Hair Restoration Discussion Forum - By and For Hair Loss Patients
Go Back   Forum By and for Hair Loss Patients > Surgical Hair Restoration > Follicular Unit Extraction (FUE)

Welcome! This forum has over 180,000 posts and 12,000 before and after photos going back several years. To research a topic or physician, click on "Search" and enter the name.

You are currently a guest with limited access. By joining our FREE community you can post on this forum, reply privately to other members and or create your own profile, blog and photo album. Registration is easy, private and free so Join Today!

If you have any problems with the registration or login process, please contact us. If you are new please visit our FAQ.

Follicular Unit Extraction (FUE) Discuss and share your photos, experiences and results related to the Follicular Unit Extraction (FUE) hair transplant procedure, including its advantages, disadvantages and who is an ideal candidate.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #291   Top  
Old 08-10-2017, 04:57 PM
tofur's Avatar
Member
Veteran Real Hair Club Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 52
Last Online: 09-14-2017 03:58 PM
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bverotti View Post
My experience as a Former FUT and FUE patient:


The best decision you can make is to have an FUE procedure.

An FUT will cause more damage to your donor area, period. Oh, just look beneath the scarline, you will very often see the remaining grafts are of FAR less quality because of FUT harvesting. So FUT often WEAKENS the donor area for future usage.

Forget about the internet hype and the trolling and look at the two procedures:

FUE is a blind procedure that rips the graft from the scalp. FUT is a equally blind as it destroys the FU along the cutting line.

FUT is a fully visualized procedure that allows for dissection of the grafts with the least amount of trauma known to man. Yes, but you would have to trust on a lot of techs getting it done right. No surgeon in the world can watch over all these techs at the same time. So in the end the Surgeon has NO idea how many grafts where damaged.

It's no contest. Indeed, FUE is least invasive method and should be prefered for this reason alone, along with many other reasons.

Oh, and all the records of most grafts transplanted are ... indeed all FUE cases!


FUT is the gold standard. Used to be, sorry. Diesel and petrol cars still the gold standard, only because it is cheaper .. but dirty at the same time. Take away cost and people will be driving electric cars forever.



FUE is internet hype. Yes, and there are so many good reasons it is hyped. ONe of the reasons is that many surgeons have done a lot of dammage using FUT (even the good docs out there).

FUE is not 'perfect', but it is really the best option available out there for the moment.
Not even remotely surprised to see you're a shill for a FUE only clinic in Belgium. If FUE was so great why do you have to blatantly lie and exaggerate to make it seem that way?
Reply With Quote
  #292   Top  
Old 08-10-2017, 07:09 PM
jbl2093's Avatar
Senior Member
Guru Real Hair Club Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 370
Last Online: Yesterday 01:53 PM
Default

I've had both as well. But I've seen photos that show the area beneath the scar is markedly thinner as result of the strip excision. DR. FELLER, what do you think of that statement ?

Last edited by jbl2093; 08-10-2017 at 07:23 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #293   Top  
Old 08-10-2017, 07:44 PM
Dr. Alan Feller's Avatar
Senior Member
Celestial Follicle Club Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Great Neck, NY
Posts: 2,101
Last Online: 08-19-2017 09:48 AM
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jbl2093 View Post
I've had both as well. But I've seen photos that show the area beneath the scar is markedly thinner as result of the strip excision. DR. FELLER, what do you think of that statement ?
The statement is a non-starter. Sure, there can be donor thinning under the scar but it is usually just within the first weeks to months just after surgery and normally completely resolves on it's own. I may see this phenomenon once in every 30 surgeries and none have been permanent.

It is the donor thinning from FUE that is aggressive, permanent, and often the subject of online posts from unhappy FUE patients.

__________________
Feller Medical, PC
Great Neck, NY

Dr. Alan Feller is a member of the Coalition of Independent Hair Restoration Physicians

Providing FUT, FUE, and mFUE
Reply With Quote
  #294   Top  
Old 08-10-2017, 08:00 PM
jbl2093's Avatar
Senior Member
Guru Real Hair Club Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 370
Last Online: Yesterday 01:53 PM
Default

Thanks!
Reply With Quote
  #295   Top  
Old 08-11-2017, 06:40 AM
Gasthoerer's Avatar
Senior Member
Hard Core Real Hair Club Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 187
Last Online: Today 02:12 AM
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. Alan Feller View Post

Sure, there can be donor thinning under the scar but it is usually just within the first weeks to months just after surgery and normally completely resolves on it's own. I may see this phenomenon once in every 30 surgeries and none have been permanent.

It is the donor thinning from FUE that is aggressive, permanent, and often the subject of online posts from unhappy FUE patients.

Sorry, I didn't want to involve before I had my 2nd assessment with the clinic which recommended FUE to me and ask the questions we have discussed forth and back.

But I have to step in here.
For the record:

Dr. Feller, do you say that there is typically (!) no (long term) donor thinning with strip? If yes, pleas explain how this is mathematically possible.

And yes, I am well aware that thinning with FUE is much worse. That is not my point. But there has to be donor thinning with strip or donor area has to shrink 1:1 with the width of the strip and the recipient has to enlarge. The latter was partly denied by you before if I remember correctly.
Reply With Quote
  #296   Top  
Old 08-11-2017, 07:53 AM
bverotti's Avatar
Senior Member
Mentor Real Hair Club Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Antwerp, Belgium
Posts: 442
Last Online: 08-11-2017 08:19 AM
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. Alan Feller View Post
I'm afraid the entirety of your post is misinformed.

FUE does not hold the record for most grafts implanted, FUT does by a wide wide margin:
You are being fooled by the fact that FUE clinics misleadingly use the term "in one procedure" to refer to multiple days of surgery, whereas FUT clinics always mean a single day.

In order to approach the density and growth success of FUT, FUE doctors NEED to take more grafts to make up for the lower yields and thinner hair shafts. FUT doctors have no such disadvantage and thus fewer grafts are needed by comparison.

Furthermore, when FUE megasessions are performed almost all of them take hair from OUTSIDE the safe donor areas. FUT practitioners do not need to.

You are correct that there are bad FUT procedures out there. But almost all of them were performed by amateur practitioners seeking to perform HT on a part time basis. That's why patients NEED to look for clinics that perform FUT fulltime and have a full staff. Unfortunately, many patients find out AFTER their procedure that their clinic was amateur.

FUE has it's place, but only for smaller procedures or AFTER the strip procedure can no longer be performed.

And your statement about FUT techs is also incorrect. Of course there is some wastage during dissection, but orders of magnitude less than FUE. Furthermore, none of the FUT grafts get traumatized whereas ALL FUE grafts are traumatized all the time. Then you have to pray that the grafts tolerated the FUE procedure and hope they grow. This is why FUE yields and results are poorer compared to FUT and why so many more grafts are needed to achieve the same results.

The public is getting wise to the realities of FUE megasessions.
Hi Dr. Feller,
I respect your opinion, and I must assume that they are based your your skills.

I have personally witnessed many FUE sessions with no or less then 3 percent transections. And this not only at Prohairclinic, but also at other world class Belgian clinics.

So let's agree to disagree, that is fine.

I am not looking for the LW.

bart
__________________
Consultant-co owner Prohairclinic (FUE only) in Belgium, Dr. De Reys.
Reply With Quote
  #297   Top  
Old 08-11-2017, 11:42 AM
Dr. Alan Feller's Avatar
Senior Member
Celestial Follicle Club Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Great Neck, NY
Posts: 2,101
Last Online: 08-19-2017 09:48 AM
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bverotti View Post
Hi Dr. Feller,
I respect your opinion, and I must assume that they are based your your skills.

I have personally witnessed many FUE sessions with no or less then 3 percent transections. And this not only at Prohairclinic, but also at other world class Belgian clinics.

So let's agree to disagree, that is fine.

I am not looking for the LW.

bart
I'm sorry Bart, I can't agree to disagree.

What I wrote was not opinion-but clinical fact based on 17 years experience in FUE and 23 years experience with FUT.

What you wrote was simply not true or confusing at best.

The word "transection" is used very loosely by the FUE community and it's time that it stopped.

FUE clinics seem to want the public to believe that transection is the only injury visited upon a graft during FUE surgery. But this is not true. The damage from the twisting, compression, and yanking of partially freed FUE grafts inflicts damage in far greater numbers than transection does AND it is invisible to the eye.

If it is your contention that all FUE grafts that appear intact (not transected) grow as well as FUT grafts then you are sadly mistaken. If you were a doctor and actually performed the FUE procedure you could appreciate the amount of force and trauma applied to the graft to get them out of MOST patients. When I say "most" I mean the vast majority of patients meaning 85%. Probably higher.

If FUE clinics started to use the more accurate "Damaged Graft" percentage instead of the so-called "Transected Graft" percentage the public would understand the true and unpredictable nature of the FUE procedure and few would take the gamble to have it performed on them if the gold standard of FUT were available.

In the United States patients must be given informed consent. Failure to disclose the" graft damage percentage" while offering only the "graft transection rate" would be failure to give informed consent and would seriously threaten that doctors license. It would also be grounds for civil action. This is why you don't see "hair mills" and "FUE mills" in the United States. In fact, you see almost no FUE- only clinics at all in the United States for this reason.

As I recall, years ago you sent a few doctors to Dr. Jones to learn the FUE techniques Dr. Jones and I developed together. I'm in contact with Dr. Jones on a regular basis and nothing significant has changed in that time on his end. Nor mine. Nor anybody else's as far as I know. Are you claiming that your current staff of doctors are performing FUE significantly different from what Dr. Jones and I developed and passed onto your doctors ? If so, how does it significantly differ ?
__________________
Feller Medical, PC
Great Neck, NY

Dr. Alan Feller is a member of the Coalition of Independent Hair Restoration Physicians

Providing FUT, FUE, and mFUE
Reply With Quote
  #298   Top  
Old 08-12-2017, 06:52 AM
Gasthoerer's Avatar
Senior Member
Hard Core Real Hair Club Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 187
Last Online: Today 02:12 AM
Default

Dr. Feller as you came up with it, I would appreciate if you could answer my request for clarification for the sake of education of the forum members.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gasthoerer View Post
For the record:

Dr. Feller, do you say that there is typically (!) no (long term) donor thinning with strip? If yes, please explain how this is mathematically possible.

And yes, I am well aware that thinning with FUE is much worse.
Well, I have a hard time understanding your new comment as well. Where does this 85 % come from? A study or guessing from your side? What does it mean? In 15 % of all patients FUE grafts are as healthy as FUT grafts? Is assume that is not black and white, but there is a big grey area (where grafts are only slightly/partly worse with FUE to FUT), or am I misled?

And how do US doctors (or yourself) give information about “damaged grafts” with FUE if the damage is unvisible according to your words? You just guess a number? Or you tell before an average number? If so, which number do you give?

I also fail to understand what this has to do with FUE mills in the US. There are no FUE mills cause technicans aren’t allowed to do the majority of the work.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. Alan Feller View Post
The damage from the twisting, compression, and yanking of partially freed FUE grafts inflicts damage in far greater numbers than transection does AND it is invisible to the eye.

If it is your contention that all FUE grafts that appear intact (not transected) grow as well as FUT grafts then you are sadly mistaken… When I say "most" I mean the vast majority of patients meaning 85%. Probably higher.


In the United States patients must be given informed consent. Failure to disclose the" graft damage percentage" while offering only the "graft transection rate" would be failure to give informed consent and would seriously threaten that doctors license. …

This is why you don't see "hair mills" and "FUE mills" in the United States. In fact, you see almost no FUE- only clinics at all in the United States for this reason.
Thank you for clarification.
Reply With Quote
  #299   Top  
Old 08-12-2017, 07:03 PM
Dr. Alan Feller's Avatar
Senior Member
Celestial Follicle Club Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Great Neck, NY
Posts: 2,101
Last Online: 08-19-2017 09:48 AM
Default

After reading Bverotti's post Dr. Bloxham and I began a discussion between ourselves about how confused people are about the realities of FUE surgery. So we decided to film it and share it online. If any FUE doctor cares to chime in, please do.
Dr. Alan Feller

Feller and Bloxham Medical, PC
Great Neck, NY
NYC Hair Transplant | NY Hair Restoration | Feller & Bloxham Medical

__________________
Feller Medical, PC
Great Neck, NY

Dr. Alan Feller is a member of the Coalition of Independent Hair Restoration Physicians

Providing FUT, FUE, and mFUE
Reply With Quote
  #300   Top  
Old 08-13-2017, 10:26 AM
Dr. Alan Feller's Avatar
Senior Member
Celestial Follicle Club Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Great Neck, NY
Posts: 2,101
Last Online: 08-19-2017 09:48 AM
Default

And here are videos shot specifically to present what FUT scars really look like. Not the rare and shocking scars that FUE clinics mislead people into believing are common.

The scar results we show are representative of the TRUE typical strip scar.

All of the skin above and below the scar are completely untouched and undamaged. When FUE is performed, in contrast, the entire donor area is damaged well beyond necessity and limits the numbers of grafts available for future use.



Feller and Bloxham Hair Transplant
Great Neck, NY
http://www.fellermedical.com
__________________
Feller Medical, PC
Great Neck, NY

Dr. Alan Feller is a member of the Coalition of Independent Hair Restoration Physicians

Providing FUT, FUE, and mFUE
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:28 AM.