am to be censored and gagged? Especially when I am the only voice of dissension?

 

If someone makes a post it is my understanding that it is everyone's right, including mine, to disagree. If chearleaders of FUE/BHT wish to continue edorsing their doctors, they should do it on another thread. This one is about a potential recommendation and any post written about such recommendation is open to retort. Isn't that what forums like this one are all about?

 

This thread went off track not because I expressed my views, but because you allowed deviant behavior and posting on the part of a few posters who just can't handle opposition and participate in a discussion of differing opinions.

[wylie]

I for one am glad that doctors undergo a thorough discussion by both supporters and detractors and that is absolutely essential to the health of this forum. I'm glad Dr. Feller has offered up his views and commend him for doing so.

 

But the bottom line is whether to vote in based on his performance, patient testimonials, and the overall opinion of the community at large. I also believe the one limiting factor working against Dr. Umar is lack of long term results.

 

Whether or not he performs strip surgeries, and requests for such results, is a silly request to ask for. This is stichless surgery, and it is all about utilizing more than scalp hair.

 

I do hope that this thread increases awareness of BHT cause, like it or not, it's not going to go away. To get one of the leading physicians in the world practicing this is a significant addition to the professional expertise available to the forums members.

[Pat - Community Publisher]

By asking me not to speak while you allow other anonymous posters to continue their rants and attacks is hardly fair. You should have locked the thread.

 

Why have you let posters like Something and Hooray attack me with ad homonym attacks? Have you read their disgusting posts? You should have deleted their posts or suspended their accounts for such behavior but you didn't. Do you honestly think the nasty posts they wrote about me were in good faith and germane to the discussion? I would think that as a moderator you would have put a stop to that. Instead you let it ratchet up.

 

Bill,

 

I happen to agree with Dr. Feller that when people are making personal attacks on him for sticking his neck out to express his reservations, he should be allowed to respond.

 

I do agree that some of the comments made by Something and Hooray, including quoting Dr. Feller out of context have been unfair and designed to provoke him. He had every right to defend himself.

 

This topic has deteriorated into personal attacks and needs to be closed at least until cool heads prevail.

 

Bottom line - Bill and I have asked Dr. Umar to provide this community with answers to the below questions:

 

We suggest Dr. Umar start a new discussion thread and thoroughly explain:

 

1. How the "Umar procedure" works and how it differs from techniques used by other surgeons.

2. Body hair growth cycles and their longevity when transplanted to the scalp.

3. How he qualifies candidates for surgery.

4. BHT success rates in his experience, including typical growth yield and overall success in the 150+ cases he's performed.

 

We look forward to an ongoing educational process that is free of personal attacks.